Fields traded to Steelers

[203Pat]

This is what BB haters say when they're projecting.

Mac sucked, it had nothing to do with Bill.

BB lives rent-free in your brains.

I don't know why I am even engaging but here we go.

You really think it is just some coincidence that Mac drastically regressed the year after losing an experienced offensive coordinator?

You can honestly say that having a second year quarterback paired with a coach who never called offensive plays in his life or coordinated an offense wasn't detrimental to his development?

You really think that once Bill realized the full extent of his physical limitations that surrounding him with guys like Nelson Agholor, Devante Parker, Tyquan Thornton, and Jonnu Smith was sufficient?

You really think that letting Mac's only consistent (although unspectacular) receiver walk in free agency and replacing him with a broken down Juju Smith-Schuster was another stroke of genius by Bill? Or was it playing musical chairs at tackle that was supposed to help?

Listen, I know Mac sucked. I didn't like him when we drafted him and didn't like him at any point here. I was one of the first people on here to start questioning his arm strength and was told there was nothing to worry about my many on here. I have no allegiance to Mac but Mac was not set up to succeed here and if you think that all of those things "had nothing to do with Bill" then that is an over the top Bill bobo take.

 

[sb1]

You hated Bill long before 2022.

Lol

Coaches can’t fix character flaws. Should Andy Reid have taken Rashee Rice’s car keys away also? Good grief…

And yet character flawed guys like Moss and Dillon did all right in NE. That's because they were coached better. The coaching for Jones was dreadful. Factual statement, not an opinion.

The collaboration station.

If the GM made decisions by committee then he should have been fired a long time ago before he was.

 

[sb1]

I don't know why I am even engaging but here we go.

You really think it is just some coincidence that Mac drastically regressed the year after losing an experienced offensive coordinator?

You can honestly say that having a second year quarterback paired with a coach who never called offensive plays in his life or coordinated an offense wasn't detrimental to his development?

You really think that once Bill realized the full extent of his physical limitations that surrounding him with guys like Nelson Agholor, Devante Parker, Tyquan Thornton, and Jonnu Smith was sufficient?

You really think that letting Mac's only consistent (although unspectacular) receiver walk in free agency and replacing him with a broken down Juju Smith-Schuster was another stroke of genius by Bill? Or was it playing musical chairs at tackle that was supposed to help?

Listen, I know Mac sucked. I didn't like him when we drafted him and didn't like him at any point here. I was one of the first people on here to start questioning his arm strength and was told there was nothing to worry about my many on here. I have no allegiance to Mac but Mac was not set up to succeed here and if you think that all of those things "had nothing to do with Bill" then that is an over the top Bill bobo take.

And after all that he can't find a job as a coach anymore. Go figure.

I love the Team Bill logic that when things go well all the credit to Bill. When they don't it's a "collaboration" or Bill was forced to do it by Kraft or some other mysterious higher power. Lol

 

[203Pat]

And after all that no team wants him as a coach anymore. Go figure.

I love the Team Bill logic that when things go well all the credit to Bill. When they don't it's a "collaboration" or Bill was forced to do it by Kraft or some other mysterious higher power. Lol

I don't know why to love Bill you need to think he was infallible. He had a great 24 season run here and won 6 rings but he mismanaged things down the stretch. Both those things can be true.

 

[Wozzy]

I don't know why I am even engaging but here we go.

You really think it is just some coincidence that Mac drastically regressed the year after losing an experienced offensive coordinator?

You can honestly say that having a second year quarterback paired with a coach who never called offensive plays in his life or coordinated an offense wasn't detrimental to his development?

You really think that once Bill realized the full extent of his physical limitations that surrounding him with guys like Nelson Agholor, Devante Parker, Tyquan Thornton, and Jonnu Smith was sufficient?

You really think that letting Mac's only consistent (although unspectacular) receiver walk in free agency and replacing him with a broken down Juju Smith-Schuster was another stroke of genius by Bill? Or was it playing musical chairs at tackle that was supposed to help?

Listen, I know Mac sucked. I didn't like him when we drafted him and didn't like him at any point here. I was one of the first people on here to start questioning his arm strength and was told there was nothing to worry about my many on here. I have no allegiance to Mac but Mac was not set up to succeed here and if you think that all of those things "had nothing to do with Bill" then that is an over the top Bill bobo take.

Mac regressed after week 13 of his rookie season. You keep trying to gloss over that. Why?

He sucked going forward. The following season (year 2) in week three when Mac went down with injury against Baltimore he led the entire NFL in interceptions!

And you can tell us all you want how terrible Zappe is, but it doesn't change the fact he played well in the same offense. They won two games and put up the best offensive stats on the entire season. If Zappe sucks, fine... he was a hell of a lot better than Mac. The 2022 offense was also better than the 2023 offense, so don't tell me about coaching. Mac got benched 4 times because he got worse and worse over time, but he sucked by the final quarter of his rookie season. His problems didn't start with Patricia.

He's a whiny little ball sack smacker... Mac's problem is Mac.

 

[Wozzy]

And yet character flawed guys like Moss and Dillon did all right in NE. That's because they were coached better. The coaching for Jones was dreadful. Factual statement, not an opinion.

Did you just compare two Hall Of Fame caliber players to Mac?

Moss and Dillon's character issues were off the field issues, not in their ability to play football.

If the GM made decisions by committee then he should have been fired a long time ago before he was.

Kraft signs the checks.

 

[Wozzy]

I don't know why to love Bill you need to think he was infallible. He had a great 24 season run here and won 6 rings but he mismanaged things down the stretch. Both those things can be true.

I slammed BB moves annually. I can list an endless number of examples and provide links to prove it.

If you need to lie about me to make a point, that's a you problem.

Now if I slam a Wolf/Mayo moves... it's because I "want them to fail."

I don't root for individual coaches or players, I root for the laundry.

You can't understand this level of objectivity... it's beyond your capacity.

 

[TomPatriot]

Mac was good for 13 weeks of football, then he turned into the pumpkin we saw for the remainder of that season and next two years.

Once teams had tape of him he was cooked... you people are confusing a good team for good QB play. That 2021 team ranked 8th in rushing attempts and 25th in passing attempts, they did a good job protecting Mac from himself. He still collapsed. He was never good.

In 2021, they were 12th in the NFL in passer rating, 14th in passing yards, 5th in completion %, 10th in passes completed for 20+ yards. Not bad for a rookie.

Then Bill screwed around with Matt Patricia, Mac Jones handled it badly and that was the end of that. Jones isn’t blameless, but to absolve the coaches is ridiculous.

 

[Wozzy]

In 2021, they were 12th in the NFL in passer rating, 14th in passing yards, 5th in completion %, 10th in passes completed for 20+ yards. Not bad for a rookie.

Then Bill screwed around with Matt Patricia, Mac Jones handled it badly and that was the end of that. Jones isn’t blameless, but to absolve the coaches is ridiculous.

Robert Griffin was NFL offensive rookie of the year, after team's accumulated tape on him... he sucked.

Mac was good as a rookie until the bye week in week 13, after that he sucked.

If you take away Mac's one game against the Jaguars after the bye week, the team with the worst record in the NFL in 2021... Mac was horrid.

In five games after the bye week he threw 7 interceptions, fumbled twice and completed 60% of his passes at 6.8 yards per attempt... they lost four of the five last games and only beat the worst team in the entire NFL.

Mac that last quarter of his rookie season is who we saw for the next two years. He wasn't as good as you suggest, he was a flash in the pan... fool's gold.

 

[sb1]

And you can tell us all you want how terrible Zappe is, but it doesn't change the fact he played well in the same offense.

0 points against the worst defense in the league is playing well?
Scoring just 1 TD against a subpar defense when spotted 6 fourth down stops is playing well?

They won two games and put up the best offensive stats on the entire season.

Zappe's Cleveland and Detroit games especially the latter weren't really all that if we're being honest. There was no good reason for the HC to egg on a QB controversy that didn't exist until he poured gas on the fire. It was embarrassing and did his young QB no favors. Who knows why he thought it was necessary. I'm sure other teams noticed too... and he is still unemployed. Do the math.

If Zappe sucks, fine... he was a hell of a lot better than Mac.

No he wasn't. At all.

The 2022 offense was also better than the 2023 offense, so don't tell me about coaching.

And yet Bill was fired. So yeah... it was coaching.

Mac got benched 4 times because he got worse and worse over time, but he sucked by the final quarter of his rookie season. His problems didn't start with Patricia.

He's a whiny little ball sack smacker... Mac's problem is Mac.

And yet who was the GM that didn't recognize his character flaws and drafted him anyway. If he drafted a guy that couldn't hack it in the NFL that's on the GM and ONLY on the GM. And dont gimme that trash that he was "forced" to pick him... Bill had final say, period. It's on him. All of it.

 

[sb1]

Did you just compare two Hall Of Fame caliber players to Mac?

They had character issues and they worked out fine. That's because their coaching was better. The coaching Jones got was wretched.

Kraft signs the checks.

So Bill gets all credit when things go well but it's not his fault when things don't work out. Either he was the head coach and GM or he wasn't. . Which is it?

 

[sb1]

If you take away Mac's one game against the Jaguars after the bye week,

I love the "if you take away...." logic pretending something didn't happen when it did. Kinda like Team Bill's "if you take away the Cam/Covid year, the Cleveland era, the Matt Patricia year...

 

[sb1]

Robert Griffin was NFL offensive rookie of the year, after team's accumulated tape on him... he sucked.

Actually he was done in by a severe knee injury which limited the the read option that they ran there and forced him to be a pure passer which was not his strength. Teams might have figured out how to defend it but what they figured out that he was less of a threat to run. Game over. Where would Lamar be if that happened to him.

Jones was done in by wretched coaching much more than anything else. And I don't put any stock in that Buffalo wild card game for him, his stats were ok but being down so far there was nothing anyone could take away from that game on him. Of course that was the HC's defense that got depantsed in a way that has never happened before in NFL playoff history.

 

[IcyPatriot]

Like are Mac and Zappe even worth the time to type out a discussion? Not me.

 

[TomPatriot]

Robert Griffin was NFL offensive rookie of the year, after team's accumulated tape on him... he sucked.

Mac was good as a rookie until the bye week in week 13, after that he sucked.

If you take away Mac's one game against the Jaguars after the bye week, the team with the worst record in the NFL in 2021... Mac was horrid.

In five games after the bye week he threw 7 interceptions, fumbled twice and completed 60% of his passes at 6.8 yards per attempt... they lost four of the five last games and only beat the worst team in the entire NFL.

Mac that last quarter of his rookie season is who we saw for the next two years. He wasn't as good as you suggest, he was a flash in the pan... fool's gold.

During the same time period, much of the rest of the team regressed, including the vaunted defense. So how do you know his regression was only about him? I don’t know why you can’t see that the coaching staff and lack of talent around him is partially responsible for his failures.

If you look at Trevor Lawrence’s stats v. Mac’s you’ll see that in many respects TL didn’t fare that much better. Does he suck too? Nope. Surrounding talent and erratic coaching explain some of his problems too.

Look, Mac wasn’t worthy of a mid first pick, but he wasn’t helped by the Pats.

 

[203Pat]

Mac regressed after week 13 of his rookie season. You keep trying to gloss over that. Why?

He sucked going forward. The following season (year 2) in week three when Mac went down with injury against Baltimore he led the entire NFL in interceptions!

And you can tell us all you want how terrible Zappe is, but it doesn't change the fact he played well in the same offense. They won two games and put up the best offensive stats on the entire season. If Zappe sucks, fine... he was a hell of a lot better than Mac. The 2022 offense was also better than the 2023 offense, so don't tell me about coaching. Mac got benched 4 times because he got worse and worse over time, but he sucked by the final quarter of his rookie season. His problems didn't start with Patricia.

He's a whiny little ball sack smacker... Mac's problem is Mac.

Mac was on a leash his rookie year because we had an OC who could actually build a gameplan and was able to work around Mac's limitations for a while and tailor an offense to him the best he could. He was terrible in both games against Buffalo and the first one it was clear they didn't trust his arm to throw in that weather but outside of those two games he was roughly the same down the stretch. Against average teams he was average, against bad teams he was good, and against good teams he was bad.

Good coaching was able to elevate a mediocre quarterback to some extent. Once that good coaching was gone Mac was completely exposed. And yes Zappe also sucks. He just looks slightly more athletic while sucking. Granted it is a smaller sample size but both Zappe and Mac's numbers are remarkably similar. Completion percentage, interception percentage, yards per attempt, passer rating. It is all pretty damn close.

Mac is definitely a whiner and didn't handle the circumstances well but when a guy is already that limited he needs more help and better coaching and he didn't get either.

 

[Wozzy]

I love the "if you take away...." logic pretending something didn't happen when it did. Kinda like Team Bill's "if you take away the Cam/Covid year, the Cleveland era, the Matt Patricia year...

Laughable how you and other Mac haters avoid talking about Mac's disintegration his rookie year like the plague, you literally cut it out of every response you write to me.

I said take away the Jacksonville game, you know the worst team in the league, then I proceeded to post his stats for the entire final quarter of his rookie season including the Jaguar's game and you had to cut them out in your response also. Here they are again...

In five games after the bye week he threw 7 interceptions, fumbled twice and completed 60% of his passes at 6.8 yards per attempt... they lost four of the five last games and only beat the worst team in the entire NFL.

"Team Bill" doesn't exist, there's just a group of mouth breathers who think "BB lost his place in posterity," and all we they have to do to justify this take is omit the games with the QB Bill drafted, developed and kept over Bledsoe from his record... and it makes sense.

These are the same people who needed the mods here to build them their own Brady safe space on this site after he left. Team Bill was a figment of their imaginations, it describes anyone who moved on with their lives after Tom left and still rooted for this team.

Mac sucked, Fields sucked also... they're both turnover machines, and turnovers are team killers.