Has Tim Tebow earned a roster spot on the Patriots?

[Suddyfan]

Sorry about the reliving thing.


To me, TOP is somewhat over rated when you have a high powered offense like the Pats do. Other team takes 10 mins to drive down the field and punt, Brady comes in and scores in 2 mins. TOP is 10-2 in favor of the other team, but the score is 7-0 in favor of the Pats. Rinse, repeat.

A great example of this is the playoff game against Denver. Denver had the ball for 33:23 minutes while the Pats had it for 26:37. We all know the outcome of that game.

I've gone round and round with SB1 on this one. I don't look at total yards when rating defenses. Last I looked, the game is decided by the number of points on the scoreboard. Defenses that limit the other teams points = good. Defenses that give up lots of points = not good.

That said, great defenses will limit points AND shut down most teams at the crucial times. I definitely wouldn't say that the Pats defense was great at the end of 2011, but it was much better than many of you all give it credit for.

of course or it wouldn't fit in the nifty little "history" of Tebow in 2011. Truth is he was atrocious in that game, no debating that and it was against a team that gave up an average of 293 passing yards per game in 2011.

Why is it so hard for you to admit that maybe the Steelers were banged up and with clark missing maybe just maybe it was a little easier than it might otherwise have been and conversely the patriots not-so-good-defense did a good job against tebow.

Its really ok for you to admit he just plain sucked that day. He did have other good days.

 

[Kontradiction]

of course or it wouldn't fit in the nifty little "history" of Tebow in 2011. Truth is he was atrocious in that game, no debating that and it was against a team that gave up an average of 293 passing yards per game in 2011.

Why is it so hard for you to admit that maybe the Steelers were banged up and with clark missing maybe just maybe it was a little easier than it might otherwise have been and conversely the patriots not-so-good-defense did a good job against tebow.

Its really ok for you to admit he just plain sucked that day. He did have other good days.

Dan Orlovsky and Rex Grossman lit that pass defense up. It was the second worst pass defense of all time to that point. Just absolutely god awful.

 

[Suddyfan]

Ummm, in 2011, the Steelers were top ranked in points allowed iirc.

and?

Still doesn't change the fact that you refuse to admit he was just plain horrible against a suspect Pats defense.

again I say, you cant have it both ways... either you give credit for tebow beating the steelers and accept that he was horrid against the pats or you have to accept the fact that maybe the injuries, missing players and the coach had something to do with his beating the steelers and then you can say the pats weren't as bad as everyone says.

You change the narrative in the attempt to shine the best light on Tebow as possible.

He beat the #1 Defense!
Patriots were really a lot better than you think!

When in reality it was more like; the #1 defense suffered 2 big losses on the d line, clark couldn't play because it could have killed him and little ****ie l screwed up by not thinking tebow could throw an accurate pass over 15 feet and the Patriots had a very good game plan for tebow and executed it very well.

 

[Ironman44]

of course or it wouldn't fit in the nifty little "history" of Tebow in 2011. Truth is he was atrocious in that game, no debating that and it was against a team that gave up an average of 293 passing yards per game in 2011.

Why is it so hard for you to admit that maybe the Steelers were banged up and with clark missing maybe just maybe it was a little easier than it might otherwise have been and conversely the patriots not-so-good-defense did a good job against tebow.

Its really ok for you to admit he just plain sucked that day. He did have other good days.

In regards to the Steelers game , Kuper was out, Moreno was out, Dawkins was out, Decker went out, Miller was hurt, Larsen was out, Vaughn was out....BOTH TEAMS WERE REALLY BANGED UP, its called football, stop giving the Squealers excuses (not to say anything about the fact that Harrison, and Palomalu and Woodley were on the field and getting smoked) ....yes BB and the Patriots ate Tebow and Denver up but stop diminishing the Steelers game.
There is no need for it.

for reference
Broncos Wildcard SoundFX vs Steelers - YouTube

 

[sb1]

Whats hilarious is you guys all debating this. He is going to be on the final roster book it, and no matter what you guys complain about its going to happen.

Also you will be surprised how they will use him to win throughout the season then all of you guys will be tuggin his junk Tebow fans.

Facts:
1. Tebow will make the team
2. Tebow will be #2 backup sometimes this season
3. Tebow will be the successor to Brady and have much success

The reason you all debate it is because you know deep down its true and you hate it.

I like cheese. Especially sharp old cheddar.

 

[Suddyfan]

In regards to the Steelers game , Kuper was out, Moreno was out, Dawkins was out, Decker went out, Miller was hurt, Larsen was out, Vaughn was out....BOTH TEAM WERE REALLY BANGED UP, its called football, stop giving the Squealers excuses.

I HATE LOATHE DETEST the steelers.. they are my brothers favorite team. Believe me nothing made me happier than calling him after that game. I'm not making excuses... it is the truth, they were missing people on D that could have changed the game around, which directly affects the outcome. I know the Broncos had injuries too, which means both sides, especially the Offenses had opportunities to take advantage of opposing defenses.

My point... again, is that you cant just say he beat the number one defense when 3 big parts of the number 1 defense were out and in the same breath completely dismiss how crappy the pats defense was because then you would have to admit tebow was really just plain bad that day.

 

[sb1]

Whether you like it or not sb1, QBs do "win" games in that they get the credit. Let's go through a number of examples just to illustrate.

Why isn't Marino considered the GOAT ? Because HE didn't win a SB. Why was Elway considered to be in the same company as Marino until his last 2 years ? Because HE too, didn't win a SB up to that point.

When people talk about the top QBs in the NFL right now, what do they reference ? How many rings THEY WON. Eli is considered great because HE won 2 SBs. Ben is considered great because HE too won 2 SBs.

Again, you might not like it. It might not be fair. It might not reflect what happened in the games. But it is what it is, the QB gets the credit in the end.

The rings argument is nonsense too. Otherwise you are saying that Trent Dilfer is better than Dan Marino because Dilfer has a ring and Marino does not. Or Trent Dilfer is better than Peyton Manning because Dilfer never "lost" a Super Bowl.

You still didn't answer my question. Did Ben and his 22 passer rating "win" Super Bowl 40? If you say anything less then an unequivocal yes, then deep down you agree with me that QB's do not win games.

 

[sb1]

As for the 2011 steelers...as I told you before more than once, they played one top 10 passing team and EIGHT games against bottom 11 passing teams. Let me repeat. EIGHT games... half their schedule... against the 11 worst passing teams in the NFL.

The fact they were "number one in yards" really and truly isn't nearly as impressive once you comprehend that tidbit.

They were extremely overrated and got what was coming to them.

 

[Suddyfan]

As for the 2011 steelers...as I told you before more than once, they played one top 10 passing team and EIGHT games against bottom 11 passing teams. Let me repeat. EIGHT games... half their schedule... against the 11 worst passing teams in the NFL.

The fact they were "number one in yards" really and truly isn't nearly as impressive once you comprehend that tidbit.

They were extremely overrated and got what was coming to them.

Impossible! The numbers say they are number 1. Therefore they are number 1. And tebow beat the number 1 defense in the league! That's right I am not sure you know that but he beat the number 1 defense in the league. Then looked like me against the number 31 defense. But that doesn't matter because numbers lie. The patriots defense was much better than number 31. That's the only reason Tebow looked so bad. Numbers lie!

 

[Brock Samson]

Tim Tebow Sound FX Week 14 HD - YouTube

Tim Tebow: terrible quarterback, annoying about his religion, genuinely nice guy.

(Marion Barber single-handedly lost that game.)

 

[Ironman44]

I HATE LOATHE DETEST the steelers.. they are my brothers favorite team. Believe me nothing made me happier than calling him after that game. I'm not making excuses... it is the truth, they were missing people on D that could have changed the game around, which directly affects the outcome. I know the Broncos had injuries too, which means both sides, especially the Offenses had opportunities to take advantage of opposing defenses.

My point... again, is that you cant just say he beat the number one defense when 3 big parts of the number 1 defense were out and in the same breath completely dismiss how crappy the pats defense was because then you would have to admit tebow was really just plain bad that day.

Any claim of what Tebow did is only a problem because it is Tebow, any other QB, no worries "he beat" "or he won" would be ok (its just football verbiage) its only a problem because its Tebow.

 

[Ironman44]

Tim Tebow: terrible quarterback, annoying about his religion, genuinely nice guy.

(Marion Barber single-handedly lost that game.)

I guess you missed the 18/24 191 yards and 1 TD in that half quarter...but its ok, you can click on it again.

I know you would like to believe what you said is true or that Praeter the kicker magically was carried by gust of winds up and down the field in the last 5 minutes but unfortunately anyone can click on the video and see what you are saying is not true.

Barber fumbling was a contributing factor but saying it was single handed is wild hyperbole . It is only said that way in order to discredit anything positive Tebow did.

Its transparent and weak.

 

[SB39]

The rings argument is nonsense too. Otherwise you are saying that Trent Dilfer is better than Dan Marino because Dilfer has a ring and Marino does not. Or Trent Dilfer is better than Peyton Manning because Dilfer never "lost" a Super Bowl.

You still didn't answer my question. Did Ben and his 22 passer rating "win" Super Bowl 40? If you say anything less then an unequivocal yes, then deep down you agree with me that QB's do not win games.

When evaluating quarterbacks, rings (and overall performances in big games) are a big factor. They are not the only factor but, like it or not, they are an important one.

Statistically speaking, Peyton Manning leads Tom Brady in every major category except rating, in which they are 0.9 apart. But why do so many, including me, consider Brady the superior quarterback? Because Brady is 17-7 in the playoffs with 3 Super Bowl Championships (and 2 one-and-done)versus Manning who is 9-11 with 1 Championship (and 8 one-and-done).

Whenever Tom Brady has been handed the ball with a couple minutes left in a Super Bowl needing a score, he has produced. Same thing happened to Manning, and he threw a pick-6.

 

[Brock Samson]

I guess you missed the 18/24 191 yards and 1 TD in that half quarter...but its ok, you can click on it again.

Yay let's cherry pick and ignore the 3/16 (it must be a sign) for the first three quarters!

Barber fumbling was a contributing factor but saying it was single handed is wild hyperbole . It is only said that way in order to discredit anything positive Tebow did.

And not getting out of bounds late in the 4th quarter. Barber lost that game for the Bears more than any other single factor in determining the outcome.

Tebow is not an NFL quarterback.

 

[Demosthenes]

of course or it wouldn't fit in the nifty little "history" of Tebow in 2011. Truth is he was atrocious in that game, no debating that and it was against a team that gave up an average of 293 passing yards per game in 2011.

Why is it so hard for you to admit that maybe the Steelers were banged up and with clark missing maybe just maybe it was a little easier than it might otherwise have been and conversely the patriots not-so-good-defense did a good job against tebow.

Its really ok for you to admit he just plain sucked that day. He did have other good days.

Kind of confused as to where you got the idea that I thought Tebow played well against the Pats in the playoffs. He did suck in that game, so did the rest of the team, including the defense.

With that said though, the Pats D did step up in the playoffs.

Against the Steelers, sure, they were banged up and Clark was missing. The Broncos were banged up as well and Tebow was missing his #2 receiver in Eric Decker. Polamalu was out there and was a non factor and got burned a few times. Harrison was another non factor. Most people on the planet didn't expect the Steeler D to completely fall apart simply because Ryan Clark didn't play.

 

[sb1]

Dan Orlovsky and Rex Grossman lit that pass defense up. It was the second worst pass defense of all time to that point. Just absolutely god awful.

Yup, plus Vince Young AND Chad Henne threw for over 400 yards. Ryan Fitzpatrick threw for 370 and put together that game winning FG drive without breaking a sweat. Jason Campbell threw for 350 himself.

That D was a disgrace.

 

[Demosthenes]

Dan Orlovsky and Rex Grossman lit that pass defense up. It was the second worst pass defense of all time to that point. Just absolutely god awful.

Yet the D gave up 24 and 22 pts from the looks of it.

There's a poster here with a sig line talking about how BB doesn't care about yards given up by the D. Don't remember the exact quote, but the gist is that scoring defense is more important.

 

[Suddyfan]

Any claim of what Tebow did is only a problem because it is Tebow, any other QB, no worries "he beat" "or he won" would be ok (its just football verbiage) its only a problem because its Tebow.

not in my world. I give credit to tebow for the steelers game. he was impressive. But I also give him credit for the stinker against the pats. nobody wins in a vacuum. there's always reasons for play against certain teams. That includes the best that ever played the game. Sometimes you get lucky or more luck than normal and other times you just plain suck.

 

[Ironman44]

Yay let's cherry pick and ignore the 3/16 (it must be a sign) for the first three quarters!



And not getting out of bounds late in the 4th quarter. Barber lost that game for the Bears more than any other single factor in determining the outcome.

Tebow is not an NFL quarterback.

Tebow had good stats overall and factored in the win immensely. He even threw a 50 yard bomb that would have sealed it before overtime that went through DT's hands.

Brock you are like a parody of a Tebow hater parsing his stats LOL, now you have to go quarter by quarter because the overall stats do not fit your agenda.

So he had nothing to do with the win? tell that to the players and coaches on the video RALLYING around him

Tebow might be the worse NFL QB in history but he sure factored in that win against the Bears and nothing you say or do will change actual history.

 

[BlueThunder]

Sb1 with post # 666


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