How many great-good QBs have we ever had?

[Terry Glenn is a cowgirl]

Re: How many great-good qb we ever had ?

I'm also wondering why Michael Bishop was left off this list.

Same as Flutie...

 

[Terry Glenn is a cowgirl]

If Plunkett and Flutie are in, why not Gannon?

 

[jmt57]

No matter how you define 'good' or 'great', the list has to be short since there are only five players who were the starting QB for the Pats for more than three years (Parilli, Plunkett, Grogan, Bledsoe, Brady), one for three years (Eason), and two for two years (Hugh Millen, Butch Songin - and neither of them are going to make this list.)

Flutie can't really be considered in my opinion because his good-greatness happened elsewhere; he only started a total of 13 games at QB with the Pats.

If you are going to compare players from different eras, such as Parilli and Plunkett, keep in mind how the passing game has changed - specifically what the defense can and cannot do. Rather than looking at numbers like passing yards or completion percentage, a better gauge is how they ranked against their contemporaries.

Parilli was good but not great. Here is how he fared against his contemporaries:
1961: 1st in pass completion %; 2nd (best) in interception %, passer rating, td %
1962: 1st (best) int %; 2nd td %, completion %, passer rating, yds/pass attempt; 3rd in passing td, comp/game (14 - think about that!)
1963: 1st team all-pro and pro-bowl; perhaps in recognition for the previous season; yards/pass (2nd) was the only positive ranking.
1964: A pro bowl and 1st in passing yards, passing td's, passing yards per game - and interceptions.
1965: 2nd in passing yards and passing yards per game.

Those are the positives, but here are the negatives:
'63-67: no better than 5th in completion %, 4th in int %, 4th in yards/attempt, or 4th in passer rating - remember, the AFL had only 8 teams through '65 and 9 in '66-'67. Parilli was Favre-esque in this time, leading the league in int's once and finishing in the top three for most int's for five straight years.

As far as Plunkett goes, he was on some very bad teams, which skew his stats. He was sacked at least 36 times in each of his first three seasons in an era when teams passed less often and the season was two games shorter than it is now. He was beat up so badly with the Pats and 49ers that he needed essentially two years off before he was useful again, having a few very good seasons with the Raiders. Obviously not in the 'great' category, but he was better than his 23-38 won-loss record would indicate; the team's problems at that time were at other positions than QB.

 

[Patriots Nation NY]

Heeellllooo .. Scott Secules I don't see anywhere ..

 

[NoCal Patriot]

now that we are talking in the last period about Cassel or O'Connell or Gutierrez: in approx 50 years how many great-good qb we had overall ?

in my opinion: Brady, Bledsoe, Eason, Grogan, Parilli, Plunkett, Flutie.

let's say 7 in 48 years ?

between great and good

My list of Good/Great Quarterbacks are Babe Parilli,Jim Plunkett,Steve Grogan,
Drew Bledsoe and The best of The Best ,Tom Brady
We will agree to disagree on Tony Eason ,My Friend.Tony Eason was the only Quarterback in Patriots History that played scared.Courage is required for greatness.
The most under rated on this list is Jim Plunkett.If He had the likes of Moss , Welker, and Belichick,,He would be right there with Brady as His two Super Bowl Rings says that I'm right.

 

[patsfan-1982]

My list of Good/Great Quarterbacks are Babe Parilli,Jim Plunkett,Steve Grogan,
Drew Bledsoe and The best of The Best ,Tom Brady
We will agree to disagree on Tony Eason ,My Friend.Tony Eason was the only Quarterback in Patriots History that played scared.Courage is required for greatness.
The most under rated on this list is Jim Plunkett.If He had the likes of Moss , Welker, and Belichick,,He would be right there with Brady as His two Super Bowl Rings says that I'm right.

if bledsoe had WR like moss and welker and the tuna or BB as he's HC he's whole Career he would have win 2 ring's to he's best receiver was ben coates a TE terry glenn was all way's hurt but tom brady won 3 ring's with out any big time receiver's

 

[LuthierJr]

Brady and Bledsoe stand head and shoulders above the rest imo. Gotta love Grogan though.

 

[nashvillepatsfan]

Re: How many great-good qb we ever had ?

Some people just tend to romanticize good to great when it comes to the team they followed back in the day...even to the extent of pining for outdated unforms.

.lol. Thats cold MO.

 

[italian pat patriot]

Re: How many great-good QBs have we ever had ?

flutie was a good NFL QB but was never more then a back up for the pats so i would not put him on the list

eason was 28-21 as a starting QB with the pats and is 6th all time on the patriots passing list with 10732 yard's 60 TD 48 INT great no good maybe


babe parilli was 44-32-7 as a starting QB for the pats and is 4th on the patriots all time passing list with 16747 yard's 132 TD 138 INT good maybe great no


jim plunkett was 23-38 as a starting QB for the pats and is 5th on the patriots all time passing list with 9932 yard's 62 TD 87 INT he had his best year's with oakland is was not a good QB for the pats


Steve Grogan was 75-60 as a starting QB for the pats and is 3rd all time on the patriots passing list with 26886 yard's 182 TD 208 INT and hold's the NFL racord for most rushing TD in a season by a QB 1976 12 TD and he played his whole Career with the pats (good yes great maybe )


Drew Bledsoe was 63-60 as a starting QB for the pats and is first on the patriots list with 29657 yard's 166 TD 138 INT and is 8th all time on the NFL list with 44611 yard's GOOD yes GREAT will at time's was one of the best QB in the NFL i would say yes he is great


tom brady is 87-24 as a starting QB for the pats and is #2 on the patriots all time passing list with 26446 yard's he will be #1 aftter this season and is first with 197 TD 86 INT he has 3 ring's and is the only ture great QB in patriots history

nice and interesting comments on yr post

on Brady, of course, everyone agree

on all the others there are always some differents point of view

for example i will be always grateful i.e to Drew Bledsoe too; on Eason i would say he was very talented (he could have done much more for sure but still 3 good seasons)

Grogan i consider him a warrior

on Parilli i'm not able to give an opinion due to the fact that we are talking about many many years ago

Flutie and Plunkett made their best not in Pats uniform

and, yes, 1 good year from Matt Cassel now

 

[mgteich]

Most seem to be listing all the QB's who played for more than three years for the pats. Dor me, this isn't really close. Grogan is always a sentimental favorite. However, the patriots have had only two top QB's play for us: Brady and Bledsoe. I agree with another poster that Bledsoe would likely have had a couple of rings if he had Moss and Welker.

 

[Patriot_in_NY]

As many have already said, it's hard to answer this without qualification. Obviously Plunkett, Flutie, Testicleverde all wore the Pats uniform, but the good/great argument for them doesn't really consider their time here, with Plunkett being probably the only arguable case since he does have numbers here (mediocre at best).

As for the others.

Babe and Eason - ehhhhhh, serviceable, and possible good. Certainly not great. Although Eason has a special place in my heart by guiding them to the "big show" during his tenure (even if to just get smacked by Da Bears). Still, history dictates that he was okay-good at best.

Grogan - Good for me, not great. I loved him, because it was these years that really drove me to the Pats, so there is a special place for him in my heart too. Sentimentality aside, he's in the good column, does not approach great.

Bledsoe - Looking primarily at his numbers here, I put him in the Very Good to "at times" Great category. He sure threw a purdy pass in his day. Again, I may be overrating him because I tend to remember him guiding us out of the abyss of the early 90's. Football became fun to watch again when he came in. Again, bringing us to the "big show" helps with my memories too . I also tend to give him a pass for his later years here. I blame the coaching and management more for moving the system outside what he was (a set in stone pocket passer). Had they kept the system to his strength (and brought in players that fit it - O-LINE, WRs), he still had some productivity left in him here. His skills deteriorated after leaving here, but the "better" QB of his early career stands out the most for me as I look back.

Brady............ is the G.O.A.T..... He is a man among boys. There is no disputing that.

 

[everlong]

New England Patriots Career Passing Register - Pro-Football-Reference.com

Looking at the numbers it's amazing how average Bledsoe was especially when stacked against Brady and his numbers aren't that much better than Grogan and he played with more weapons.

 

[Patriot_in_NY]

New England Patriots Career Passing Register - Pro-Football-Reference.com

Looking at the numbers it's amazing how average Bledsoe was especially when stacked against Brady and his numbers aren't that much better than Grogan and he played with more weapons.

He also played against better Defenses. The 90's was really started the move D's to speed. Grogan also threw a TON of INTs. Also, for his first 5-6 years, Bledsoe's sacks were were pretty average (low 30's, against TFB high 20's ave.). His last 2 years, it jumps to 50 per season, so that skews the numbers for me. His numbers pale in comparison to TFB, but I think that are better then Grogan's, particularly in his earlier years.

 

[LiveShot]

Tony Eason was not a great quarterback. If he had a backbone he may have been.

 

[Deus Irae]

Tony Eason was not a great quarterback. If he had a backbone he may have been.

Poor Tony. He'll forever be the tin woodsman of NFL quarterbacks.

 

[italian pat patriot]

Although Eason has a special place in my heart by guiding them to the "big show" during his tenure (even if to just get smacked by Da Bears). Still, history dictates that he was okay-good at best.

i agree with you: this is what i feel too about Tony Eason

 

[godef]

now that we are talking in the last period about Cassel or O'Connell or Gutierrez: in approx 50 years how many great-good qb we had overall ?

in my opinion: Brady, Bledsoe, Eason, Grogan, Parilli, Plunkett, Flutie.

let's say 7 in 48 years ?

between great and good

Do you mean great QB's that played for the Pats, or QB's that played great for that Pats? Strictly NFL?

On the one hand, Plunkett did not have any great years with the Pats; his pro fame came after the fact. OTOH, there's Joe Kapp that was arguably a great QB, but stunk up the joint when he came to the Boston Patriots.

I dare say I don't think Flutie should be included; IMHO he was never more than a decent QB in the NFL.

 

[italian pat patriot]

Cassel at n.6 ?

 

[RayClay]

Plunkett was a good QB here. Rookie of the year. He eventually got battered and the team sucked, but good.

Eason was good. Extremely talented, as good a touch on his passes as anyone i can think of. Two testicles from being great.

I'd even give Hugh Millen borderline good on a crap team. Over 60% completion percentage.

Only Brady's great, with Grogan, Bledsoe, Parilli, Flutie, Cassell, good to very good.

Mark Wilson, Joe Kapp, Mike Taliaferro, John Huarte lead the bad parade off the top of my head.

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

Plunkett was a good QB here. Rookie of the year. He eventually got battered and the team sucked, but good.

Eason was good. Extremely talented, as good a touch on his passes as anyone i can think of. Two testicles from being great.

I'd even give Hugh Millen borderline good on a crap team. Over 60% completion percentage.

b]Only Brady's great, with Grogan, Bledsoe, Parilli, Flutie,Cassell,good to very good.

Mark Wilson, Joe Kapp, Mike Taliaferro, John Huarte lead the bad parade off the top of my head.

Cassel had a cinderella season, but no one knows exactly what they have there and if they do,it will now be up to KC to see if they got a dud or a decent QB.

I would not even mention Cassel in this discussion - 1 season or shall we say 15 3/4 games hardly is reason to put him anywhere on this list.

Its like saying Ted Washington was in the top 3 history of Pats NTs