Chandler Jones Traded

[Rhodey]

Its not a guarantee, but its about a coin flip that they'll get a decent player for the next 4 years... and they also have like 11 picks so they can move up if they really like a guy

These are all 2nd round talents they got;

Matt Light
Deion Branch
Eugene Wilson
Patrick Chung
Sebastian Vollmer
Rob Gronkowski
Brandon Spikes
Shane Vereen
Jamie Collins
Jimmy Gorrapalo


Its not an ideal situation to lose Jones, I really liked the idea of having him this year to make another title run.. but they obviously didn't envision him in their long term plans, so getting a 2nd + a player isn't a horrible deal under the assumption that they would have moved on from him next year and only got a 3rd in 2018

With Scar, Cooper has a legitimate chance to take a starting role on the interior of the line and the Patriots recoup lost draft capital with the 2nd, plus the cap room that was freed up

That's a lot of stuff to get done in one deal. Very efficient.

Of course, now they've also signed Long. What can he add? Suppose he has a great season..just kind of takes to the area? I believe his brother mentioned that he'll look great in a Pats uniform.

And that list of 2nd rounders you provided speaks volumes! Too bad so many are posting up about the few bad selections they made in the past. Regardless, it's a good bet that the NEP will add another to your list.

Cap space room, is good.

 

[Froob]

Do you guys think Sheard can be re-signed or will he get absurd money too?

 

[patfanken]

That's not correct. At the start of the 2017 league year, the fifth-year tender becomes guaranteed for skill as well as injury.

Actually THAT is not true. It's been mentioned by several sources, including Miguel that if the Pats pick up his 5th year option in May, he can be cut anytime before the first game of the 2017 season (around 9/1) with no cap consequence to the Pats. That $11MM option becomes guaranteed for skill only after he is on the roster for the first game of the season. The biggest risk for the Pats is that they pick up the option and he gets hurt and can't play in 2017

 

[BradyFTW!]

Not really worried about the big cap hit if they pick up his fifth year option. If he doesn't pan out in 2016 they can cut him any time before 9/1 2017 and have him cost $0 for that year. OR they can decline his option and put him in the position to be playing for his career this year and deal with the cap consequences later.

Unless he gets injured. The fifth year option is guaranteed for injury.

 

[BobDigital]

Unless he gets injured. The fifth year option is guaranteed for injury.

I believe that is only if we pick up his 5th year option come this May. If we do not and he gets injured we dont need to pay him. I highly doubt we pick that option up. If we want to keep him after this year we can sign him for less than 11M a year.

 

[Rhodey]

Gronk was pick 42 and Collins was 52, by the time you get yo the 60 you end up with Tavon Wilson, Aaron Dobson, and Jordon Ricahrds.

So, somewhere between picks 52 and 60, some very bad stuff happens?

Of course, one might have posted failed #1st round picks, as well...some worse than the after-60 picks you provided.

 

[BradyFTW!]

I believe that is only if we pick up his 5th year option come this May. If we do not and he gets injured we dont need to pay him. I highly doubt we pick that option up. If we want to keep him after this year we can sign him for less than 11M a year.

Yeah, that's correct. The person I was responding to was advocating for picking up the option. I agree that the Pats won't (and shouldn't) pick it up.

 

[TBR]

Do you guys think Sheard can be re-signed or will he get absurd money too?

Yeah I'm kind of "worried" he'll have a big year with production that puts him right up there with the big payday DEs at around $12-17m.You could argue he's better than Vernon.

With that being said, their other option would be to extend him in the coming months... although that might come across a bit odd since it would be before Hightower/Collins who've been here much longer.

If Sheard, Butler, Collins, Hightower continue to do their thing, all 4 of them are easily worth $10m or more per year. Makes me nervous thinking about 1 of them potentially leaving in addition to Jones.

 

[BobDigital]

Yeah, that's correct. The person I was responding to was advocating for picking up the option. I agree that the Pats won't (and shouldn't) pick it up.

As i side not I am curious how many guards make 11M? Do any?

That is insane for a guard. Even top ones make more like 7-8M a year and they are proven probowlers IIRC.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Gronk was pick 42 and Collins was 52, by the time you get yo the 60 you end up with Tavon Wilson, Aaron Dobson, and Jordon Ricahrds.

And Allen Robinson, and Jarvis Landry, and Kony Ealy, and Travis Kelce, and Tyrann Mathieu, and Kelechi Osemele, and Vinny Curry, and Olivier Vernon.

All of those guys were picked between 60 and 72 just between 2012 and 2014. And I would absolutely love to have any of them on the Pats.

 

[BradyFTW!]

As i side not I am curious how many guards make 11M? Do any?

That is insane for a guard. Even top ones make more like 7-8M a year and they are proven probowlers IIRC.

The deal that Kelechi Osemele just signed pays him in that range, but no, no other guard even makes $10M, let alone $12M. Unfortunately, for franchise tag / rookie option purposes, offensive line is considered a single position, so there's no distinction made between guards and, say, left tackles.

 

[Froob]

Actually THAT is not true. It's been mentioned by several sources, including Miguel that if the Pats pick up his 5th year option in May, he can be cut anytime before the first game of the 2017 season (around 9/1) with no cap consequence to the Pats. That $11MM option becomes guaranteed for skill only after he is on the roster for the first game of the season. The biggest risk for the Pats is that they pick up the option and he gets hurt and can't play in 2017

Makes me wonder why the Bucs didn't pick up Doug Martin's option if they could just cut him anyways. Some of these team's management are just so incredibly stupid.

 

[Love The Drake]

Gronk and Kelce would be bonkers.
But I dont know why so many teams passed on Robinson.

 

[Gronk]

Yeah, that's correct. The person I was responding to was advocating for picking up the option. I agree that the Pats won't (and shouldn't) pick it up.

Maybe I missed it but is there really any reason to believe that even if Cooper turned out to be a total beast in 2016 that they couldn't sign him for something at most approximating half of that $11m number?

Also I thought I read somewhere the Raiders paid that believing Osmele would play at T?

 

[Rhodey]

so we traded jones for a late 2nd? felt like we could of gotten more..

If Cooper plays well, the NEP will get more...his service and a draft pick if/when he moves one..they all win.

They also freed a lot of cap space, so let's watch what that might have enabled to team to do.

And if they do as well as they have historically in the 2nd round, they may get a lot more in that 2nd round of 2016 than they would have in the 3rd round of 2018.

 

[Rhodey]

Yea 1 year rental unless they can work out an extension, which im sure would negate the $11 mill bonus next year as an option

Hypothetically, it might take Cooper a half a season to get it in NE. This could make him situationally more valuable (i.e. NEP making a 2017 run) than he is from a long-term contract standpoint.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Maybe I missed it but is there really any reason to believe that even if Cooper turned out to be a total beast in 2016 that they couldn't sign him for something at most approximating half of that $11m number?

Also I thought I read somewhere the Raiders paid that believing Osmele would play at T?

Rumor is that the Raiders hope to play Osemele at tackles (which I hate and think they shouldn't do), but I think the general idea is that even if that doesn't work, he's still a known quantity as an elite guard. Good point, though.

And yeah, I agree. Even using this offseason's new normal as a guideline, I would expect Cooper to be available for a lot less than $12M, even if he does manage to live up to his pre-draft billing and become one of the best guards in the league.

 

[supafly]

And he still fetched a first-rounder. Have to wonder what Al Davis would've given us for Jones if he were still around.

Wait....did you just seriously attempt to compare Chandler Jones to Richard Seymour?

 

[supafly]

Yea 1 year rental unless they can work out an extension, which im sure would negate the $11 mill bonus next year as an option

Absolutely. No use even considering the 11m dollar option. We all know that isn't happening.

There are examples of players whose teams pass on picking up the 5th year option like Dallas and Mo Claiborne, who became a free agent, but eventually resigned with DAL for a 1 year deal worth around 3.5m dollars. I'd have to expect the same for Cooper if he does well, although we'd obviously hope that they'd lock him up prior to even reaching free agency.

 

[supafly]

so we traded jones for a late 2nd? felt like we could of gotten more..

NFL trades are often overvalued, particularly here when it pertains to our own players. Look no further than some of the talk about high round picks for players who barely brought anything at all back in return.

Jones was never going to be a first round pick, despite the opinions of some. As a matter of fact, it's been reported that 4 teams were involved and at least a couple of them passed on a SECOND round pick, let alone a second + a player.

In my opinion, you really have to be an "elite" and proven player to bring in a top 50 draft pick. Just because someone overpaid for Charlie Whitehurst doesn't mean that it happens often.