Florio: A 1st and 4th for Garoppolo? Not so fast...

[VrabelMayeWin]

I wouldn't trade Jimmy G unless you get at the very least a mid 1st round pick. We drafted Jimmy in the 2nd round groomed him, learned from the best of all time and has shown to be a good player in the limited time we saw him play.

I would also consider the Browns 2nd round pick this year and next year. If you don't get a good enough deal for the time and draft capital you put into JG, I would have no problem keeping him.

Definitely. As great as Brady looks right now, there's no telling how things will look in 12 months. If we can't get value there's no harm in keeping him and seeing how things develop whether that's with Brady, a Vikings type scenario where the starter gets hurt and desperate or who knows what else.

 

[deroc5050]

Definitely. As great as Brady looks right now, there's no telling how things will look in 12 months. If we can't get value there's no harm in keeping him and seeing how things develop whether that's with Brady, a Vikings type scenario where the starter gets hurt and desperate or who knows what else.

yeah but honestly I think the only way we see a significant decline in Brady is if he suffers a bad injury. I don't think Brady's skills are going to erode in the next 2 or maybe even 3 years without a major injury. (of course a major injury is more likely now that Brady is older)

If I had to make a guess I would say that Brady has 3 elite years left in him. 3 years is a long ass time in the NFL.

If Peyton Manning never had that neck surgery, he might still be playing.


I hear some people who are not professional athletes tell us that things change when you hit 40.. well no ****, i am 36 and I already have lost most of my athleticism but I stopped working out and training when I was 22. If you ate right, slept right, and worked out 365 days a year there is no reason why QB's couldn't play into there 40's this day in age. Of course luck is involved.

Jarimir Jagr...

 

[sb1]

The real value in JG is the rookie contract year. That might entice a team to at least think about offering a first or high second rounder.

I wouldn't hold my breath though.

 

[Deus Irae]

Definitely. As great as Brady looks right now, there's no telling how things will look in 12 months.

The list of QBs for whom this is not true numbers zero.

 

[deroc5050]

The list of QBs for whom this is not true numbers zero.

Didn't Warren Moon make a Pro Bowl at age 41?

 

[Deus Irae]

Didn't Warren Moon make a Pro Bowl at age 41?

Yes

 

[AzPatsFan]

Seems to a be league-wide/media-wide over-valuing of draft picks every year.

I guess its the fact that fans love them, therefore teams don't want to give them up.

Garoppolo spent multiple years in the best QB finishing school (bar none) and has flashed elite ability when he did get to take the field this year - and not just in a pre-season game either.

We keep hearing how essential it is that teams have a good QB - and we are staring into one of the worst QB drafts in years. Couple this with the general standard of QB play across the league being as bad as its ever been and you have what should be a super strong seller's market.

When it gets mentioned that Cleveland might give up one of their 1st round picks - it is almost immediately derided - 'no way' say the realists.

But who else are you going to get with that pick that will change the direction of the franchise?

Poor franchises are poor (and pick high) because of their inability to evaluate talent - the earlier you are in the player's career the more you need to project (and the more errors these guys will make) - why not get a genuine blue chip prospect.

GP is way more likely to make a franchise QB that ANY QB (bar Prescott) taken in last years draft or this - i'm not sure who would actually debate that?!

Plenty of teams SHOULD be queuing up for GP - I think the value will be higher than a 1st and a 4th if i'm honest.

All these dingbats that want some draft picks for JAG forget that they will then have to use a high pick to select his replacement. So a 1st and 4th really means get a fourth that may of may not be an improvement, as the first or equivalent is merely to select his raw replacement. For a Super Bowl contender in 2017, Coach Belichcick would have to prudently have to sign an expereienced substitute like Romo. High cost and maybe there goes any draft pick.

Call me back with your draft picks above and beyond the picks needed to merely replace J

 

[Deus Irae]

All these dingbats that want some draft picks for JAG forget that they will then have to use a high pick to select his replacement.

Brady - 6th
Cassel - 7th
JAG - 2nd
Brissett - 3rd
Hoyer - UDFA

Exactly why would they need the 1st and 4th to replace JAG?

 

[Ring 6]

Brady - 6th
Cassel - 7th
JAG - 2nd
Brissett - 3rd
Hoyer - UDFA

Exactly why would they need the 1st and 4th to replace JAG?

Well someone on this board posted yesterday that they think the raiders or dolphins would rather have brissett than mcgloin or Moore so it seems that we can draft anyone and since he will wear a patriot uniform we will be just fine

 

[Deus Irae]

Well someone on this board posted yesterday that they think the raiders or dolphins would rather have brissett than mcgloin or Moore so it seems that we can draft anyone and since he will wear a patriot uniform we will be just fine

Mallett and O'Connell disprove that theory. The players I mentioned disprove the "We need a first round draft pick to replace JAG" theory.

Basically, we've got a lot of people posting silly ****, on both sides of this equation.

 

[AzPatsFan]

ER

Brady - 6th
Cassel - 7th
JAG - 2nd
Brissett - 3rd
Hoyer - UDFA

Exactly why would they need the 1st and 4th to replace JAG?

Don't forget the ones that didn't work out. More failures than the few successes you reported. You cant have it both ways.

 

[Bill Lee]

why does this needed a separate thread...

So we can all type in the same stuff we typed in to the other thread, mixed in with a pissing contest over Blake Bortles's 2016 performance?

Holy crap at all those garbage trades. 1st round picks for Quarterbacks I've never even heard of? And Florio saying the Pats couldn't even fetch a 1st and 4th rounder. WTF!

You never heard of Drew Bledsoe?

To me the article was interesting because of the small number of good players that were obtained with the draft picks. I'm glad our Bledsoe trade led to us getting Ty Warren who was a very important Pats player in the 2000s.

To me it's all very inconsistent. I think GMs over-rate their ability to convert draft (lotto) picks into useful players, yet GMs also hold on to those draft picks as if they are money in the bank (instead of lotto picks). I think JG is much more of a sure thing than most GMs would, but I also think most GMs would rather take their chances with the lotto pick rather than sticking their necks out and making a trade.

 

[Deus Irae]

ER

Don't forget the ones that didn't work out. More failures than the few successes you reported. You cant have it both ways.

Your first post was silly. Your followup is worse. Think, then post.

This is what you posted:

So a 1st and 4th really means get a fourth that may of may not be an improvement, as the first or equivalent is merely to select his raw replacement.

BB's never used a 1st on a QB, so the notion that he'd need to use a 1st or equivalent to replace players gotten in lower rounds is nonsensical.

IF you were talking odds (which you weren't), you'd have at least an argument but, if you were talking odds (which you weren't), most would tell you that this is a crap draft for 1st round type QBs anyway.

 

[AzPatsFan]

Your first post was silly. Your followup is worse. Think, then post.

This is what you posted:



BB's never used a 1st on a QB, so the notion that he'd need to use a 1st or equivalent to replace players gotten in lower rounds is nonsensical.

IF you were talking odds (which you weren't), you'd have at least an argument but, if you were talking odds (which you weren't), most would tell you that this is a crap draft for 1st round type QBs anyway.

JAG was a high pick, a second rounder in a good QB year. Everyone says there are no first round QBs this year, so the Pats would either have to wait till 2018 or use a second to pick an ersatz replacement. My position has not changed. The Pats have a second starter for cheap for one year and expensive for the second year via franchise. Just what you need for a Super Bowl contender in 2017 and 2018 with a QB who is 40 plus. What happens after that will take care of itself.

 

[deroc5050]

Your first post was silly. Your followup is worse. Think, then post.

This is what you posted:



BB's never used a 1st on a QB, so the notion that he'd need to use a 1st or equivalent to replace players gotten in lower rounds is nonsensical.

IF you were talking odds (which you weren't), you'd have at least an argument but, if you were talking odds (which you weren't), most would tell you that this is a crap draft for 1st round type QBs anyway.

No BB never used a 1st on a QB but BB came here and had Bledsoe.. and then BB and the Pats got quite lucky to land Tom in the 6th round. Since he had Tom he hasn't had to even look at a starting QB as a priority.

I am sure if the Pats went 3-13 or 2-12 on a Tom Bradyless Patriots team. They would absolutely go for a QB with there top pick. Its hard to imagine BB losing that many games though.

 

[Deus Irae]

No BB never used a 1st on a QB but BB came here and had Bledsoe.. and then BB and the Pats got quite lucky to land Tom in the 6th round. Since he had Tom he hasn't had to even look at a starting QB as a priority.

What does any of this have to do with what I posted?

I am sure if the Pats went 3-13 or 2-12 on a Tom Bradyless Patriots team. They would absolutely go for a QB with there top pick. Its hard to imagine BB losing that many games though.

That would depend on the reason(s) for going 3-13 or 2-12, and the QB class in the following draft.

 

[Deus Irae]

my position has not changed

And you're still wrong. Congrats on the consistency, I guess.

 

[BobDigital]

With all the "could Pats get a 1st rounder for Garoppolo" talk, this is a really good look at some of the history of those sorts of trades.

This article really puts in perspective how valuable QBs are. The idea that people would not trade a high first for JAG is a bit debunked by past history.

 

[AzPatsFan]

No BB never used a 1st on a QB but BB came here and had Bledsoe.. and then BB and the Pats got quite lucky to land Tom in the 6th round. Since he had Tom he hasn't had to even look at a starting QB as a priority.

I am sure if the Pats went 3-13 or 2-12 on a Tom Bradyless Patriots team. They would absolutely go for a QB with there top pick. Its hard to imagine BB losing that many games though.

BB has losing seasons as a Coach at the Browns and Pats. At the Browns and Pats he had to replace aging QBs. He might have had to draft a QB if Testaverde or Brady were not available.

 

[AzPatsFan]

And you're still wrong. Congrats on the consistency, I guess.

Congrats on your consistently and still wrong opinion, too.