BGC 2023 CB/PTP Thread

[One-If-By-Sea]

Your scenario doesn't really make sense. We had the #6 pick and drafted Richard Seymour the year the Pats drafted Matt Light. If the Pats didn't have #6 and had #14 instead, they'd likely have taken Jeff Backus and Matt Light would never have been drafted by the Patriots.

There were PLENTY of people who said Light should be moved inside. He wasn't and he made All-Pro in 2007 on what should have been the Pats undefeated year that the league made sure didn't happen.

The difference between Light and Strange is that Strange has shown a good willingness and ability to be versatile. The one downside to Strange is that he was 24 when drafted. So is 2 years older than most other rookies drafted with him.

Solid points. Thanks.

 

[captain stone]

Lol stop, he's not Matt Light. What's wrong with Strange staying at guard?

Nothing, really... But if a satisfactory LT hasn't been acquired before OTAs begin, then Strange69 to LT has to be considered.

 

[WTF!]

Nothing, really... But if a satisfactory LT hasn't been acquired before OTAs begin, then Strange69 to LT has to be considered.

Other then C...LT might be the most important position on the line. It's a win if Strange can play well at LT (Wynn pun intended) .

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

Other then C...LT might be the most important position on the line. It's a win if Strange can play well at LT (Wynn pun intended) .

Broderick Jones at #14 at LT and Strange at LG and we have the foundation for 4 more years on our left side. Not a bad thing.

 

[PatsFan2]

Broderick Jones at #14 at LT and Strange at LG and we have the foundation for 4 more years on our left side. Not a bad thing.

I like the sound of that they definitely have to put a wall or hedge around Mac to maximize his talents.

 

[VJCPatriot]

I like the sound of that they definitely have to put a wall or hedge around Mac to maximize his talents.

I still have doubts on the 'talent' portion of that statement. But it's true that with an immobile QB, who's not good at making plays on the run, who doesn't buy time in the pocket or out of the pocket, and displays poor pocket awareness of the pass rush, poor escapability, and takes a lot of unnecessary sacks, you'll need a premium left tackle to keep his pocket clean so he can make the plays that he's able to make.

My question is this - why was nobody coaching up Mac Jones on very fundamental drills like using his peripheral vision and feet to move around in the 'phone booth' to be aware of sacks, avoid sacks, and extend the play by a couple of seconds? It's like he had ZERO practice doing this basic stuff.

BASIC pocket drills, explained by Russell Wilson:


Instead we got plays like this in 2022:

 

[PatsFan2]

I still have doubts on the 'talent' portion of that statement. But it's true that with an immobile QB, who's not good at making plays on the run, who doesn't buy time in the pocket or out of the pocket, and displays poor pocket awareness of the pass rush, poor escapability, and takes a lot of unnecessary sacks, you'll need a premium left tackle to keep his pocket clean so he can make the plays that he's able to make.

My question is this - why was nobody coaching up Mac Jones on very fundamental drills like using his peripheral vision and feet to move around in the 'phone booth' to be aware of sacks, avoid sacks, and extend the play by a couple of seconds? It's like he had ZERO practice doing this basic stuff.

BASIC pocket drills, explained by Russell Wilson:


Instead we got plays like this in 2022:

That can be attributed to Horrible Coaching which imploded at the end.

 

[DaBruinz]

Lol stop, he's not Matt Light. What's wrong with Strange staying at guard?

I'm guessing you aren't old enough to have seen Matt Light play as a Rookie. I am and there were plenty of mistakes that Light made.

Cole Strange isn't Matt Light. He's more agile and has better footwork coming out of college than Light did. If you actually LOOKED UP Matt Light's Combine info, you'd know that Strange and Light are the same height. Same weight. Strange's arms were slightly longer. Over-all very similar with the exception that Strange played guard, but also showed versatility by playing Tackle and Center.

Maybe you should try reading the thread instead of asking silly questions? Then you'd know that it's a hypothetical that the Pats COULD look at because of Strange's athelticism.

 

[DaBruinz]

I hope you are right. People always talked about Onwenu as a Tackle but he is a Guard. Strange is a beast when it comes to working out and training. Could be that a move is possible. I think he played a lot more Guard than Tackle in college? Why if he is really a Tackle?

Yes, he played LG primarily. But he kicked out and play LT for 2 games as a senior.
As for why he played Guard, it could be as simple as that is where the O-Line had an opening and the coach put him there and left him there. We've seen guys like him before in Tom Ashworth and Brandon Gorin.

It's something that I speculated on back when he was drafted. That the Pats COULD move him to LT OR could move him to center. He played 6 halves at center as a Red-Shirt Sophomore. Then he played there at the Senior Bowl. I think he was only beaten twice. Each time he was beaten, he stone-walled the guy the next time through.

He's a really interesting player and the only downside to him is his age. He'll be 25 this year.

 

[DaBruinz]

Broderick Jones at #14 at LT and Strange at LG and we have the foundation for 4 more years on our left side. Not a bad thing.

Everything is going to depend on what the Pats do in Free Agency.

- If they bring in a LT, then we know they're likely putting Brown at RT and that an OT is likely a 2-4th round pick.
- If they bring in a RT, then we know they're likely keeping Brown at LT and an OT is likely a 2-4th round pick.
- If they bring in a swing tackle, then a LT is likely going to be their 1st round pick, though probably with a trade back as I don't think Jones lasts to 14.

I hope they bring in 2 OTs in FA. A starter and a Swing. And not, I don't consider Cajuste an option. McDermott is 31 and would be a decent back-up on the roster. I honestly hope that Hambright and Desjarlais are brought back to battle in camp. I think that both got shafted by Patricia being the O-Line Coach.

The Pats have the money to bring in 2 OTs. I think that Orlando Brown would SHINE with a Klemm/BB combo. McGlinchey has the experience at RT that the Pats could use for the outside runs.. Either would look nice.

We don't know what we have in Steuber. He could just be a camp body. He could be the next coming of Vollmer.. Interesting note. Steuber and Onwenu formed the right side of Michigan's O-line in 2020 for 4 of the 6 games. They were also on the same team in 2018, lining up next to one another for a few games.

 

[State]

Yes, the Pats need OTs. However, the Pats could sign a RT, kick Strange out to LT, and draft Reserve LT and RT outside the 1st round while drafting a top tier CB...
Or the Pats could sign a LT and draft a RT and a swing tackle outside of round 1.

Yes. Or here’s a heretical thought. And I like where you’re going here. Ask Wynn if he’s come back, but at LT?

Maybe AK can work wonders like Dante.

I know, I know. He’s dead to me too.

But perhaps he was out of sorts by being moved to RT and LG. Remember that?

 

[BizmoFunyans239]

I'm guessing you aren't old enough to have seen Matt Light play as a Rookie. I am and there were plenty of mistakes that Light made.

Cole Strange isn't Matt Light. He's more agile and has better footwork coming out of college than Light did. If you actually LOOKED UP Matt Light's Combine info, you'd know that Strange and Light are the same height. Same weight. Strange's arms were slightly longer. Over-all very similar with the exception that Strange played guard, but also showed versatility by playing Tackle and Center.

Maybe you should try reading the thread instead of asking silly questions? Then you'd know that it's a hypothetical that the Pats COULD look at because of Strange's athelticism.

Ah, making assumptions about my age, now that's silly. I've been a fan since 1999, 2 years before Matt Light's rookie year. Nice try though.

 

[DaBruinz]

Ah, making assumptions about my age, now that's silly. I've been a fan since 1999, 2 years before Matt Light's rookie year. Nice try though.

No. What's silly is your BS claims about what Strange may or may not be able to do.

 

[PowerRunRevival]

If there is a Matt Light comp anywhere, it's Skoronski not Strange. If the Pats wanted to use Strange at tackle we would have heard about him taking some practice reps there at some point last season. With all his reps at guard it seems unlikely they would move him.

This is supposed to be the CB thread though and this is really good CB class in a year where the Pats need a boundary corner. With the depth at corner it might be worth it wait until the second or third round with this class. It could be likely that the Pats have their pick of Witherspoon or Gonzalez at CB in the first (although I'd rather have one of the top 3 tackles at 14).

The Pats need big boundary corners imo. In terms of measurables Gonzalez, Porter, Ricks, Ringo and Banks all fit that profile.

 

[Boomer B]

Geez, you get away from the main board to see prospective draft picks and you get DaBruinz arguing with every 2nd poster.

 

[upstater1]

I love NFL draft and offensive line talk, but I came here to see some evaluations of CBs. I know they are in this threadd already, but the rankings of CBs are now moving around wildly, and it has me asking why.

Devon Witherspoon has shot up the charts.
Gonzalez is there with them.
Personally I like Joey Porter as well.

Why has Kelee Ringo dropped like a stone? Some have him 3rd round now.

Cam Smith has dropped like a rock as well.

Emmanuel Forbes and Deonte Banks are rising fast.

Eli Ricks is staying the same.

 

[captain stone]

...With the depth at corner it might be worth it wait until the second or third round with this class. It could be likely that the Pats have their pick of Witherspoon or Gonzalez at CB in the first (although I'd rather have one of the top 3 tackles at 14).

The Pats need big boundary corners imo. In terms of measurables Gonzalez, Porter, Ricks, Ringo and Banks all fit that profile.

...the rankings of CBs are now moving around wildly, and it has me asking why.

Devon Witherspoon has shot up the charts.
Gonzalez is there with them.
Personally I like Joey Porter as well.

Why has Kelee Ringo dropped like a stone? Some have him 3rd round now.

Cam Smith has dropped like a rock as well.

Emmanuel Forbes and Deonte Banks are rising fast.

Eli Ricks is staying the same.

A bit of pre-combine shuffling going on... Won't be surprised to see a bit more of it after the combine ends either... If bigger CBs like Brents & Garner test closer to faster, smaller CBs then they'll be getting the Day-2 hype also...

 

[WaterfallJumper]

Am I in the wrong thread? So much OL talk!

@BaconGrundleCandy Talk me off the ledge, man. I'm about ready to write to BB and ask him to trade up to get Gonzalez, haha. From the (admittedly) little watching I've done of the top dozen players, he's the most fluid and natural I've seen in a long time with easy acceleration and an alpha mentality. Reminds me of Gilmore, but potentially better, since I think he plays with more physicality/fire. I think he's going to be an absolute superstar. Pro Bowler his rookie year, All Pro year two kind of talent. What am I missing?

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

Am I in the wrong thread? So much OL talk!

@BaconGrundleCandy Talk me off the ledge, man. I'm about ready to write to BB and ask him to trade up to get Gonzalez, haha. From the (admittedly) little watching I've done of the top dozen players, he's the most fluid and natural I've seen in a long time with easy acceleration and an alpha mentality. Reminds me of Gilmore, but potentially better, since I think he plays with more physicality/fire. I think he's going to be an absolute superstar. Pro Bowler his rookie year, All Pro year two kind of talent. What am I missing?

Nope he's a really good one.

Very comfortable and nuanced at the los. Had a plan usually focusing on rerouting and using his size. Plus ball skills. He's smart and always locked in. Very physical I think he'll be a nice weapon on passing downs used on the blitz from the slot. He'll be a nice have for guys like Lazard who are big slot bullys. He's got good cod for his size. I've seen him have a little trouble but very fluid overall. I mean we need a big boundary to cap off this secondary and a few will absolutely be sitting at 14 or within reach. So it'll be on Bill to decide Porter, Gonzo etc early on or Brents and Banks a little after.

Fwiw I don't think Witherspoon goes top 15. I think he's going 20-40 range.

I could see a smooth transition to FS (Gonzo) if he needs to make on at some point later on.

 

[WaterfallJumper]

Nope he's a really good one.

Very comfortable and nuanced at the los. Had a plan usually focusing on rerouting and using his size. Plus ball skills. He's smart and always locked in. Very physical I think he'll be a nice weapon on passing downs used on the blitz from the slot. He'll be a nice have for guys like Lazard who are big slot bullys. He's got good cod for his size. I've seen him have a little trouble but very fluid overall. I mean we need a big boundary to cap off this secondary and a few will absolutely be sitting at 14 or within reach. So it'll be on Bill to decide Porter, Gonzo etc early on or Brents and Banks a little after.

Fwiw I don't think Witherspoon goes top 15. I think he's going 20-40 range.

I could see a smooth transition to FS (Gonzo) if he needs to make on at some point later on.

Thanks, nice to know I'm not completely off. I do like Witherspoon and some of the other corners, too. Pretty solid looking class overall.