Have the Pats already addressed the O-line issues??

[Ring 6]

Yes.

Not buying that as the reason the players couldn't block.

 

[RobertWeathers]

I think we need a STARTER AND a JAG to compete with those 3 for the other spot.

I'm not there yet. If they are sucking eggs in camp and after Scar has had a long look at them you may be right.

 

[Ring 6]

I'm not there yet. If they are sucking eggs in camp and after Scar has had a long look at them you may be right.

Why NOT do that?
Would you agree the biggest risk we have of not being a SB contender is that the OL plays like it did in the last 6 games?
Can we really bank our season on hoping they magically improve?
Why wouldn't we get a starter? If they do improve they can play ahead of him, if they don't thank God we got him.
By the way, we need BOTH to improve, and both were among the worst starting Gs in the NFL.

 

[JackBauer]

Solder also happens to be the only OL we have the roster who is above average, and Vollmer is the only other one that is not below average or bad.

This seems like an overly pessimistic assessment. Just my $.02.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Why NOT do that?
Would you agree the biggest risk we have of not being a SB contender is that the OL plays like it did in the last 6 games?
Can we really bank our season on hoping they magically improve?
Why wouldn't we get a starter? If they do improve they can play ahead of him, if they don't thank God we got him.
By the way, we need BOTH to improve, and both were among the worst starting Gs in the NFL.

If Shaq and Jackson are sucking in camp they absolutely need to trade for a starting - caliber OG

 

[aluminum seats]

Not buying that as the reason the players couldn't block.

It's silly to dismiss what was by all accounts an abysmal coaching job last year. The offensive line, maybe more than any other aspect of a team, relies on coaching, communication and cohesion (a lot of alliteration there).

You're looking worst-case scenario across-the-board, when there's quite a bit of room for optimism.

 

[Ring 6]

It's silly to dismiss what was by all accounts an abysmal coaching job last year. The offensive line, maybe more than any other aspect of a team, relies on coaching, communication and cohesion (a lot of alliteration there).

You're looking worst-case scenario across-the-board, when there's quite a bit of room for optimism.

It is more silly to dismiss OL not being able to block one on one by blaming it on the coach.

Of course I am looking at the worst case scenario because the OL cost a Championship. Why would we take the worst piece of the team, and just hope it gets better?
What if its bad players and the coaching excuse doesn't stick?

 

[aluminum seats]

What if its bad players and the coaching excuse doesn't stick?

Belichick fired the coach, which suggests a reasonable probability that the "coaching excuse" is valid.

You're also apparently dismissing a truly awful injury situation last year, the frequency with which rookies take a step up in year 2, the strong rookie season of Stork sidetracked by injury in year 2, etc. It's not simply "hoping" things will be better, it's thinking that logically they will.

 

[JMC00]

Brady can't take another year like that, and nor do i

So your done with this team if the OL has a rash of injuries again?

Well I know what color hat you wear

 

[Ring 6]

Belichick fired the coach, which suggests a reasonable probability that the "coaching excuse" is valid.

You're also apparently dismissing a truly awful injury situation last year, the frequency with which rookies take a step up in year 2, the strong rookie season of Stork sidetracked by injury in year 2, etc. It's not simply "hoping" things will be better, it's thinking that logically they will.

Belichick did not renew the coach. Are we saying Patrick Graham sucked too?

Awful injury situation?
The only OL out for the AFCCG was Solder. Unless you count Jackson who was benched for poor play.

I watched the interior OL play and it gave me little logical hope.
They were bad football players.

Perhaps they will improve.

My point is I wouldn't count on it and risk it costing us another Championship, and you seem to be arguing, what the hell, lets do nothing and see what happens.

 

[Ring 6]

So your done with this team if the OL has a rash of injuries again?

Well I know what color hat you wear

Solder may have had a rash as well, but he was the only guy we will have next year that was injured for the AFCCG

 

[Ring 6]

If Shaq and Jackson are sucking in camp they absolutely need to trade for a starting - caliber OG

There is no contact in camp. We found out in 2014 that BB considers the first 4 games what camp used to be.
There will not be anyone available by the time we find out they still suck.

Why would we hestitate to sign a starting caliber G to set the bar for where they have to improve to in order to play? I don't understand why people are fighting a step to improve the team and limit the risk of having a horrendous weakness all over again.
What am I missing? Why are we not allowed to have players compete against the guys who sucked?

 

[Ring 6]

Solder may have had a rash as well, but he was the only guy we will have next year that was injured for the AFCCG

JMC00, how are you disagreeing with this statement?

 

[JMC00]

Solder may have had a rash as well, but he was the only guy we will have next year that was injured for the AFCCG

Yep Vollmer was clearly 100% with that ankle. Kline was clearly a 100% with his shoulder. Jackson wasn't injured and didn't miss both playoff games. Yep OL was completely healthy in the playoffs.

Jog on....

 

[Ring 6]

Yep Vollmer was clearly 100% with that ankle. Kline was clearly a 100% with his shoulder. Jackson wasn't injured and didn't miss both playoff games. Yep OL was completely healthy in the playoffs.

Jog on....

Vollmer was at his typical level of health over the last 5 years.
Kline was no more injured than 90% of the OL playing every week.
Jackson was injured, but he was benched for sucking before that.

That is not a rash of injuries, its 2 guys banged up a bit, and a backup inactive whether for injury or ineffectiveness. Jackson would have been a healthy inactive.

 

[aluminum seats]

Belichick did not renew the coach. Are we saying Patrick Graham sucked too?

You're coming dangerously close to seeming troll-y here. You can't really be suggesting that bringing back a guy who was retired means anything other than poor OL coaching.

Awful injury situation?
The only OL out for the AFCCG was Solder. Unless you count Jackson who was benched for poor play.

You can't possibly be questioning the effect of injuries on the line last year.

My point is I wouldn't count on it and risk it costing us another Championship, and you seem to be arguing, what the hell, lets do nothing and see what happens.

No, I'm not arguing that. The team should always look for upgrades and to keep the talent pipeline full. What I'm arguing is that the line as constituted, with better health, coaching, and experience next year, is not nearly as dire as you think.

 

[JMC00]

You're coming dangerously close to seeming troll-y here. You can't really be suggesting that bringing back a guy who was retired means anything other than poor OL coaching.


You can't possibly be questioning the effect of injuries on the line last year.



No, I'm not arguing that. The team should always look for upgrades and to keep the talent pipeline full. What I'm arguing is that the line as constituted, with better health, coaching, and experience next year, is not nearly as dire as you think.

Doom and gloom.. They are focused on how it looked at the end with injuries and not how it looked at the beginning before injuries when the Pats were putting 30+ on the board every week..

 

[PatsFanSince74]

Does anybody who knows a lot more than I do about how the game is actually played "between the lines," have an opinion about the role that the Strength and Conditioning program might have played in these injuries?

They fired Nash pretty quickly and the stats say that, during the five years that he was in charge of Strength and Conditioning, the Pats had the third highest level of injuries in the League, losing a total of 1,082 games to injury. Based on the stats in DaBruinz OP, the O Line alone lost 51 Regular Season games to injuries last season.

Thanks.

 

[Ring 6]

You're coming dangerously close to seeming troll-y here. You can't really be suggesting that bringing back a guy who was retired means anything other than poor OL coaching.

They chose not to retain the OL coach, and they chose not to retain Graham.
The fact that you want to stretch that out to be the excuse for crappy play by the OLineman is that trolling.

Its fine though. I prefer that we get better players than the ones we failed with and you want to keep them and blame their coach. We see it differently. Not sure why that makes you upset.

You can't possibly be questioning the effect of injuries on the line last year.

Except for Solder the projected starting OL if we make no moves played in the AFCCG which was possibly the worst game by an OL in the BB era.
I get that there were injuries during the season, and if they played well when healthy, I'd be fine. But they didn't.

No, I'm not arguing that. The team should always look for upgrades and to keep the talent pipeline full. What I'm arguing is that the line as constituted, with better health, coaching, and experience next year, is not nearly as dire as you think.

I am afraid of the OL we have.
I cannot fathom how anyone would think it is good enough after watching the last month and a half of the season.

I say we have:
Above average LT in Solder (who had an injury that has a high recurrence rate)
Average RT in Vollmer (who is injury prone and declining quickly)
No other player on the OL who is at least average.

Which do you dispute?
Is it really a bad thing to get average or above players at positions where you have no one who is not below average?

 

[IllegalContact]

You're coming dangerously close to seeming troll-y here. You can't really be suggesting that bringing back a guy who was retired means anything other than poor OL coaching.

it's not trolling........that level of misery is totally legit for him

the caveat is in the fact that he's wrong