Armand Membou at 4

[manxman2601]

Even if Barmore is healthy, I would love to have a rotation of studs and then before contract time use as trade bait given how much reams want pass rush. MG is very good against the run as well and he may have the quickest 1st step of the IDL I have watched. I don't like Nolen.

I would love a DL rotation of MG, White, Milton, Barmore and CJ west(I can't quit him). West is best suited as a NT but can play the 3T as well.

I want to see a violent attacking pass rush

Fair enough.

 

[dliverey44]

Fair enough.

I am not a trade for a "#1WR" like seemingly the majority of posters here and other places. If we trade for anything let it be a young ish LT. I would love Stanley in FA but I think its a matter of time until he gets hurt next season.

I really want the OL and DL loaded up, I know we can't have all probowlers but those floors need raised in both rooms and I am not sure that we can throw picks for multiple WRs that I have seen suggested and raise those OL and DL floors.

 

[manxman2601]

I am not a trade for a "#1WR" like seemingly the majority of posters here and other places. If we trade for anything let it be a young ish LT. I would love Stanley in FA but I think its a matter of time until he gets hurt next season.

I really want the OL and DL loaded up, I know we can't have all probowlers but those floors need raised in both rooms and I am not sure that we can throw picks for multiple WRs that I have seen suggested and raise those OL and DL floors.

I'm with you, perhaps not on the specifics, but I am a 'build through the draft' guy.

 

[Water Boy]

Barth and Lazar mentioned stride length as the concern with shorter Tackles.

 

[stinkypete]

Membou at 4 won't happen. Even if he is the best tackle of the class, he is a fringe top 10 player in this draft class.

I don't hate the guy, but the only way he ends up here is after a trade down. Picking him at 4 would be a Jordan Richards move.

 

[manxman2601]

Membou at 4 won't happen. Even if he is the best tackle of the class, he is a fringe top 10 player in this draft class.

I don't hate the guy, but the only way he ends up here is after a trade down. Picking him at 4 would be a Jordan Richards move.

So who is good value at 4 other than Hunter or Carter?

 

[Huckleberry1]

Membou at 4 won't happen. Even if he is the best tackle of the class, he is a fringe top 10 player in this draft class.

I don't hate the guy, but the only way he ends up here is after a trade down. Picking him at 4 would be a Jordan Richards move.

Disagree completely. Drafting is about prospects, not the finished piece. Membou is only 20, massive, and an exceptional athlete. He’s everything you want in a top prospect.

 

[manxman2601]

Membou at 4 won't happen. Even if he is the best tackle of the class, he is a fringe top 10 player in this draft class.

I don't hate the guy, but the only way he ends up here is after a trade down. Picking him at 4 would be a Jordan Richards move.

Although to fair to Stelfans he does have a point about Membou being a fringe top 10 player. Just took a look at Daniel Jeremiah's top 50, PFF's top 300 and Todd McShay's top32 and every one has Membou at 11. Also, every single one has Jahdae Barron above him and Jihaad Campbell either above or barely below.

 

[Huckleberry1]

So who is good value at 4 other than Hunter or Carter?

IMO Hunter, Carter, Warren, Membou, and Jeanty are all worth the 4 pick. That doesn’t mean I want each of them at that pick, as I would try to drop down a little and get Warren, and I would rather see them move up to the end of the 1st round to get Omarion Hampton than take Jeanty at 4, but in terms of athletes/prospect at 4 those are the players I think are straight up worth that pick, just some more to some teams than others.

 

[Huckleberry1]

Although to fair to Stelfans he does have a point about Membou being a fringe top 10 player. Just took a look at Daniel Jeremiah's top 50, PFF's top 300 and Todd McShay's top32 and every one has Membou at 11. Also, every single one has Jahdae Barron above him and Jihaad Campbell either above or barely below.

That’s true, but at a certain point I think we have to go by what we think and not the consensus rankings. Even though BPA is the best way to draft individual team needs always come into play based off of their strengths and weaknesses. For the Patriots OT is that glaring need, and that’s why Campbell has been mocked to them so many times. However coming off the Combine individual ratings change, and then free agency shakes everything up. At this point it’s pretty clear to me that Campbell is going to start falling after his Combine measurements, and Membou’s Combine performance, age, and measurements are going to lead to him moving up draft boards, and I have him as the top OL prospect, and I believe he will end up being the first OL taken in the draft. And since OL is always a top need in the draft he won’t go any later than 6 when Draft night rolls around.

 

[manxman2601]

That’s true, but at a certain point I think we have to go by what we think and not the consensus rankings. Even though BPA is the best way to draft individual team needs always come into play based off of their strengths and weaknesses. For the Patriots OT is that glaring need, and that’s why Campbell has been mocked to them so many times. However coming off the Combine individual ratings change, and then free agency shakes everything up. At this point it’s pretty clear to me that Campbell is going to start falling after his Combine measurements, and Membou’s Combine performance, age, and measurements are going to lead to him moving up draft boards, and I have him as the top OL prospect, and I believe he will end up being the first OL taken in the draft. And since OL is always a top need in the draft he won’t go any later than 6 when Draft night rolls around.

Those were all post-combine rankings but I accept the point you are making about positional value to the Patriots. I'm warming to Jahdae Barron but I just think the Pats will go trenches at 4 and if we've signed Milton Williams, OL probably has more value than DL.

 

[Huckleberry1]

Those were all post-combine rankings but I accept the point you are making about positional value to the Patriots. I'm warming to Jahdae Barron but I just think the Pats will go trenches at 4 and if we've signed Milton Williams, OL probably has more value than DL.

Manx, I know you are using valid rankings, I just think it takes time for the boards to change, and that the OL rankings will change over the next 6-7 weeks. I can’t count the number of times when the Patriots were drafting at the end of round 1 when players I wanted who were within reach pre Combine shot up boards and out of their reach between the end of the Combine and Draft night.

 

[bakes781]

Although to fair to Stelfans he does have a point about Membou being a fringe top 10 player. Just took a look at Daniel Jeremiah's top 50, PFF's top 300 and Todd McShay's top32 and every one has Membou at 11. Also, every single one has Jahdae Barron above him and Jihaad Campbell either above or barely below.

Probably due to him being RT.

 

[p8ryts]

Probably due to him being RT.

If he can be above average at RT, I'm okay with him at 4.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

Although to fair to Stelfans he does have a point about Membou being a fringe top 10 player. Just took a look at Daniel Jeremiah's top 50, PFF's top 300 and Todd McShay's top32 and every one has Membou at 11. Also, every single one has Jahdae Barron above him and Jihaad Campbell either above or barely below.

Thanks for checking that out. Very interesting.

After Hunter and Carter, there is a drop off and I am not sure anyone knows how to rank the prospects after that dropoff. Of course the various draft guys rank players every year so they should be able to rank the players this year, but difference might be that the talent from 2 to 15 is ususally 12 to 25. The talent in the Top 10 usually has a more gradual drop so it is easier to grade whereas this year the talent in the Top 10 is very similar.. Another way to say the same thing is that we should look at Top 10 rankings the way we usually look at Top 12 to 25 rankings, which is with a lot of skepticism. We normally think the Top 10 draft picks will be roughly correct, but after that there are a lot more mistakes. I think this year the mistakes will start after #2 or #3. Does that make any sense the way I wrote it?

 

[bakes781]

If he can be above average at RT, I'm okay with him at 4.

He did a better job vs Scourton&Stewart than Campbell IMO.

 

[manxman2601]

Thanks for checking that out. Very interesting.

After Hunter and Carter, there is a drop off and I am not sure anyone knows how to rank the prospects after that dropoff. Of course the various draft guys rank players every year so they should be able to rank the players this year, but difference might be that the talent from 2 to 15 is ususally 12 to 25. The talent in the Top 10 usually has a more gradual drop so it is easier to grade whereas this year the talent in the Top 10 is very similar.. Another way to say the same thing is that we should look at Top 10 rankings the way we usually look at Top 12 to 25 rankings, which is with a lot of skepticism. We normally think the Top 10 draft picks will be roughly correct, but after that there are a lot more mistakes. I think this year the mistakes will start after #2 or #3. Does that make any sense the way I wrote it?

It does, and there aren't going to be many accurate mocks this year. It's why I've been casting a slightly wider net and looking at players like Barron and Jihaad who I legitimately think may actually be the best two defensive players in this class outside of Carter and possibly Graham. In truth, I don't think we'll draft either because I think we'll go trenches but if you want plug and play starters who will be one of the best players on your defense, that's them. However, because they've been such late risers in the process, there will be many who just don't see it.

 

[Brotherblues]

Membou at 4 won't happen. Even if he is the best tackle of the class, he is a fringe top 10 player in this draft class.

I don't hate the guy, but the only way he ends up here is after a trade down. Picking him at 4 would be a Jordan Richards move.

Getting a top 10 player in the top 10 is a Jordan Richards move?

 

[JohnJH]

Its between him and Warren for me at this point.

Personally, I'd go with Warren.

 

[JohnJH]

Who was the LT on Missouri and was he Elite
Asking because if Membou could not make it over to LT in College then he will most likely always be a RT
Is that worth a 4 pick

I'm leery of prospects that come out of the woodwork after the combine because they tested extremely well, not to mention ones that are a position of need and then want to take them with the 4th Overall Pick, when if we stay at #4 there are prospects that are universally predicted to be more of an impact player. Tyler Warren is more likely to be a #1 impact TE than Membou is a #1 impact LT. That's not to say that Membou won't be such a LT (he may very well prove to be worthy of the #4 Overall). But rather than take him at #4, I'd rather trade back and get more picks and take him. If we stay at #4 and can't trade down, then I'd go with Warren. I'd rather trade down and get more picks and still land a solid player in the 1st Round and a few other players that turn out to be solid if not special. And yes, the OL has to be addressed. But at this point, there's no Joe Alt that we know of in this Draft.