Could we stomache a down year to grab draft cap after brady goes?

[Sciz]

It’s just assumed that Hoyer will outlast than Brady? He’d be 37 by then if Brady plays as long as he wants to.

 

[farn]

I am 1000% ok with us not doing well after Brady goes.

My logic is this............

Brady is a 'once in a lifetime' player. We need to give him all the help he needs for TODAY. We can't worry about 'post Brady' b/c....

I think any QB who comes in after Brady is setup to fail. The expectations would be too enormous. I think it would be better for the franchise to stink for a year or two while trying to rebuild.

Once we've had that bad 'rebuilding taste' in our mouths, we'd be able to appreciate and up and coming team. We would actually appreciate a team just making the playoffs (even as a wild card). Meanwhile if we don't rebuild 'just making the playoffs' will seem like a huge failure.

So count me in the camp of 'it's ok to go backwards before we go forwards again'

Just like Miami post Marino ? Yeah.. no thanks. I understand if we lose after Brady. I’m against doing it on purpose.

 

[farn]

It’s just assumed that Hoyer will outlast than Brady? He’d be 37 by then if Brady plays as long as he wants to.

Hoyer might not be on the roster this September.

 

[brdmaverick]

In fairness to you : I don’t give a rat’s *** about regular season “success”. WHAT the hell is that ? It’s loser talk for “we suck in the playoffs”.
.

Obviously the playoffs are important, but it's such a small sample size.....and with Brady hogging all the wins, if we just went off post season success who would be considered your top QBs in the league if not Andrew Luck?

Eli Manning?
Nick Foles?
Joe Flacco?
Ben Roethlisberger?

 

[brdmaverick]

Just like Miami post Marino ? Yeah.. no thanks. I understand if we lose after Brady. I’m against doing it on purpose.

To clarify, my application of 'on purpose' in this scenario is.....

...applying all assets to the Brady window to help him at the end of his career, which yes, will most likely create hardships for the post Brady era.

and not....

.....INTENTIONALLY tanking a season to get better draft picks to retool

 

[mosslost]

(having said that, I love me some @mosslost - just so sick of the excuses everyone has for losers... SB wins are everything... there is first place and F all...)

Hmm. I hear you. But I think that we can't just call anyone who has not won a Super Bowl a loser, or who has not won one yet.

Look at Tom Brady for example. He Rocked and Rolled in SB 52, and they lost. He was great at the end of SB 53, but everyone in the country knows the Pats D won SB 53.

Marino never won a Super Bowl. I understand that Super Bowls are the standard, but their are great QBs who never won the SB, Great QBs who have not won any yet (Mahomes?) and also there are somewhat lame QBs who have won one (Dilfer? Johnson?)

I think the Colts have a good coach now and possibly good Management. Luck definitely improved and had an excellent year and I thought his career was going to be over, and he is not yet 30. So who knows.

 

[sean10mm]

The bust rate is so high for even #1 overall picks that tanking on purpose is just a bad strategy on a basic level. There are hidden costs too, like scaring away coaching and free agent talent if you turn your franchise into an atomic waste dump.

Look at the Chiefs, they went from good seasons with Alex Smith to having a great season with Mahomes on his rookie contract with a loaded offensive team. Their future is bright and they didn't have to go into the toilet to get there.

 

[farn]

@mosslost

You can win despite limitations at QB (early Ravens, TB). And re: Marino, obviously an excellent QB. But there is something to be said for his inability to win the SB. It doesn’t mean he isn’t great, but IMO it does mean he’s not as great as some would suggest.

Winning is the only thing. Only thing. If you don’t win, all you’re doing is collecting a paycheck. That is fine, but not great.

 

[farn]

To clarify, my application of 'on purpose' in this scenario is.....

...applying all assets to the Brady window to help him at the end of his career, which yes, will most likely create hardships for the post Brady era.

and not....

.....INTENTIONALLY tanking a season to get better draft picks to retool

I’m fine with « not winning » for a few years while STILL trying to both win and load up for SB success. I just don’t care about reaching for (1) a good pick by losing (2) striving for 10-6. Eventually, if SB victories aren’t the goal, it’s BS.

 

[mosslost]

I am 1000% ok with us not doing well after Brady goes.

My logic is this............

Brady is a 'once in a lifetime' player. We need to give him all the help he needs for TODAY. We can't worry about 'post Brady' b/c....

I think any QB who comes in after Brady is setup to fail. The expectations would be too enormous. I think it would be better for the franchise to stink for a year or two while trying to rebuild.

Once we've had that bad 'rebuilding taste' in our mouths, we'd be able to appreciate and up and coming team. We would actually appreciate a team just making the playoffs (even as a wild card). Meanwhile if we don't rebuild 'just making the playoffs' will seem like a huge failure.

So count me in the camp of 'it's ok to go backwards before we go forwards again'

Parcels and Belichick won a SN with SImms (very good) and his back up (quite an anchievement)

The next QB if coached up can win a Super Bowl as long as he has a good team. He may never be Brady, but I want the team to entirely always be trying to retool. Brady came from the 6th round, yes he is the exception, but I do believe great QBs can come from other draft spots than the top 10 of round 1.

 

[mosslost]

@mosslost

You can win despite limitations at QB (early Ravens, TB). And re: Marino, obviously an excellent QB. But there is something to be said for his inability to win the SB. It doesn’t mean he isn’t great, but IMO it does mean he’s not as great as some would suggest.

Winning is the only thing. Only thing. If you don’t win, all you’re doing is collecting a paycheck. That is fine, but not great.

but you said "suck" before for not winning a Super Bowl. He did only get there once. I think it is important for us to admit honestly the extent to just how much football is a total team game, and how much winning the SUper Bowl is about a total team effort. It does not or should not diminish Brady's greatness.

If anything it should make us appreciate the GOAT level greatness that the New England Patriots as a whole has become.

I was on a Packer board and they were talking about "elite franchises" and they were working out their definition of what makes a franchise elite. They basically correctly came to the conclusion that at the moment and for recent times, there is only one elite franchise, the NEP. I like that.

 

[Boston Boxer]

we couldn't handle them losing the 5 games they did this year...no way we can handle a 2 win season.

 

[Tony2046]

I'm not giving up on the Etling gun just yet.

 

[mosslost]

The bust rate is so high for even #1 overall picks that tanking on purpose is just a bad strategy on a basic level. There are hidden costs too, like scaring away coaching and free agent talent if you turn your franchise into an atomic waste dump.

Look at the Chiefs, they went from good seasons with Alex Smith to having a great season with Mahomes on his rookie contract with a loaded offensive team. Their future is bright and they didn't have to go into the toilet to get there.

THIS totally.

It is one thing if you genuinely suck and go 2-14 because you suck and the next Super QB drops in your lap. But we are so far with this organization away from ever sucking that bad. To suck THAT bad not only Brady would need to be gone, but the whole coaching staff, and maybe even Jonathan would need to be holding the torch before that ever happens.

 

[Steve102]

we couldn't handle them losing the 5 games they did this year...no way we can handle a 2 win season.

Big difference losing 5 with Brady/Belichick than losing 10+ with some guy named JAG. Having said that, yes, there is a large portion of the fan base that will don Mahomes jerseys and head on over to them, or whatever team is the flavor of the week.

 

[BTTA]

OK, for those of you who think having a very bad year is a good strategic move, imagine yourself in a sports bar (or at work) dealing with the fans of other AFC East teams, after a year that ends like this:

Miami 10-6
NYJ 9-7
Buffalo 7-9
NE 2-14

 

[Angelpats]

The tanking mentality is for a losing organization and fan base. It’s not happening here, and I think most of us would be disappointed if this team tried that. More great qbs have been drafted in the later rounds than the first round so there is real possibility that a tank job would get you a bust in addition to imprinting a loser mentality to the whole franchise.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Didn't Belichick say that he had no desire to emulate the 2011 Colts (when they sucked for Luck)?

 

[IllegalContact]

Clayton Thorson in round 3

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

“************” - Bill Belichick