Browns might file a grievance against the Colts

[workhorse]

You are missing the point. Neither coach acted logically in that end game situation...

Dungy chose not to use a timeout when using it would likely have changed the situation from a sure loss to an improbable chance at a win. Why would Dungy do that?

Fisher chose to kneel 3 times when the situation called for running plays on the first 3 downs. Titans had 1st down and 1:54 remaining. If Indy used its timeout, Fisher knew he could count on 2 0:40 runoffs (playclock after second and third down). That left 34 seconds. He had 4 plays to kill that time...a little over 8 seconds a play. Kneel downs are the worst possible way to kill that time. In fact, I can never remember a time when a team takes a knee unless they can kill the clock for a half.

Fisher may have suspected that Dungy wouldn't take the last timeout...but he would be lessening his team's playoff chances on a hunch. Why would Fisher do that?

Both coaches acted in ways that were counter to the best interest of their team winning. If there was no collusion, then you have to ask yourself why both of them would act this way. The actions weren't arbitrary so there was some thought process with some definable benefit that lead to that ending.

If there was collusion, that would be a devastating blow to the competitive integrity of the NFL. Because the Titans may have lost this game and let the Browns in the playoffs? Of course not. Because it brings into question the other times when collusion may have occurred. Wins that save a coaches job? Allowing a player to set an all-time record? Keeping a game under the spread to cover a bet? It is a slippery slope.

Also, what is the payoff for the collusion? Donations to a pet charity? Favorable trade conditions on draft day? A promise to return the favor?

If you say there was no collusion, you need to explain why both coaches acted illogically at the same exact time. If you say there was collusion but it is no big deal, you are fooling yourself. The league should get Dungy and Fisher behind closed doors and threaten them with severe penalties if anything like this happens again.

First, how many threads do you guys need on this topic?

Second, if the Titans take a knee and the Colts call time out, the Titans can run a play on the next down. They are not forced to continue taking knees once they take the first one. If Fisher guesses wrong, he has plenty of opportunity to change his plan.

Third, the Colts would not have run a play if the had gotten the ball back. They would have just taken a knee. From their perspective there was no benefit in running a final play or two. Trying to avoid injury at that point was all that was left.

 

[Pats_AZ]

You are missing the point. Neither coach acted logically in that end game situation...

Dungy chose not to use a timeout when using it would likely have changed the situation from a sure loss to an improbable chance at a win. Why would Dungy do that?

Fisher chose to kneel 3 times when the situation called for running plays on the first 3 downs. Titans had 1st down and 1:54 remaining. If Indy used its timeout, Fisher knew he could count on 2 0:40 runoffs (playclock after second and third down). That left 34 seconds. He had 4 plays to kill that time...a little over 8 seconds a play. Kneel downs are the worst possible way to kill that time. In fact, I can never remember a time when a team takes a knee unless they can kill the clock for a half.

Fisher may have suspected that Dungy wouldn't take the last timeout...but he would be lessening his team's playoff chances on a hunch. Why would Fisher do that?

Both coaches acted in ways that were counter to the best interest of their team winning. If there was no collusion, then you have to ask yourself why both of them would act this way. The actions weren't arbitrary so there was some thought process with some definable benefit that lead to that ending.

If there was collusion, that would be a devastating blow to the competitive integrity of the NFL. Because the Titans may have lost this game and let the Browns in the playoffs? Of course not. Because it brings into question the other times when collusion may have occurred. Wins that save a coaches job? Allowing a player to set an all-time record? Keeping a game under the spread to cover a bet? It is a slippery slope.

Also, what is the payoff for the collusion? Donations to a pet charity? Favorable trade conditions on draft day? A promise to return the favor?

If you say there was no collusion, you need to explain why both coaches acted illogically at the same exact time. If you say there was collusion but it is no big deal, you are fooling yourself. The league should get Dungy and Fisher behind closed doors and threaten them with severe penalties if anything like this happens again.

Wow, you said everything that i wish i could have thought to say!! great post!!:agree:

 

[Pats_AZ]

Third, the Colts would not have run a play if the had gotten the ball back. They would have just taken a knee. From their perspective there was no benefit in running a final play or two. Trying to avoid injury at that point was all that was left.

And that my friends is the difference between the Colts and the Pats.

 

[the Patriot]

I hope these accusations go away. What are we looking at here, a possible fine? The last thing we need is a fired up Colts team. I just want Manning to come into Foxborro, lie down like every year, and we'll be on our way. :violent:

 

[spacecrime]

Listen it's news and it was brought up !

Don't worry about it. F.B.N.'s been a dork for years.

 

[spacecrime]

Third, the Colts would not have run a play if the had gotten the ball back. They would have just taken a knee. From their perspective there was no benefit in running a final play or two. Trying to avoid injury at that point was all that was left.

You play to win the game. For 60 minutes. After all the whining you guys did when the Pats played out every game, you still haven't gotten the message.

 

[Metaphors]

Second, if the Titans take a knee and the Colts call time out, the Titans can run a play on the next down. They are not forced to continue taking knees once they take the first one. If Fisher guesses wrong, he has plenty of opportunity to change his plan.

Third, the Colts would not have run a play if the had gotten the ball back. They would have just taken a knee. From their perspective there was no benefit in running a final play or two. Trying to avoid injury at that point was all that was left.

All completely beside the point. Both coaches were faced with a situation (1:56 left, 1 timeout, 6 point lead) and both coaches made decisions that did not maximize their chances of winning that game. You can't dispute this because it is a fact.

Why would they do this? I can't explain it...you can't explain it. Fisher's explanation is insulting. Dungy's actions (giving up when there was still a chance for victory) lack any sense of integrity and are probably against the operating policies of the NFL (I'm sure there was a memo sometime reminding coaches that it is bad to give up during a game).

Are you really suggesting that had the Titans missed the FG on 4th down, with 20+ seconds left down by 6 points, the Colts would have taken a knee?

BTW, what was the point spread for that game? Just wondering...

 

[jmt57]

On one hand it really didn't affect the outcome. On the other hand, if Dungy is going to make comments about sideline videos, then he should be very prepared for the onslaught of comments that are sure to come his way after this, and deservedly so.

 

[weswelker#83]

Cleveland.com and Browns fans accuse Tennessee and Indianapolis of collusion

http://blog.cleveland.com/sports/2008/01/titans_colts_guilty_of_collusi.html

 

[PatsFaninAZ]

I think "collusion" is bad, but I don't like the rule that says a team must try to win. Actually, the whole thing is kind of silly. Seems like a pretty fine line between the things teams with nothing to play for in week 17 do and giving up on the last 20 seconds of a game, even if your opponent knows you're going to do it. From drop kicks to playing third string defensive players, it's a farce. If the NFL wants to do something about it, make a consequence for losing your last game of the year in the playoffs.

I can think of a week 17 scenario where you would not want to win. Maybe, for example, to keep a team out of the playoffs that you think can beat you in favor of one you would like to have in there. This should be perfectly legal.

The hypocricy of our desparation for a scandal involving another team is also palpable. After watching the witch hunting that went on for the Pats this year, I suppose there is a natural misery loves company aspect.

 

[FrontSeven]

hahaha, SO MUCH bitterness. I love it. It gives me joy to see you all whine and cry about this. Nothing will happen.

We don't whine and cry, we ***** and moan.

 

[FrontSeven]

You play to win the game. For 60 minutes.

You mean in LaLaLand.

Come on, we didn't throw Cassell into that Miami game to win it (and go on to face the Jags.)

As far as collusion goes, that's a whole other ball of wax.

 

[Deus Irae]

I think "collusion" is bad, but I don't like the rule that says a team must try to win. Actually, the whole thing is kind of silly. Seems like a pretty fine line between the things teams with nothing to play for in week 17 do and giving up on the last 20 seconds of a game, even if your opponent knows you're going to do it. From drop kicks to playing third string defensive players, it's a farce. If the NFL wants to do something about it, make a consequence for losing your last game of the year in the playoffs.

I can think of a week 17 scenario where you would not want to win. Maybe, for example, to keep a team out of the playoffs that you think can beat you in favor of one you would like to have in there. This should be perfectly legal.

The hypocricy of our desparation for a scandal involving another team is also palpable. After watching the witch hunting that went on for the Pats this year, I suppose there is a natural misery loves company aspect.

We don't whine and cry, we ***** and moan.

You two need to get a clue about the point people are trying to make. Which of the following is more detrimental to the game:

1.) A team filming the game from the bench instead of the end zone or an enclosed area

b.) Two teams colluding to determine the outcome of games



Now, answer that and you'll, hopefully, start to understand the point about "If you investigated A, then investigate B"

 

[5 Rings for Brady!!]

First, how many threads do you guys need on this topic?

Second, if the Titans take a knee and the Colts call time out, the Titans can run a play on the next down. They are not forced to continue taking knees once they take the first one. If Fisher guesses wrong, he has plenty of opportunity to change his plan.

Third, the Colts would not have run a play if the had gotten the ball back. They would have just taken a knee. From their perspective there was no benefit in running a final play or two. Trying to avoid injury at that point was all that was left.

Collusion is collusion, like it or not.

Not that the Church and Sacred shrine of Saint Dungheap will ever be questioned.

How about that helmet to helmet hit in the game, eh? Looked like reason for ejection to me.

 

[pheenix11]

Dingy Dungheap is a hypocritical scumbag.

 

[PatsFaninAZ]

Now, answer that and you'll, hopefully, start to understand the point about "If you investigated A, then investigate B"

I do understand it. Misery loves company.

Sorry, just can't see the Colts Titans thing as a big deal.

I get that people here do. Doubt they would if it hadn't been for spygate, but whatever.

 

[Deus Irae]

I do understand it. Misery loves company.

Sorry, just can't see the Colts Titans thing as a big deal.

I get that people here do. Doubt they would if it hadn't been for spygate, but whatever.

No, this response of yours proves pretty conclusively that you don't understand it at all.

 

[PatsFaninAZ]

No, this response of yours proves pretty conclusively that you don't understand it at all.

That it's my opinion that the spygate infraction was a bigger deal than this silly collusion garbage? Sorry, that's my view. I think the overstatement and cheating angle of spygate was ridiculous, but I can't see any equivalence here at all.

I am disappointed that more is not being done about the Jets end zone taping and looking into whether there was permission. But this collusion crap? After we drop kicked in week 17? Please.

That it's my opinion that we're jumping like flies on crap on any little petty thing that other teams do to try to retroactively justify something we shouldn't have done? Sorry, again I think we're being guilt of exactly what many of us condemned.

 

[workhorse]

No, this response of yours proves pretty conclusively that you don't understand it at all.

Why do you say PatsFaninAZ doesn't understand? All that post shows is PatsFaninAZ conclusively disagrees with you. Disagreeing does not equal not understanding.

 

[Bella*chick]

Misery loves company?

I get the old adage, but how are we miserable exactly?