Belichick, the Pats’ Defense, and Swagger

[aluminum seats]

Somebody here posted a nice 3rd down stop the Pats had at the end of the 1st quarter against the Bills and made the reasonable point that the team didn’t seem too excited about it. Got me thinking…does it matter?

I think there’s a couple of relevant aspects to this. On the one hand, in Michael Holly’s 1st book, somebody (Patrick Pass maybe?) said the Pats had to get their “swagger” back, and Belichick had nothing but scorn for the idea…saying the idea was to play smart and well, not with “swagger.” Sounds right.

But we’ve also seen Belichick talking to the team and telling them to get excited…saying look, you put a lot of work in, practicing, you’re out there and make a play, it’s good to get excited about that and show it. Not exactly the same as “swagger” but in the ballpark—showing it’s not all about coldly executing.

So Xs & Os aside, how do we feel about this team’s make-up? They’ve gotten rid of some big names…do they have the leaders they need? Does the emotional hit of Collins et al leaving make this more important? Less? Chris Long is a fiery guy, but you have to produce too. Does none of this matter? Maybe it’s just executing, and when a team does well we retrofit how they behave to say that’s the right way. Or maybe you need somebody sometimes to pick up the unit emotionally. Brandon Spikes is sort of a joke now, but he seemed to have that characteristic at times. Hell, a single Brian Cox hit back in the day has been credited with sparking the whole team to go on a run.

Just some musings on a bye week…thoughts?

 

[FourierSeries]

I think it's difficult for a team that has been to the AFCCG 5 consecutive seasons (and in the grand scheme of things, has dominated for the last 15 years) to get up for some random regular season game. Granted, not a lot of the current players have been on those previous teams, but they are all aware of the franchise's history and what's expected of them. I think you'll see a lot of swagger/excitement during the bigger games.

 

[Hammer of Thor]

Here's my little distinction. I view "swagger" as before the play, and "excitement" as after the play. "Swagger" is intimidating an opponent - physically or psychologically - before the play even begins. "Excitement" is how you feel after the play.

And further to that, I view "excitement" as sort of a result of other factors, rather than the factor itself. Meaning that BB is upset that people aren't celebrating great plays -- it's not the lack of celebration per se that's the problem, it's the attitude that leads to the lack of celebration that's the big issue. Sort of like the "follow-through" in golf. Of course technically the follow-through has zero impact on the end result of the hit -- the ball has already been struck so what you do after the strike doesn't matter. But a good swing itself leads to a good follow through, and thinking about a good follow through leads to the good swing. Belichick wants the excitement on big plays, but I think he was really concerned about the attitude that was causing the lack of excitement. Seeing the excitement afterwards shows you have the right attitude.

 

[Nikolai]

As far as personnel departures affecting leadership, I don't think that's a huge issue. Collins, in particular, was apparently a bit of a loner and a quiet guy. When I think of the defensive leaders, I think of Hightower, McCourty, and maybe Chung.

I've noticed the lack of excitement at times myself, but I think that comes down to the moment. In big games, or in the really big moments of regular season games, I've seen enough excitement to not be too worried about the level of intensity.

 

[aluminum seats]

I think it's difficult for a team that has been to the AFCCG 5 consecutive seasons (and in the grand scheme of things, has dominated for the last 15 years) to get up for some random regular season game.

I've noticed the lack of excitement at times myself, but I think that comes down to the moment. In big games, or in the really big moments of regular season games, I've seen enough excitement to not be too worried about the level of intensity.

Fair points, I was going to say that myself...AFC Championship game every year, it's 14-3 against the Bills, you make a stop...it's like, yeah, so? We just stopped the freaking Bills, big deal.

 

[neuronet]

He's always said he wants swagger and ****iness from his CBs right?

 

[JMC00]

Think it's reading into it a bit muhh because they didn't dance after a 3rd down stop in the 1st quarter

 

[p8ryts]

Think it's reading into it a bit muhh because they didn't dance after a 3rd down stop in the 1st quarter

I agree. There is nothing more meaningless than the grandstanding that goes on after every play. End zone dances and elaborate celebrations are ridiculous

 

[VrabelMayeWin]

I want them to look like they want to be there and to look like they enjoy it.

Think of it this way - would Brady be the TB12 that we know if he reacted to big plays with a shrug ?

 

[ALP]

i read your post OP, but then i think back to how many times butler "showed off" after a DP or tackle and think:

na, they got swagger (you just won't see it after every play)

 

[Sicilian]

A few comments that jump to my mind:

1) I do think players tend to get more excited (especially on defense) at home than on the road, because they feed off the energy of the crowd.

2) Different players react differently to big plays, and the Patriots tend to attract the blue collar, nose to the grindstone type of defender. His mentality is probably more one of quiet intensity, than dancing and exuberance. They choose to put that energy into a focus on the next play. Not saying that's better (or worse), just different.

 

[mikey m]

@aluminum seats . Great thread, I have wondered/worried about this myself at times.

After the infamous 2014 beat down by the chiefs, when most of us here were losing our minds, I may have (definitely did) said something to the effect of we need to move away from the "do your job" mantra as it created a bunch of lifeless zombies out there on defense, each guy just going through the motions of executing his assignment without fire or desire to dominate the man in front of him. We know how that turned out.

I think this philosophy/BB's coaching style is a big reason why Collins had to leave. Collins would do well under a rah rah coach who will hype him up, let him do what he wants for the most part. BB, being the cold executor, needs guys who are football fanatics, guys who can approach the game like a job, and still derive that passion and excitement from a good play simply from their love of the game and their need to win.

 

[Wheelman]

What is swagger?

 

[FourierSeries]

What is swagger?

 

[Sicilian]

What is swagger?

 

[NG Pats Fan]

@aluminum seats . Great thread, I have wondered/worried about this myself at times.

BB, being the cold executor, needs guys who are football fanatics, guys who can approach the game like a job, and still derive that passion and excitement from a good play simply from their love of the game and their need to win.

Then why has BB drafted guys in the first/second round lately like Jones Collins and Easley who all three have gone on record stating they don't care much for football and would rather play video games Than watch games. Based on belichicks recent draft history I am not sure he would agree with you

 

[BTTA]

I'm so good, I get my swagger in value packs.

 

[PF_SU]

That's the clip of Belichick talking to the 2009 team about this.

 

[mikey m]

Then why has BB drafted guys in the first/second round lately like Jones Collins and Easley who all three have gone on record stating they don't care much for football and would rather play video games Than watch games. Based on belichicks recent draft history I am not sure he would agree with you

Maybe he wouldn't. But the perfect player, with talent and dedication isn't always there for every pick of the draft or every guy in free agency. At some point you have to compromise and take guys who you like on the field and hope they buy into the system. Obviously didn't happen with Collins so bye bye.

I would say its pretty telling that all those guys are off the team now

 

[Deus Irae]

What's the team's league ranking in swagger?