Best Coach of All Time?

[PatsFan2]

292–71–1 says hi

 

[sb1]

I've always said there are arguments for and against every coach on the top coaching tree along with Bill to be the greatest. Coaching tree is one argument against Bill. It doesn't measure up to his peers at that level. Why? Who knows. That would be a good discussion.

Even Andy Reid who is close to that level has a great tree: Harbaugh, McDermott, Pederson, Rivera are all notables on his tree.

 

[signbabybrady]

I've always said there are arguments for and against every coach on the top coaching tree along with Bill to be the greatest. Coaching tree is one argument against Bill. It doesn't measure up to his peers at that level. Why? Who knows. That would be a good discussion.

Even Andy Reid who is close to that level has a great tree: Harbaugh, McDermott, Pederson, Rivera are all notables on his tree.

If only Andy Reid had a chance to prove he was a better coach by beating Bill in a SB or AFC Championship.

Not to mention 3 more SB victories.

 

[sb1]

Interesting article on the lack of success of Bill’s coaching tree. I just think the greatest coach ought to not only lift up his players but also his assistants at the same time.

Why has the Bill Belichick coaching tree produced such imperfect fruit?

In 38 combined seasons, Bill Belichick's coaching tree has combined for just three playoff wins. So why is it so bad?

www.nytimes.com

 

[TheRainMaker]

Interesting article on the lack of success of Bill’s coaching tree. I just think the greatest coach ought to not only lift up his players but also his assistants at the same time.

Why has the Bill Belichick coaching tree produced such imperfect fruit?

In 38 combined seasons, Bill Belichick's coaching tree has combined for just three playoff wins. So why is it so bad?

www.nytimes.com

They don't have success because they are just copying Bill and were extremely arrogant.

Broncos players said that Josh McDaniels held a meeting and told them not to worry about the trade of Jay Cutler because he "could turn any High School QB into an All Pro".

Fatt Matt told Lion's players during their first meeting that he was the reason the Pats won the Super Bowls and that they were "nothing".

Giants players couldn't stand Judge Joey.

Bill's assistants that took over from the 1st dynasty were real **** heads.

 

[sb1]

They don't have success because they are just copying Bill and were extremely arrogant.

Broncos players said that Josh McDaniels held a meeting and told them not to worry about the trade of Jay Cutler because he "could turn any High School QB into an All Pro".

Fatt Matt told Lion's players during their first meeting that he was the reason the Pats won the Super Bowls and that they were "nothing".

Giants players couldn't stand Judge Joey.

Bill's assistants that took over from the 1st dynasty were real **** heads.

Agreed. Case in point

 

[sb1]

Someone wrote a thesis on BB. Lol

https://scholarship.claremont.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=2574&context=cmc_theses

 

[1960Pats]

I’d like to know who he means by that statement because Bill never let more “top-end” offense players walk. The only player in that category would be Thuney. I can agree with good players, but not top-end or elite.

That part was me, not Curran. I was thinking along the lines of Brady and Gronk.

 

[1960Pats]

Someone wrote a thesis on BB. Lol

https://scholarship.claremont.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=2574&context=cmc_theses

I had to check out the young man's 'Why Coaching Matters" pages. It was nice of him to mention other factors that could influence a team's success. He had players listed fifth, right behind trainers. That may be one of the most comical things I've seen.

Does the young man mention Brady at all in his thesis? I didn't want to read all 100 pages to see, but I think he had a little to do with Bill's success as a HC.

 

[Wozzy]

All any coach needs is a

I had to check out the young man's 'Why Coaching Matters" pages. It was nice of him to mention other factors that could influence a team's success. He had players listed fifth, right behind trainers. That may be one of the most comical things I've seen.

Does the young man mention Brady at all in his thesis? I didn't want to read all 100 pages to see, but I think he had a little to do with Bill's success as a HC.

All Bill's good/great players had to do with his success. How did they arrive in New England... did they just magically appear?

 

[sb1]

I had to check out the young man's 'Why Coaching Matters" pages. It was nice of him to mention other factors that could influence a team's success. He had players listed fifth, right behind trainers. That may be one of the most comical things I've seen.

Does the young man mention Brady at all in his thesis? I didn't want to read all 100 pages to see, but I think he had a little to do with Bill's success as a HC.

I wish there was a public sample of that book he cites - Coaching Matters by Brad Adler. Tempting to buy it just to see his reasoning for - as the thesis says, "Adler disproves all claims that the coach wasn’t the most important factor in the team’s success through multiple case studies throughout the NFL’s history (310, 313, 332)."

Belichick was omitted from his greatest coaches list probably because it was published in 2003... too bad because BB and his partnership with the GOAT is THE example of why great players matter more than great coaches.

 

[1960Pats]

I always appreciated the defensive players the most. Ted Washington plugging the middle. Tedy Bruschi stonewalling Oakland on 2nd and short in the snow game, Willie McGinest, my favorite playmaker perfectly executing BB's game plans., Ty law, brash playmaker, Rodney, underrated Phifer and Pleasant, Vince, Hightower looking like Willie. So many more. One of the greatest team accomplishments that doesn't get much play was the 21-game win streak. We were lucky to have them all.

Imagine the attention that streak would be getting if it was one of many other teams.
I also enjoy defense. That's Bill's strength and it showed with that group The lousy part is that they spent their last years together without Brady because KC took him out in 2008. I've been a Troy Brown fan, and he, like many you mentioned above have left us with an incredible amount of memories. The OT in Miami and his punt returns are just a few.

And as timing would have it, I had forgotten what happened to me Monday but this response brought it back. There I was, sitting in the North End at Modern Pastry, having a coffee and a pastry, and I see this very attractive woman walking in front of me with 3 little kids walking behind her. Then I look at dad bringing up the rear and he looks familiar. When I glanced back at his wife I gave her a look and she points me out to him and he turns. He's right outside the window and asked him if he was Wes. When he said yes I quietly thanked Wes Welker for his years here and he thanked me in me return for my comment. It was all very low keyed.

 

[1960Pats]

All any coach needs is a

All Bill's good/great players had to do with his success. How did they arrive in New England... did they just magically appear?

We've been through this before.

This thread is asking the question who is the best coach of all time. I chose Lombardi and I'm sticking to it.

 

[Wozzy]

We've been through this before.

This thread is asking the question who is the best coach of all time. I chose Lombardi and I'm sticking to it.

That’s fine, that you think Bill had Tom so his accomplishments are diminished when Lombardi had Bart Star is IMO a flawed argument… especially in the modern age with a salary cap. Players back then were basically owned by teams.

Just as an aside, I never thought for a second any of the BB haters here would vote for him and would be giving a hundred reasons why he wasn’t.

 

[1960Pats]

If we're going to just call Saban a 15-17 coach then of course it's not ideal. But in the real world Saban's a Mic drop.

Since when do college records count in evaluating a pro coach? Saban blew chunks in the NYFL for the same reason that some of those others did. They brought the same arrogance that didn't work for Bill lately.

 

[1960Pats]

That’s fine, that you think Bill had Tom so his accomplishments are diminished when Lombardi had Bart Star is IMO a flawed argument… especially in the modern age with a salary cap. Players back then were basically owned by teams.

Just as an aside, I never thought for a second any of the BB haters here would vote for him and would be here giving a hundred reasons why he wasn’t.

I never said any of that.

I've seen a few fans in this thread who picked someone other than Bill as the best of all time. Are they all haters because they didn't pick Bill?

I don't think it's fair to criticize coaches who performed in different eras than the current one. All we can do is compare teams and players to their peers.

The one advantage that current players have is that they're going against weaker teams than players from other eras. Take half the teams in the NYFL out and redraft the players. The NYFL would be a much stronger league.

 

[0818NePa]

Brown

 

[Wozzy]

I never said any of that.

I've seen a few fans in this thread who picked someone other than Bill as the best of all time. Are they all haters because they didn't pick Bill?

I don't think it's fair to criticize coaches who performed in different eras than the current one. All we can do is compare teams and players to their peers.

The one advantage that current players have is that they're going against weaker teams than players from other eras. Take half the teams in the NYFL out and redraft the players. The NYFL would be a much stronger league.

I’m basing that opinion off things you said before.

Also many guys back in the day had real jobs as plumbers or carpenters. They smoked cigars and drank beers at halftime… but sure…. harder.

 

[sb1]

Since when do college records count in evaluating a pro coach? Saban blew chunks in the NYFL for the same reason that some of those others did. They brought the same arrogance that didn't work for Bill lately.

Another case in point: Urban Meyer. Elite in the college ranks, a complete disaster in the NFL... and he was as arrogant as it gets.

 

[h0c2000]

I put Joe Gibbs above Shula on my list.

Also, Lombardi's record without Bart Start 0.633. That's pretty good.