Belichick's 'prove it' time table.

[lancerman]

That’s the tricky part because as great as Bill’s D were if he didn’t have the QB that made the key plays at the end of each of those SB, you win nothing.

Yup. At least in the Panthers game, the defense completely crapped the bed and Vinatieri went 1 for 3 in field goals. Brady played Superman that day. He was also asked to make a comeback and then a game winning drive in the snow vs the Raiders and against an amazing Rams defense in the Super Bowl in 01

 

[lancerman]

If the league has as many QB's being available as it looks right now, the Pats will have no excuse for not fielding a better field general than what Cam was this year. You have possibly Stafford, Rodgers, Watson, and Prescott all being available. Then you have the fallout from those guys going to new teams. Darnold available, JG, Trubisky? Not to mention the guys available in the draft.

My ideal situation would be JG becoming available and heading back to Gilette. Then drafting a Mac, or Trask, maybe even Newman to groom if the scouts feel they have "it".

It’s also highly likely Rodgers and Dak aren’t available and the two that are left are Watson who isn’t high on BoB or Easterby and was mad about the Caserio signing so I don’t know if he’s going to want to run to a Pats staff and Stafford who pretty much every report out of Detroit is that he didn’t have a great relationship with Patricia. So we might actually be a no go for the only real franchise QB’s available

 

[lancerman]

A point that many are missing.

Building a long term plan based on your QB to perform at a very high level at age 43 and 44 is not sound reasoning.

What Brady is doing now is unprecedented in sports history. To have expected this type of performance at his age as the basis of your multi-year forecast would not have been logical or rational. TB12 defied those odds in dramatic fashion; allegedly expecting this superior level of play to continue now is based solely on the benefit of hindsight.

The flip side to this is that a lot of other teams would have deemed Brady too significant to the franchise to not give him every opportunity to play until he proves he can’t anymore. Take the NBA, yes they struggled with Kobe’s decline, but large wide that built up a lot of goodwill with players who saw a legendary player taken care of. Meanwhile we have a bit of a stigma of being a ruthless when it comes to player management.

Brady didn’t decline, maybe he should have been the exception who was afforded every chance to play until he did, and honestly any issues Brady had in his last two years had more to do with Bill’s drafting and personnel decisions with skill talent

 

[Toofy]

I think the difference is we have greater prevalence of internet now unlike the older eras and its a data driven world. So if brady wins say another 1 or 2 superbowls without Bill and we fail to make the post season 3 years in a row without brady and Bill retires with losing seasons and we have a similar losing record post Bill , then the comparisons and analysis start coming in and the legacy could be hurt a bit.

Brady as GOAT qb is cemented, Bill is almost there , but you never know...

 

[sb1]

I think the difference is we have greater prevalence of internet now unlike the older eras and its a data driven world. So if brady wins say another 1 or 2 superbowls without Bill and we fail to make the post season 3 years in a row behind brady and Bill retires and we have a similar record , then the comparisons and analysis start coming in and the legacy could be hurt a bit.

Brady as GOAT qb is cemented, Bill is almost there , but you never know...

The Pats will have a new GM and coach if we don’t have a contender in 3 years.

We can’t separate GM Bill from coach Bill anymore. The clock has started, Bill laid down his bet and he better be right.

 

[Toofy]

The Pats will likely have a new GM and coach if we don’t have a contender in 3 years. Bill made his bet and he better be right.

Agree.. if we fail to make the post season this year .. 2022 is probably bills last year.. I am still not sold on Bill the GM.. sometimes its not wrong to admit you could be wrong and try to look for external solutions i.e hire a GM.

 

[Nunchucks]

Belichick has 2 more years to turn it around, maybe 3 if random bad luck come into play.

 

[sb1]

Agree.. if we fail to make the post season this year .. 2022 is probably bills last year.. I am still not sold on Bill the GM.. sometimes its not wrong to admit you could be wrong and try to look for external solutions i.e hire a GM.

I need to see progression from year to year. Like the Bills roadmap starting from where they were 3 years ago.

We missed the playoffs by a mile this year. Our season was pretty much over in week 11. If we miss again but we were close and a very competitive team that can beat anyone, and we have a viable long term option at QB (we know for sure Stidham isn’t) and have a lot of young and promising players - basically a team whose window will be opening soon- then that’s ok too.

But it has to begin now. Tick tock BB.

 

[lancerman]

I think the difference is we have greater prevalence of internet now unlike the older eras and its a data driven world. So if brady wins say another 1 or 2 superbowls without Bill and we fail to make the post season 3 years in a row without brady and Bill retires with losing seasons and we have a similar losing record post Bill , then the comparisons and analysis start coming in and the legacy could be hurt a bit.

Brady as GOAT qb is cemented, Bill is almost there , but you never know...

Yeah pretty much. This stuff is so narrative driven that Bill will take a serious ding if two years from now we are saying “Bill coached 10 seasons without Brady and he has 1 playoff appearance and win” . Is it 100% fair no, but it’s a little fair. 8 years isn’t a small sample size. Two more seasons like this and the narrative will be he basically had the same 5 seasons with the Browns that he had in NE when Brady isn’t involved.

 

[Rob0729]

So belichick is going to trade for rodgers who constantly talks way more than he should about coaching and playcalling in the media . Yeah sure.

I am not saying it would happen, but Belichick did put up with Gronk and his family when they were dictating when they wanted him to play and didn't want him to play. And Brady had some diva-ish things here too like having Alex Guerrero on the sidelines and in the training room. The latter didn't seem to really bother Belichick until Guerrero started to work with other players and, at least in Belichick's eyes, making them soft like Gronk.

 

[Rob0729]

He was just in denial he had fallen off a cliff and Laurence Maroney was drafted to take over. It was shocking how bad he looked in 2005 after his stellar season in 2004. The run he had in the 2006 AFCCG where he broke loose but had to concede out of bounds to defenders behind him due to him running out of gas was painful to watch.

Randy Moss flat out dogged it and fooled the Raiders organization he was "done".

What about Randy Moss in MN? Moss was a head case for most of his career and only was a model citizen for two of the three years he was here.

 

[condon84]

The idea that Belichick has to 'prove it' especially to Patriot fans is laughable.

 

[RIpats88]

This is why I think bill is going to be aggressive in the offseason this year. Besides shula's record, he doesn't want to see brady's brand rise while his goes down with cam newton or Stidham.

It's why I don't think Bill is pinning his hopes on a rookie QB at #15.

 

[sb1]

The idea that Belichick has to 'prove it' especially to Patriot fans is laughable.

He doesn't have to prove his worth for his legacy, but he does have to prove he was correct in opting to rebuild his team and move on when he did without Brady.

 

[jmt57]

The flip side to this is that a lot of other teams would have deemed Brady too significant to the franchise to not give him every opportunity to play until he proves he can’t anymore. Take the NBA, yes they struggled with Kobe’s decline, but large wide that built up a lot of goodwill with players who saw a legendary player taken care of. Meanwhile we have a bit of a stigma of being a ruthless when it comes to player management.

Brady didn’t decline, maybe he should have been the exception who was afforded every chance to play until he did, and honestly any issues Brady had in his last two years had more to do with Bill’s drafting and personnel decisions with skill talent

To me that 'keep the legend here no matter what' sounds like a decision an owner should be making rather than the GM. In addition, would Tom have wanted to stay during a rebuild at this point in his career, just for additional money? I doubt it; he's too competitive to do so.

I can't help but wonder how different things would have been had AB and Josh Gordon been able to avoid their off-field issues leading to Kraft ordering their releases prior to their suspensions.

 

[yukon cornelius]

The idea that Belichick has to 'prove it' especially to Patriot fans is laughable.

this

BB cemented himself as GOAT arguably before Brady did, when one looks at his entire body of work

 

[Nunchucks]

The idea that Belichick has to 'prove it' especially to Patriot fans is laughable.

You only have to look at Aaron Rodgers. Peyton Manning, and Drew Brees to understand how much Belichick meant to the last 20 years.

 

[Nunchucks]

He doesn't have to prove his worth for his legacy, but he does have to prove he was correct in opting to rebuild his team and move on when he did without Brady.

Why?

 

[yukon cornelius]

Bill isn't going anywhere until he wants to go

 

[PatsFan2]

The Pats ain't going to be good for a very very long time we'll be talking about the Brady years Five years from now book it!