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Pats Fans For Truth Fact Sheet (collect facts) [merged]

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Or maybe the moderators should take action to prevent posters from starting "exclusive" threads that aren't open for all members. Hmmmm.

Board policy is to warn against members intent on "hijacking" threads as you've done in this case. After several warnings I'd assume they'd temporarily suspend, and then possibly ban members who are not able to respect thread topics, not to mention
fellow members.

This is a thread to focus on the actions of OTHER teams aside from the Patriots. This is the one consolidated thread for that purpose (and that clearly bothers you greatly). There are dozens of others to focus on the actions of the Patriots. Post any such views you have related to that topic there.

You've been warned several times now. Please desist.
 
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My recommendation would be for someone leading this effort to start a website, or a group on yahoo, facebook, whatever and just have people contribute links. It would be much better than just putting them in a thread. That way you don't have the back-and-forth that you obviously don't care for. This is a message board - threads get hijacked, I've had my own threads get hijacked, but what can I do? People have a right to post just like journalists have the right to write whatever they want.

Have some decency.

Have some courtesy.

Try to behave like a human being.
 
I know it's not easy, but not responding to RP is the best course of action. I ask that you all make him invisible from this point forward.

I won't say anything to the nutcase ever again.
 
Mods delete if this has already been posted:

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ap-patriots-bruschi&prov=ap&type=lgns

Correction: Patriots-Bruschi story

BOSTON (AP)—In a Feb. 28 story about Tedy Bruschi signing a contract with the New England Patriots, The Associated Press reported erroneously that former Patriots employee Matt Walsh taped the St. Louis Rams’ practice the night before the 2002 Super Bowl, wrongly attributing that information to the Boston Herald. The newspaper, citing an anonymous source, has only reported a Patriots employee monitored that walkthrough.
 
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You've been warned several times now. Please desist.

I haven't received a warning from any moderator, only the self-appointed messageboard police on this thread. If I "warned" any other poster about anything, would it really matter?

If a moderator looked at this thread, they'll see that those who have been "victimized" have been on the offensive more than they realize.
 
PRO FOOTBALL; N.F.L. Teams Tape Players While They Tape Up

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpa...933A25752C0A96F958260&sec=&spon=&pagewanted=1

From 1999 - Bill Parcell's Jets and their practice of taping locker room discussions and other goings on in the stadium

Sure its their own team... but if its this easy to record their own locker room what makes anyone think that they're not taping the visiting team conversations as well?

I'm not accusing but this article makes it seem like some pretty high tech spying equipment is a routine addition to any modern facility
 
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Please tell me we're not going to let a troll ruin the purpose of this thread! C'mon guys & gals, don't let a pessimist get the best of you. Rise above his lack of character.

There is no way one little sad-sac will drag this thread down.

Of course I'm not referring to anyone in particular.

Can you believe this person has posted 47 times in this thread?

I mean that's over 28% of the total posts!

Talk about obsessive!
 
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Please tell me we're not going to let a troll ruin the purpose of this thread! C'mon guys & gals, don't let a pessimist get the best of you. Rise above his lack of character.

There is no way one little sad-sac will drag this thread down.

Of course I'm not referring to anyone in particular.

Can you believe this person has posted 47 times in this thread?

I mean that's over 28% of the total posts!

Talk about obsessive!

Dedicating a post to another member? Talk about obsessive.

And thanks for continuing this thread's proud tradition of name-calling. Very professional.
 
Dedicating a post to another member? Talk about obsessive.

And thanks for continuing this thread's proud tradition of name-calling. Very professional.

48 posts...and counting
 
48 posts...and counting

And 53 posts in this thread are from other members discussing my posts. So you have 101, (ok, 102 now) in a 171-post thread about collecting facts. Instead of ignoring my comments and sticking to the subject matter you all choose to try and get in the last word and throw in the occasional insult. GFY - Good For You.

Let's have a look at the stats in the thread so far:

171 posts

31% discussing my posts
29% my posts, mainly in response to the other 31%
40% subject matter posts

60% of posts in this thread dedicated to the "richpats" debate and 40% dedicated to collecting facts. Great job guys
 
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171 posts

31% discussing my posts
29% my posts, mainly in response to the other 31%
40% subject matter posts

60% of posts in this thread dedicated to the "richpats" debate and 40% dedicated to collecting facts. Great job guys
Please clarify...
Of your posts that represent 29% of the thread how many were on the subject matter and how many were defending yourself (justifiably imo)?

pao
 
Please clarify...
Of your posts that represent 29% of the thread how many were on the subject matter and how many were defending yourself (justifiably imo)?

pao

Oh for the love of God. Stop polluting this thread with this horsecrap!
 
Please clarify...
Of your posts that represent 29% of the thread how many were on the subject matter and how many were defending yourself (justifiably imo)?

pao

I'd say about 17 posts dealt with the subject at hand. So roughly 10-11%.

So almost 20% of this thread has been spent defending myself from insults and other criticism. And these guys won't let up either. They will ruin the integrity of their effort just to make a point to ONE person. And I applaud them for that. They have shown that they are committed to a cause, not the one in post #1, but a cause nonetheless.
 
www.profootballtalk.com

POSTED 2:57 p.m. EST, March 2, 2008

HERM CAUGHT PATS SPYING IN 2004

The whole free-agency thing has made us nearly forget about that thing called Spygate.

Key word: "Nearly."

Matt Walsh still hasn't spoken and, more importantly, his lawyer still hasn't commented on whether reports that Walsh isn't bound by a confidentiality agreement are accurate.

Meanwhile, there's another previously unknown tidbit about Spygate I, courtesy of Gary Myers of the New York Daily News.

Apparently, then-Jets coach Herm Edwards and defensive coordinator Donnie Henderson spotted a Patriots camera operator during a 2004 game between the two teams, and Edwards and Henderson waved "hello" to it.

But why didn't Edwards make a proverbial federal case out of the situation? Perhaps it's because Edwards realized that teams routinely try to steal each others defensive coaching signals, and that part of the challenge of coaching a team is to come up with ways to protect the secrets.

And that's why the real problem with Spygate I was that the Jets' zeal to "nail" the Pats came at the expense of the league's broader interests. The staggering penalty imposed on the Patriots created the perception that this was a rare and unusual occurrence, which called for a rare and unusual consequence. As we've all learned from folks like Jimmy Johnson, it wasn't.

Hey, it was still stupid and/or arrogant for the Patriots to keep videotaping defensive coaching signals when it was known that teams were trying to catch them. But the ensuing brouhaha has somehow created far more damage than steroids or HGH or any other scandal that the league has seen in years, if not ever.
 
Mods delete if this has already been posted:

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ap-patriots-bruschi&prov=ap&type=lgns

Correction: Patriots-Bruschi story

BOSTON (AP)—In a Feb. 28 story about Tedy Bruschi signing a contract with the New England Patriots, The Associated Press reported erroneously that former Patriots employee Matt Walsh taped the St. Louis Rams’ practice the night before the 2002 Super Bowl, wrongly attributing that information to the Boston Herald. The newspaper, citing an anonymous source, has only reported a Patriots employee monitored that walkthrough.

I haven't seen this one before, SoCal - thanks for bringing legit info!

PFnV
 
BPF, another good one... and the embedded link is great too (the NY Daily News, on Herm waving to the camera.)
 
The concept here is a good idea to me. I like actuall references instead of fan opinion on this. So, since I didn't want to read thru this huge thread & might have missed something, how are u (PatFaninVA?) - whoever the original thread owner - going to conclude this thread:
* Is there going to be a summary 'sticky'?
* Try to get media / PATS people to post 'anomalously'? (Most likely impossible but someone part of Patsfans might be able to pull it off)..
 
Good reference BPF. It should go under the No Spying section.

You can't be spying if everything is out in the open. I guess Herm didn't think of it as "cheating".


Here's excerpts from Gary Meyers column:

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/f..._before_scandal_herm_edwards_wave.html?page=0



"And to show Belichick they were aware of his shenanigans, Edwards and Henderson looked right into the camera across the sideline and waved hello.
Years before Belichick had his video assistant turn the cameras on the Jets in the season opener last year that officially began SpyGate, he was illegally videotaping the Jets' defensive signals...

Sources told the Daily News that early in a game against the Patriots four years ago, Edwards, in his fourth season as Jets coach, and Henderson, in his first year as the defensive coordinator, noticed a Patriots camera from the opposite sideline aimed at them to tape the defensive signals.
Edwards had made the proper adjustments before the game to avoid Belichick stealing the defensive signals. They went into the game knowing this was a practice Belichick employed and when they saw the camera, they put on a show. That story has been making the rounds in the league the last few days.

"I will leave that one alone," Edwards said from the Chiefs' offices. "No comment."

"I respectfully decline to comment on it," Henderson added from the Jaguars' offices.

This apparently was among the six tapes Belichick turned over to the league that Goodell had destroyed in September. Edwards is friends with Belichick and they speak often. Edwards apparently didn't think much was to be gained by the Patriots spying because he never turned in New England to the league office. The Patriots beat the Jets twice in 2004 - 13-7 in Foxborough and 23-7 at Giants Stadium.

The Daily News reported in September that the Jets were aware of Belichick's passion for videospying long before former Patriots assistant Eric Mangini switched sides in the Border War and became the Jets' coach.

"At times, we would wave at the guy that was filming over there," a member of that Jets staff said in September. "We just gave false signals and waved at the camera. I don't know if they picked up our signals or not. We didn't really worry about it too much."

At the Super Bowl, Goodell told the NFL Network, "One of the coaches was actually waving at the camera, so it's clear that teams, to me, recognize that taking signals from another team is something that they do, so they have very complex systems to make sure that they don't allow their plays to be intercepted."

The Jets compensated for Belichick's attempts to steal the signals by using a second coach, in addition to Henderson, to signal in the plays, with one of them relaying the real play and the other sending in a dummy signal. They also sent in plays by using the messenger system. And they occasionally called defensive formations using a number on a wristband worn by the middle linebacker. The wristband was changed every quarter...
 
The concept here is a good idea to me. I like actuall references instead of fan opinion on this. So, since I didn't want to read thru this huge thread & might have missed something, how are u (PatFaninVA?) - whoever the original thread owner - going to conclude this thread:
* Is there going to be a summary 'sticky'?
* Try to get media / PATS people to post 'anomalously'? (Most likely impossible but someone part of Patsfans might be able to pull it off)..

1) I would LOVE a "sticky" for this thread, as a central repository for facts or fact-bearing articles on the topic! Mods... sticky? I also want the thread to stay alive. No summary, because little points of fact keep showing up, buried in various pieces.

2) We're not planning anonymous posting. The group resulting from this effort is called Fans for Responsible and Accurate Media, or FRAMe. We're preparing fact sheets and Q&As. We'll have a name and a face to use as a contact.

The plan is for a web-site, and an initial release which will go to the media contacts we can gather (a little research there.) THis is a minimum list of initial actions.

Two fact sheets are completed in rough form (references not yet in Chicago style ) Two to three more are planned, prior to "release" time. The Q&A is in rough form.

If you know a Dreamweaver guy, PM me. No, there is no money involved LOL.

PM me to get involved slightly deeper in any other way as well -- that goes for anybody who appreciates this concept! I appreciate all the fans who are putting their energy into this.

There's another thread here saying hey, just take a few minutes and grab what media e-mail links you know, and add your labor to ours. We're all doing this on a volunteer basis - so whatever amount you can add to this, it is HUGELY appreciated!

Thanks,

PFnV
 
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