Do any other fans feel cheated by the playoffs and this Giants rematch?

[PatriotSeven]

Why do you even bother arguing at all, its clear you know everything. If we were all in a room together you'd be putting your fingers in your ears going lalalalallalala whenever somebody pointed out that every team goes through the same process and this is how it played out. You have made excuses or rationalized anytime someone challenged your view point with a logic reply. So i think this is analogous to the old saying if you think your the only one that's not crazy you probably are....

I don't believe it's like that at all. Your statement is far from logical or backed up by any evidence. There's a big difference between logic and general statements. What you made is a general statement.

I've provided numerous arguments backed up from tried and tested methods such as proven statistics across multiple categories over the past couple of weeks, explanations in difference of execution, as well as just plain old fun and humor. In fact I still see the same old statements which are just plain wrong being thrown around despite insurmountable evidence.

There is not much one person can do to change public perception, but it doesn't mean I have to fall in line with it just because it doesn't stick with the general public. Facts are facts and as I understand them to the best of my abilities that's what I try to stick to.

What I see is some fans who are scared to be confident in that what they have. Maybe you're not over the 2007 loss but I am. And just because something took place a long time ago that is against the odds, I don't expect unbelievable odds to repeat every time the possibility of that happening pops-up.

That's fear. It's not logic. It's not common sense. It's irrationality. Just because you should always be on the lookout and expect the unexpected, doesn't mean you should stop predicting or believing in that which is most likely to occur.

And everything that I have seen in the playoffs, from my point of view, and from the numbers that I have looked at, is one very solid football team versus an ok football team. That's what we have in this super bowl and no amount of spinning or selling on TV is really going to sway me and it shouldn't sway Patriot fans.

There is something about being able to enjoy a game, or a Super Bowl, or a win without holding back, and personally I feel this is one of those cases. There's little to worry about if you just look at the facts rather than become obsessed and fear the exception to the rule.

 

[guardplay320]

I don't believe it's like that at all. Your statement is far from logical or backed up by any evidence. There's a big difference between logic and general statements. What you made is a general statement.

I've provided numerous arguments backed up from tried and tested methods such as proven statistics across multiple categories over the past couple of weeks, explanations in difference of execution, as well as just plain old fun and humor. In fact I still see the same old statements which are just plain wrong being thrown around despite insurmountable evidence.

There is not much one person can do to change public perception, but it doesn't mean I have to fall in line with it just because it doesn't stick with the general public. Facts are facts and as I understand them to the best of my abilities that's what I try to stick to.

What I see is some fans who are scared to be confident in that what they have. Maybe you're not over the 2007 loss but I am. And just because something took place a long time ago that is against the odds, I don't expect unbelievable odds to repeat every time the possibility of that happening pops-up.

That's fear. It's not logic. It's not common sense. It's irrationality. Just because you should always be on the lookout and expect the unexpected, doesn't mean you should stop predicting or believing in that which is most likely to occur.

And everything that I have seen in the playoffs, from my point of view, and from the numbers that I have looked at, is one very solid football team versus an ok football team. That's what we have in this super bowl and no amount of spinning or selling on TV is really going to sway me and it shouldn't sway Patriot fans.

There is something about being able to enjoy a game, or a Super Bowl, or a win without holding back, and personally I feel this is one of those cases. There's little to worry about if you just look at the facts rather than become obsessed and fear the exception to the rule.

There is a word for your post also. HOMER! You have presented no facts to prove your point. You have continuously avoided the FACT that the Giants beat the Pats head to head in their building and then finally addressed that with excuses. You refuse to acknowledge the difference in difficulty in schedules between the Giants and Pats and the FACT that the Pats didn't beat a team with a winning record until squeaking by the Ravens this past week (just as the Giants did against an equally strong 49ers team). What actual facts have you even given other than differences in records between teams with unbalanced schedules?

Fact: like opponents including head-to head:

Giants 7-3
Pats 8-2

Argue your way out of that. That is the only thing you can compare head to head.

See the attached for quality standings. Doesn't look that great for the Pats or Giants. Our one quality win was against you guys. The Packers, Saints, Niners and Ravens are the winner in this category. The Pats should go back and forfeit that game against the Ravens since they were CLEARLY the better team compared to the Pats based on their record and quality wins. The only fair Superbowl would have been Ravens-Packers, but the Giants and Pats are undeserving so we can't enjoy this Superbowl.

http://instantreplay1.wordpress.com/2012/01/03/final-2011-quality-standings/

 

[Satchboogie3]

I really have nothing nice to say to you at this point Patriotseven so I'm just going to leave it at this: I think you are incredibly niave and disrespectful to both the NFL and the Giants and your continuing banter pisses me off because you either don't get it or refuse to admit you're wrong or in the incredibly minority (in which case you are arogant to want the NFL to change their system just because YOU alone don't like it).

So in all due respect, piss off.

Note: This is nothing personal, just a statement of my dissatisfaction of your opinion. (... and I need to better decant my barleywine... yuk)

 

[guardplay320]

I really have nothing nice to say to you at this point Patriotseven so I'm just going to leave it at this: I think you are incredibly niave and disrespectful to both the NFL and the Giants and your continuing banter pisses me off because you either don't get it or refuse to admit you're wrong or in the incredibly minority (in which case you are arogant to want the NFL to change their system just because YOU alone don't like it).

So in all due respect, piss off.

Note: This is nothing personal, just a statement of my dissatisfaction of your opinion. (... and I need to better decant my barleywine... yuk)

Satch - at least the majority of your fanbase is very reasonable and realistic. You should have seen the 49er fanbase. They are nuts on that board, even more so after that game.

 

[PatriotSeven]

There is a word for your post also. HOMER! You have presented no facts to prove your point. You have continuously avoided the FACT that the Giants beat the Pats head to head in their building and then finally addressed that with excuses. You refuse to acknowledge the difference in difficulty in schedules between the Giants and Pats and the FACT that the Pats didn't beat a team with a winning record until squeaking by the Ravens this past week (just as the Giants did against an equally strong 49ers team). What actual facts have you even giv
en other than differences in records with an unbalanced schedule.

Fact: like Opponents including head-to head:
Giants 7-3
Pats 8-2

I don't think I have done that at all. Clinging on to your regular season win, while at the same time completely ignoring you beat teams that beat the Giants in the regular season is contradictory to what you re saying and proves nothing. GB beat the Giants so have the 49ers in the regular season. What good did it do them?

Are the Giants somehow invincible to losing in the playoffs? Are they invincible to getting blown out? Not at all.

And yes winning records are important but so is strength of victory.
You have been outscored by a sick amounts of points and finish the season with a point differential of -6.
You have lost football games to mediocre teams who held the Giants offense to as little as 10 points.
You are ranked worse in points scored as well as points allowed than the Patriots
You are ranked worse in turnovers.
No 9-7 team has ever won a Super Bowl
Three teams have won championship games despite a negative turnover margin, which a good indicator of a team's ability to overcome its mistakes and still win. Two of them won the Super Bowl. The Patriots are the third to try and do this.

And most importantly, yards per point is the best predictor of winning in football. It's currently predicting a beat down.

You are ranked 15th on offense and 14th on defense in this most important category. While the Patriots are ranked 4th on offense and 2nd in defense. Patriots are also ranked #2 Special teams while Giants are 19th. And when considering turnover margin, this predicts blow-out!

And on top of that, the 49ers and GB played terrible compared to what I know and watched to for this entire season. I know how they played other teams that were just as good or better than the Giants, and they didn't play as bad as they played against the Giants in the playoffs.

So what exactly is there to fear about the Giants? Superstition? Karma? History? An "appeared" hot streak due to the result of a couple of teams playing below their usual level? Those are all results of the illusion that football can sometimes create.

So why would I act afraid to stand behind something as solid as this? If it turns out different, then so be it. But right now, as things look, I love what I'm seeing and it's not the Patriots or Patriot fans that have anything to be afraid of.

And I have every confidence the Patriots will expose it. Just because GB and the 49ers failed to do what they are supposed to do, doesn't mean the Patriots will fail also.

 

[doesntmatter1]

I dont know why I read most of these posts but I did. And seven you have to be the most unreasonable poster maybe ever(you completely ignored andy's posts). By your logic the number 1 seed in each conference should just automatically go the superbowl. No point in the playoffs whatsoever because the six seed should never even sniff a trophy.

I have always thought the Giants were dangerous and actually thought they were going to beat the packers. Also you keep talking about teams beating themselves, well most turnovers are forced by the other team. You should really get the records in the regular season out of your head. Think of the regular season as time to get your act together(ex. like cutting haynesworth,adjusting to injuries etc). Better example- the lions in 08 went 4-0 in the preseason and then lost every game afterwards. And the regular season is basically the preseason to the playoffs. And those lions beat themselves week in and week out with stupid plays but those loses didn't magically magically turn into wins and neither should the packers loss to the giants. Alright im done.

 

[strngplyr]

Well first of all let's set things straight. My issue isn't so much that I think the Giants aren't a good team or don't deserve to be in the Super Bowl. Just that the other NFC teams are better and they deserve to be in it more.

The Giants beat a Patriots team who committed 4 turnovers. The Bills can beat the Patriots when the Patriots commit 4 turnovers. When your team commits 4 turnovers, you don't believe you beat yourself? Do you believe it to be common place for an NFL team to commit 4 turnovers in one game?

And I honestly believe this is going to be a rude awakening for the Giants to finally realize why it usually takes a 13-15 win team to play in and win a Super Bowl. This is going to be more of an example of what usually happens when a 13 win team meats a 9 win team. I don't believe in mystique, luck, superstitions. I believe in execution and efficiency. That's what wins regular season games, playoff games as well as Super Bowls. Every once in awhile a team who executed poorly will wake up and beat a team who executed consistently in the regular season when they catch them sleeping. The rest of the times, the norm happens.

I am well aware of the exception to the rule. I know what it feels like when the underdog gets you. It's a bitter taste and it sucks. But the Giants have yet to get a taste of the norm. Eli has yet to taste what it's like to get beaten by the favorite in the Super Bowl.

Fact is when the a team like the Patriots turn over the ball 4 times against the Giants the Giants will beat them by about 4 points.
When the Giants turn over the ball twice against even a team like the Saints, they get demolished 49-24. This offense, is just as good as that, but this defense is even better.

So pray the Patriots turn the ball over 4 times again. That's the only way this game stays close.

You know that turnovers are also commonly called takeaways? You know that the defense can force them, correct? Sometimes the defense beats the offense and forces a turnover, the offense doesn't always beat itself. Tom Brady CAN be fooled by coverages and throw interceptions. Defenders CAN knock the ball out of Tom Brady's hand while sacking him. Defenders CAN force the ball out of Julian Edelman's hands while he is returning a punt or kick.

You're the kind of "fan" who would argue that every turnover the perfect Patriot's offense have is our own "mistake" while giving all the credit to our defense for every turnover they "force".

You also argue that we have the second best defense in the NFL, which in itself should have warned everyone not to argue with you in this thread. You are arrogant, ignorant, and unintelligent. ...didn't you also try correcting someone by telling them that "worst" wasn't a word?

 

[PatriotSeven]

I dont know why I read most of these posts but I did. And seven you have to be the most unreasonable poster maybe ever(you completely ignored andy's posts). By your logic the number 1 seed in each conference should just automatically go the superbowl. No point in the playoffs whatsoever because the six seed should never even sniff a trophy.

I have always thought the Giants were dangerous and actually thought they were going to beat the packers. Also you keep talking about teams beating themselves, well most turnovers are forced by the other team. You should really get the records in the regular season out of your head. Think of the regular season as time to get your act together(ex. like cutting haynesworth,adjusting to injuries etc). Better example- the lions in 08 went 4-0 in the preseason and then lost every game afterwards. And the regular season is basically the preseason to the playoffs. And those lions beat themselves week in and week out with stupid plays but those loses didn't magically magically turn into wins and neither should the packers loss to the giants. Alright im done.

If that's what you came away with from my posts than either I need to change my writing style or you don't understand simple english.

I'm done repeating myself and it was already re-explained and re-written by others. There's no point responding to that when it's not even close to what I stated. Sorry but you're way off the mark.

PS: The rest of the world, regardless of language or nationality understands the logic behind what I am saying. Look up world cup groups, semi-finals and finals. Everyone from China, to South Africa, to Brazil to the USA understands it. It's not rocket science. It's simple and fair and it is one of the few things the entire world agrees on.

 

[doesntmatter1]

One last thing. If you were wondering seven, I think we are going to beat the hell out of the giants in the superbowl. Their front seven is dangerous but they showed too much of their hand when we played them a few weeks ago. We adjusted pretty well in the second half of that game and I expect our offense to continue that.

 

[mb6592]

I guess it is possible to troll your own teams forum. This is the most annoying thread I've ever read on this forum - what an embarrassment for Patriots fans and fans of this forum. 7 you just got my vote for the most annoying poster of the year award.

 

[Wolfpack]

When it comes to the Packers game, I gladly tip my cap to the Giants. They dominated Green Bay and the game shouldn't have been as close as the final score indicated.

But when it comes to the 49ers game..... well let's just say the Giants shouldn't be proud of the fact they barely managed to win in overtime despite SF's special teams giftwrapping the ball for NY inside the 30 on a silver platter twice.

The Patriots are the superior team on both sides of the ball. If they do not turn it over, they will win. But, obviously, turnovers can kill a team and that's why they play the game.

 

[Satchboogie3]

If that's what you came away with from my posts than either I need to change my writing style or you don't understand simple english.

I'm done repeating myself and it was already re-explained and re-written by others. There's no point responding to that when it's not even close to what I stated. Sorry but you're way off the mark.

PS: The rest of the world, regardless of language or nationality understands the logic behind what I am saying. Look up world cup groups, semi-finals and finals. Everyone from China, to South Africa, to Brazil to the USA understands it. It's not rocket science. It's simple and fair and it is one of the few things the entire world agrees on.

This isn't f8cking soccer and I'm damned glad it isn't. When a soccer player can take the kind of hits an NFL player takes, I'll agree. They're completely different sports, one's non contact and the other is arguably the most physical and brutal sport there is (I'm not county boxing/etc because those aren't sports, those are beating up people for money...). Expanding the playoffs is just idiotic. I really don't care what the rest of the world does anyways. Conformity is not an argument of value. Conformity sucks.

 

[PatriotSeven]

This isn't f8cking soccer and I'm damned glad it isn't. When a soccer player can take the kind of hits an NFL player takes, I'll agree. They're completely different sports, one's non contact and the other is arguably the most physical and brutal sport there is (I'm not county boxing/etc because those aren't sports, those are beating up people for money...). Expanding the playoffs is just idiotic. I really don't care what the rest of the world does anyways. Conformity is not an argument of value. Conformity sucks.

What does playoff format have to do with the type of sport? The NFL's format has nothing to do with the fact that football is physical. It has to do with the fact it started off with only 15 teams.

Originally, the 15 teams was the playoff format. It's doubled. It's no longer adequate.

You think the Saints, Green Bay, or 49ers wouldn't prefer to play 2 less pre-season games in order to play in 2 playoff games? Go ask them right now how they feel about this playoff format.

See what those same players that are busting their ass and breaking bones think about it who only get 1 day in the sun to shine and then go home.

 

[BennyBledsoe]

Doesn't this Super Bowl prove it matters what team shows up to play?

I mean, what's the whole point of this thread.... you don't like that supposedly the current playoffs aren't a true test of who's the best that year? I think we like it because once you get in the title fight, everything you knew doesn't matter. Who really does have the mental toughness, the focus to win?

 

[Lansdowne]

Nitpicking here but the Moore/Evans play was fortunate for us, a nice recovery of an otherwise blown play. Moore was beat badly by Evans and thank the Lord almighty he had the wherewithal to swipe the ball out of Evans' arms at that moment. Cundiff's miss officially sealed the victory but Moore's save was a bigger swing. The Pats still had a very real chance of winning the game in OT if Cundiff made the FG as most kickers would from that distance. But moving down the length of the field to score a TD, against that defense, without a real outside receiver downfield threat, with 20 seconds left, would have been too much to overcome.

I compare Moore's game-saving play to Troy Brown forcing Marlon McCree to fumble after Brady threw an interception while trailing late in the 4th of the 2006 season's playoffs against the Chargers. SD would've regained control in the field position battle, and would protect their lead by running down more clock. But Brown made a heads up play that more than likely made the difference between winning and losing.

Slightly less dramatic but just as important was the following pass deflection Moore did on the pass to Pitta. If that ball gets past Moore's hand, Pitta falls back into the end zone for the game-winner. Again, Moore fell behind but recovered in the knick of time. Not ready to label those two as great defensive coverage since they were far from perfect, but what's most important is we got the desired result each time (an incomplete pass).

Shorter version: someone described Moore's play versus Evans as great defense and I see it rather as a nice recovery from what started out as bad defense. The difference between goat and savior was literally mere milliseconds of reaction time. Great defense is Wilfork swallowing the middle of Baltimore's offense for most of the game.

 

[BradyFTW!]

What does playoff format have to do with the type of sport? The NFL's format has nothing to do with the fact that football is physical. It has to do with the fact it started off with only 15 teams.

Originally, the 15 teams was the playoff format. It's doubled. It's no longer adequate.

You think the Saints, Green Bay, or 49ers wouldn't prefer to play 2 less pre-season games in order to play in 2 playoff games? Go ask them right now how they feel about this playoff format.

See what those same players that are busting their ass and breaking bones think about it who only get 1 day in the sun to shine and then go home.

The playoff format has everything to do with the violent nature of football. You can't have a best of 7 series playing one game per week.

Read what you're saying though. The rest of the season games don't matter? You think those teams don't want to perform? The 49ers, Patriots, Green Bay and the Saints didn't bust their ass every single game of the season? Are you not supposed to perform for the other 16 games?

It happens. Even the best get beaten on a bad day, but the playoffs, and who gets to play in such a huge game shouldn't come down to one bad day. It really should be about the best teams. And right now, only one of them is playing in it.

And from where I am standing, it's a shame.

It did matter. Because they did so well in the regular season, the 49ers and Packers both got bye weeks and both got to play the Giants at home. What more could they ask for? A free ride to the Super Bowl?

 

[BradyFTW!]

Doesn't this Super Bowl prove it matters what team shows up to play?

I mean, what's the whole point of this thread.... you don't like that supposedly the current playoffs aren't a true test of who's the best that year? I think we like it because once you get in the title fight, everything you knew doesn't matter. Who really does have the mental toughness, the focus to win?

I don't get the point either. Apparently there's a better way to determine which team is best than to simply have them play each other. Who knew?

 

[reflexblue]

I don't get the point either. Apparently there's a better way to determine which team is best than to simply have them play each other. Who knew?

Computers??????

 

[reflexblue]

What does playoff format have to do with the type of sport? The NFL's format has nothing to do with the fact that football is physical. It has to do with the fact it started off with only 15 teams.

Originally, the 15 teams was the playoff format. It's doubled. It's no longer adequate.

You think the Saints, Green Bay, or 49ers wouldn't prefer to play 2 less pre-season games in order to play in 2 playoff games? Go ask them right now how they feel about this playoff format.

See what those same players that are busting their ass and breaking bones think about it who only get 1 day in the sun to shine and then go home.

Maybe they should change the rules, they could make it flag football or touch football, then we could have a best of Seven.

 

[BradyFTW!]

And yes winning records are important but so is strength of victory.

... what? You're treating this like it's self-evident, when there is literally nobody in the entire league who would agree with you. All that matters is winning. There are no style points awarded.