Jared Wilson will move to Center

Wozzy said:

Why…because you don’t know who they are?

You didn’t know who Julian Edelman was before he arrived here… unless of course you’re a Kent State alumni.

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???
Any player on the 90 has an opportunity to prove his worth. As with any UDFA level player, there is a small chance of success. After the draft and before the roster is set at 53, we will sign 20 or so UDFA's. Sure, a couple will make the PS and the roster, but it is unlikely.

There are hundreds of folks whose business it is to scout players. There will always be players missed.

The Gr8est said:

You never know until you give them a chance.

Hell the Pats made a college wrestler into a good NFL player in Stephen Neal.

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The Great Dante Scar to be exact.

mgteich said:

???
Any player on the 90 has an opportunity to prove his worth. As with any UDFA level player, there is a small chance of success. After the draft and before the roster is set at 53, we will sign 20 or so UDFA's. Sure, a couple will make the PS and the roster, but it is unlikely.

There are hundreds of folks whose business it is to scout players. There will always be players missed.

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Roughly 30% of the entire NFL is made up of UDFA's. That's not a small chance of success.

I'd also say it's certain the best team builders do a much better job at identifying UDFA talent over the worst teams... why the Patriots dynasty always had UDFA's make the team and contribute.

It's also not about missing players, the scouts largely knew who these kids were... but they only had 7 draft picks most of the time. Or these UDFA's signed with another team because they or their agents thought there was a better opportunity there.

Every player on the 90 man roster has the opportunity to prove their worth, not all 90 players have the athletic talent to do so. I didn't highlight these players just because I liked how they looked in their uniforms, they have athletic gifts.

I didn't even say they'd make the team, I just pointed out how we were three pages in here, neither guy had been mentioned, actually they were totally ignored... and were worth mentioning.

Wozzy said:

Roughly 30% of the entire NFL is made up of UDFA's. That's not a small chance of success.

I'd also say it's certain the best team builders do a much better job at identifying UDFA talent over the worst teams... why the Patriots dynasty always had UDFA's make the team and contribute.

It's also not about missing players, the scouts largely knew who these kids were... but they only had 7 draft picks most of the time. Or these UDFA's signed with another team because they or their agents thought there was a better opportunity there.

Every player on the 90 man roster has the opportunity to prove their worth, not all 90 players have the athletic talent to do so. I didn't highlight these players just because I liked how they looked in their uniforms, they have athletic gifts.

I didn't even say they'd make the team, I just pointed out how we were three pages in here, neither guy had been mentioned, actually they were totally ignored... and were worth mentioning.

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Let's try the math
You say that 30% are UDFA's
We start with a 60-man squad (53 plus 7 on IR or PUP)
So, we have 30% of our 60 or 18 UDFA's on our starting squad.
I'm sure that this is close. Maybe the patriots are unusual.

mgteich said:

Let's try the math
30% are UDfa's
we have a 53 man squad
so we have 16 UDA's on the 53.
I'm sure that this close

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"Both of these guys have less than 50% chance of making the Practice Squad." - Mgteich

You didn't even say the 53, you said they wouldn't make the practice squad.

A third of the league isn't a small percentage.

You have no clue about these players. You're just being a negative Nancy.

So I was reading through some old articles and saw one about Wilson switching to a 2 pt stance and he said it helped him. It got me wondering if he is uncomfortable in a 3 pt stance period or if he had a hard time in a 3 pt stan5ce at LG

WhatJustHappened said:

So ahhh... who's going to play LG when ****yboy gets hurt? Wallace or some other waste of sperm?

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A waste of sperm? But you're here. LOL

Sorry the door was open and I had to walk through.

Wozzy said:

"Both of these guys have less than 50% chance of making the Practice Squad." - Mgteich

You didn't even say the 53, you said they wouldn't make the practice squad.

A third of the league isn't a small percentage.

You have no clue about these players. You're just being a negative Nancy.

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I'm not a negative Nancy. I expect 1-3 UDFA's to make the 53-man roster as in other years. And yes, more will be on the Practice Squad and available for any team to poach.

Are you saying that 30% of our team and Practice Squad will be UDFA's? So, 53+16=69 x 30% = 21 players.

I do admit that I tend to wrongly ignore the UDFA's who make our Practice Squad. Our coaches do seem to find a roster a player or two among them before someone else poaches them.

Hugepatsfan said:

Not sure I agree that AVT at LG is a "stop gap". He signed a 3 year deal and is heading into his age 27 season. He either stays healthy and he's a bona fide starter locked up through his prime. Or he gets hurt and he isn't a stop gap for anything. It's kind of all or nothing there.

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To me, that's a stopgap contract. 3 years at that money, with the current salary cap, is easily expendable.

PatsFan2 said:

11 Draft picks don't equal 11 hits Wozzy: it's a crapshoot.

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They will all be hits and starters.

Jack Daniels told him so.

mgteich said:

I'm not a negative Nancy. I expect 1-3 UDFA's to make the 53-man roster as in other years. And yes, more will be on the Practice Squad and available for any team to poach.

Are you saying that 30% of our team and Practice Squad will be UDFA's? So, 53+16=69 x 30% = 21 players.

I do admit that I tend to wrongly ignore the UDFA's who make our Practice Squad. Our coaches do seem to find a roster a player or two among them before someone else poaches them.

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Here's a list of UDFA's from last year's Super Bowl team:

Charles Woods
Jack Westover
Leonard Taylor
Robert Spillane
Brenden Schooler
Elijah Ponder
Jeremiah Pharms
Dell Pettus
D'Ernest Johnson
Terrell Jennings
Eric Gregory
Jack Gibbens
Christian Elliss
Cory Durden
CJ Dippre
Efton Chism
Ben Brown

I see quite a few (17) who made the active roster, contributed and at least a few starters. But you think these guys don't exist. Sounds legit.

Triumph said:

They will all be hits and starters.

Jack Daniels told him so.

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I already told you they don't need starters.

Also me saying a handful of their 11 draft picks and UDFA's will make and contribute to this year's team is based on real world results and history.... and it's a world of difference from you saying the sky is falling and that team that went to a Super Bowl a little over two months ago is suddenly devoid of talent.

Again... take your meds.

Wozzy said:

I already told you they don't need starters.

Also me saying a handful of their 11 draft picks and UDFA's will make and contribute to this year's team is based on real world results and history.... and it's a world of difference from you saying the sky is falling and that team that went to a Super Bowl a little over two months ago is suddenly devoid of talent.

Again... take your meds.

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I agree so much with this, barring injuries the new rooks will be contributors and if we find then starting something has gone wrong. Actually the only spot I really see a rook starting is off ball LB next to Spillane and maybe TE if they take one early as the #2 in certain packages but then not really a starter.

Lets work through this if they draft an OT-we have moses and WC so they will play here and there
Edge they will be part of a rotation
DB we are pretty set
WR with or without a Brown trade, unless they take one in the 1st or 2nd then they might get starter snaps
OG will probably a replacement for Owenu in 27
TE most likely to take over for Henry in 27
IDL part of a rotation
This team is pretty set, sure some players can be upgraded but we are in a good spot

I still wouldn't rule out drafting a late round option like Pat Coogan for competition.

dliverey44 said:

I agree so much with this, barring injuries the new rooks will be contributors and if we find then starting something has gone wrong. Actually the only spot I really see a rook starting is off ball LB next to Spillane and maybe TE if they take one early as the #2 in certain packages but then not really a starter.

Lets work through this if they draft an OT-we have moses and WC so they will play here and there
Edge they will be part of a rotation
DB we are pretty set
WR with or without a Brown trade, unless they take one in the 1st or 2nd then they might get starter snaps
OG will probably a replacement for Owenu in 27
TE most likely to take over for Henry in 27
IDL part of a rotation
This team is pretty set, sure some players can be upgraded but we are in a good spot

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Hopefully they find players so extraordinary they can’t keep them off the field, that would be a good problem to have.

Otherwise they’re looking for guys to develop behind current starters and eventually take over down the road or be ready in case of injury.

The draft is a crapshoot, but people here talking like the draft has a .01% success rate or something.

Ridiculous…

Wozzy said:

Hopefully they find players so extraordinary they can’t keep them off the field, that would be a good problem to have.

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If they can come up with one Woodson per draft class I’ll be quite happy.

Wozzy said:

Otherwise they’re looking for guys to develop behind current starters and eventually take over down the road or be ready in case of injury.

The draft is a crapshoot, but people here talking like the draft has a .01% success rate or something.

Ridiculous…

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I don’t know which is worse, acting like hitting in the draft is rarer than hitting the megabucks jackpot, or thinking it’s such a sure thing that you’d trade a top 5 CB for a couple of draft picks.

Wozzy said:

Here's a list of UDFA's from last year's Super Bowl team:

Charles Woods
Jack Westover
Leonard Taylor
Robert Spillane
Brenden Schooler
Elijah Ponder
Jeremiah Pharms
Dell Pettus
D'Ernest Johnson
Terrell Jennings
Eric Gregory
Jack Gibbens
Christian Elliss
Cory Durden
CJ Dippre
Efton Chism
Ben Brown

I see quite a few (17) who made the active roster, contributed and at least a few starters. But you think these guys don't exist. Sounds legit.

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Thank you. This validates your position that approximately 30% of our roster went undrafted.

Perhaps we are simply looking at this from different ends. I agree that the patriots are good at finding and developing UDFA's. This was true of Bill and is true of Vrabel. Claiming Durden was a major coup.
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I AGREE
that Vrabel will find a few roster players that out of all the new UDFA's now on our roster and those UDFA's signed before camp. My guess is that there will be almost 50 of these players coming and going. As I have said, I rarely predict individual players (Larison last year) but I recognize that 1-3 are likely to be on the Game 2 Day roster (after the final cut and week one scramble). Looking to last year, Chism was the only one on the team from the beginning of the season (and throughout). For me, the only one that really was a find was Ponder. That's not a lot out of the 50 tryouts. We may get something in the future from Larison and Lampe. They may the first to be on the IR for their rookie year and then become contributors.

UDFA'S FROM OTHER TEAMS
This is another category entirely. Vrabel picked up Durden, Woods, Gregory, Taylor and Johnson. Players from this group clearly have a much higher probability of success. Durden is already a key starter.

FOR ME
I leave it for others to evaluate to 50 UDFA and UDFA level players who will pass through the roster between now and the pre-season. Of course, I will follow the UDFA's signed after the draft since we will have followed them through the draft process. As I said, maybe a couple will be contributors. From my poor memory, I recall few that we didn't have interest in the draft that have surprised us. And, yes, perhaps these players are worth more effort than I give.

MY BOTTOM LINE
I have little interest in UDFA level players being signed between now and camp other than those we followed in the draft process.

AS AN ASIDE
I should look at those who signed future contracts. They should be providing camp competition.

mgteich said:

Thank you. This validates your position that approximately 30% of our roster went undrafted.

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I never said this ^

I said roughly 30% of the NFL is made up of UDFA’s. That’s just a fact.

mgteich said:

Perhaps we are simply looking at this from different ends. I agree that the patriots are good at finding and developing UDFA's. This was true of Bill and is true of Vrabel. Claiming Durden was a major coup.
===========================
I AGREE
that Vrabel will find a few roster players that out of all the new UDFA's now on our roster and those UDFA's signed before camp. My guess is that there will be almost 50 of these players coming and going. As I have said, I rarely predict individual players (Larison last year) but I recognize that 1-3 are likely to be on the Game 2 Day roster (after the final cut and week one scramble). Looking to last year, Chism was the only one on the team from the beginning of the season (and throughout). For me, the only one that really was a find was Ponder. That's not a lot out of the 50 tryouts. We may get something in the future from Larison and Lampe. They may the first to be on the IR for their rookie year and then become contributors.

UDFA'S FROM OTHER TEAMS
This is another category entirely. Vrabel picked up Durden, Woods, Gregory, Taylor and Johnson. Players from this group clearly have a much higher probability of success. Durden is already a key starter.

FOR ME
I leave it for others to evaluate to 50 UDFA and UDFA level players who will pass through the roster between now and the pre-season. Of course, I will follow the UDFA's signed after the draft since we will have followed them through the draft process. As I said, maybe a couple will be contributors. From my poor memory, I recall few that we didn't have interest in the draft that have surprised us. And, yes, perhaps these players are worth more effort than I give.

MY BOTTOM LINE
I have little interest in UDFA level players being signed between now and camp other than those we followed in the draft process.

AS AN ASIDE
I should look at those who signed future contracts. They should be providing camp competition.

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This ^ is a long word salad.

The two linemen I mentioned have just as much chance to earn a roster spot as drafted players like Caeden Wallace or Marcus Bryant.

Both UDFA prospects have talent. If they were drafted or UDFA and had no athletic talent I would call them jags and move on… which caused some people consternation when I said so about James Hudson last week or when I said it about Chuks Okorafor, Michael Jordan and Nick Leverett in the 2024 off-season.

Bad athleticism is measurable, just as good or great athleticism is measurable. The two linemen I mentioned are good athletes… that’s enough to give them a fighting chance.

Just because you never heard of them, or they went undrafted… doesn’t mean anything. How you perform is all that matters.

Wozzy said:

The two linemen I mentioned have just as much chance to earn a roster spot as drafted players like Marcus Bryant.

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Whatever.
=================
We each make our own judgements.

I think that Bryant is 5-10 times more likely to make the roster than either of the two you are pushing.

And I don't think that Bryant is likely to make the 53.

mgteich said:

Whatever.
=================
We each make our own judgements.

I think that Bryant is 5-10 times more likely to make the roster than either of the two you are pushing.

And I don't think that Bryant is likely to make the 53.

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Bryant already made the 53.

Wozzy said:

Bryant already made the 53.

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A minor detail. But don’t let a fact like that screw up a good argument. Don’t you guys dare stop now, I’m still popping the corn.