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Content Post Idle thoughts: The "lesson learned" edition.

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patfanken

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Last week's 2nd half was REALLY disappointing for the many reasons we discussed this entire week in the run up to tonight's game. We wanted to know if this team could overcome adversity, both on the field and in the medical tent. We wanted to know if the WHOLE 45 could win a tough game without all our "best" players. We wanted to know if Drake Maye could bring us back from behind in the 4th quarter. We wanted to know if the D was capable of making a big stop. Well, the answer to ALL of those questions turned out to be YES, and the overall toughness of this team can no longer be questioned. Granted throughout this game all the team's flaws could also be pointed out, especially on defense as body after body seemed to be limping to the sideline.


Of course, any recap of this game has to start with Drake Maye. 380+ yds, 70% completion rate, 102 passing rate, consistently throwing the ball successfully down field, standing up to myriad hits, (10) only to get up time and again with the same demeanor and calm presence that has characterized him all season. His 4th quarter come from behind effort pretty much checked the last box on his prodigious list of things to do. Now all he has to do is DO it again, and again, and again for the 15 years,


BTW- It wasn't perfect. He is responsible for 2 TO's, BOTH of which took points off the board after long drives. And the Pats once again had trouble turning long drives into TD's. I REALLY hope Josh takes a look at that l LONG designed run Drake made to ice the game and use it more often as part of the general offense. Not only would it be effective most of the time, but the threat of it would put more pressure on defense and take a defender out of the mix to cover him, like we have to do for Allen. I've been calling for this for weeks now. Josh isn't listening,


OL - Even though there were 10 QB hits and 3 sacks - I thought the pass protection was in general, pretty good, which was surprising considering the bodies that were dropping all night. When they rushed 4 the Ravens rarely got any pressure on Drake. The were more successful when they blitzed but didn't seem to do it as much as I would have. Kudos to the players, who hung in there all night, but also to Marrone and his staff, who continues to surprise us with the quality of play he is getting out of his backups. BTW, IIRC one of the sacks came when Drake just ran out of bounds on one roll out behind the LOS.


RB's - I am NOT as big a fan of Henderson and most are. Right now, his only move seems to be to use his speed to simply run away people, and when that isn't there, gain a couple of yards. Your VERY rarely see him use a cutback or hesitation to avoid tacklers like you see guys like Cooke do all the time. And he badly needs to add that aspect to his game and I suspect he will over time. But I kinda cringe when I hear him brought up as a potential rookie offensive player of the year. He is exciting for sure and every time he touches it, he can go a long way, but at this point in time, I don't think he can gain enough 4-6 yd gains consistently enough to carry a run game and be the #1, When he's healthy give him his touches, especially in the pass game, but not "starter" touches. Hopefully he will develop INTO that starter down the road. For now, I'm thrilled with the pick, but realistic too.

Stevenson on the other hand CAN give you those consistent kinds of positive gains you need to sustain a run game right now. On his TD run, he was constantly changing directions to break free. All together in his 8 carries averaged 6.5ypc. BTW- IIRC, since game 3 Stevenson has fumbled only once and recovered it and THAT one was over 10 games ago. Stevenson has been a VERY useful RB for us this season.


Receivers - IIRC, early in the game I thought Henry dropped one in the endzone that he usually catches, and there was the Boutte ball on the play he was tackled on that he usually catches, but other than those TOUGH catches, I thought the receivers ALL did a great job, with special Kudos to the "old man" for his 140yd day. Great catches abounded by Diggs, Hollins, Williams and Henry.

On WR's in general - This game reminded me of one back in the first dynasty. It was a big game against Pittsburgh, and they had a FIERCE run D, and for most of that game we played in a 5 wide formation and simply threw the ball a vast majority of the time and made their greatest defensive strength... irrelevant. I mean we threw the ball FORTY-FOUR times. Christ, we haven't gotten to 30 for most of the season. Most of the season we have been under 27 attempts and our couple of ventures into to the thirties, it's been under 32. 380 yds and it didn't look forced, just part of the game plan. And we got it with a solid but rather underwhelming group of WR's, an odd mix of older and younger players who are just very effective with a very good QB. Kind of like the WR room we had here for the better part of 20 years.

So, tell me, do we REALLY need to get a 30MM (or higher) FA next season to be successful? Or do we resign Boutte, and hope Kyle continues his slow progression into someone who EARNS more targets, Keep Diggs who should be at least as good as he is now, but with a better feel for Drake and Josh's offense, and perhaps Hollins who is older, but seems like a dependable guy to keep around and add a draft pick to develop. AND then spend that big money on the OL or add a couple of defensive speed LB's and better DB depth. This is the kind of bonus you get to have when you have a QB like Maye. You don't have to overpay on WR's to elevate your QB. Your QB elevates the receivers.


Defense - These guys should get the courage and effort award DESPITE the fact that only forced 2 punts and at times looked like jello against the Raven run, attack. Christ, Huntly was 9/10 passing Their passing attack had an 80% completion rate and their running attack ran for 171 yds or 5.2ypc and Henry averaged 7.1 himself with 2 TD's, so statistically this was a disaster that somehow turned into a reasonable 24 points given up. Not having their top 2 players to start with in Williams and Spillane was a bad start, but then Farmer, Durden, Tonga and Gregory all went out at some point in the game. I read where Jennings had snaps at DT last night. It was REALLY the whole roster stepping up.

One telling stat was that the #2, #3, and #4 tacklers last night were all DB's (Davis 8, Gonzo 7 Hawkins7) So yes, if you're asking, our DB's are all willing and ABLE tacklers, though I wish they didn't have to be so often. Our current LB corps will need to upgrade this off season. Not that these guys are bad, but not at a championship level. I'd put Spillane at that level, but I still wish he wasn't the top LB like he is now. The good news usually picks in the bottom 6 of the round see top LB's fall. I personally hope for top Edge guy. Maybe someone who falls because of an injury concern that we take a risk on.


Refs - The call on Boutte's near catch WAS horrible, but I find it hard to get THAT angry about it. Bad calls are simply part of the game. They just happen and there isn't anything you can do about except to move on to the next play. We fans can dwell on them forever if we want, but the team can't afford to. Granted this one was rather obvious and thus more frustrating than most, but fortunately Maye simply went back to work and quickly made the yardage back. I always like BB's suggestion on replays. You get 2 challenges, and you can challenge ANYTHING, and if you are right those 2 times, you get a 3rd, Then that's it, no more. Then the game is left in the hands of the humans, period. It's fair and adds a measure of strategy and second guessing to the game.


Next week. I see 2 scenarios. The Jets looked like they gave up yesterday, but division rivalries are funny. They COULD make this their Superbowl and give it their all to try and ruin our chance at the #1 seed and have ONE shining success this year. OR they can continue their current trend and suck for the highest pick they can get. My guess, if we go up 2+ scores early, they'll pack it in. However, if we let them stay in the game midway into the 3rd quarter, we'll end up in a dog fight. Glenn looks like a guy who CAN get them up on one last hoorah. But Vrabel is also a guy who can motivate, and I don't expect to lose this game even in NJ where we will hear a LOT of MVP chants. Bottom line, I don't see any scenario where we lose either of these next 2 games. Even a B game should win. The only thing I worry about are injuries, but we shall see.


The great war of attrition is coming to an end, and I don't see a team we can play over the course of the AFC end of the bracket who is NOT a team that can beat us. The Parity in the AFC is remarkable. The best chance we have to make sure we win in the first round is to get the BYE, and we will need some help in that end. KC isn't going to be that team. They have shamefully given up and are not giving their fans their money's worth if last week's performance is any indication. BUT the Chargers WILL give them a good game, so there IS still a legit chance for it to happen.


OK read, react, and respond and above all, enjoy this highly enjoyable win before the injury reports start leaking out.
 
Your assessment on challenges is spot on. The current set up of 'this can be challenged, that can't be challenged' is ludicrous.

I would actually go one step further: each coach gets two incorrect challenges and no more. Why should a team be penalized for the officials continually making incorrect calls? Why should a coach have to consider 'I know this challenge will go in my favor, but I don't want to use up my last challenge this early'?

The point should be to get the correct call, period. If a team has four blatantly bad calls go against them, they should be able to challenge them all - rather than rolling the dice on whether or not there will be another improper flag later on.
 
His 4th quarter come from behind effort pretty much checked the last box on his prodigious list of things to do.
This was the big concern ( meaning, one of the few remaining concerns) and this Sunday’s “clutch” win was a great showing from Maye. His upside is just looking better and better!!
 
This was a great game. As one of mediots pointed out, perhaps, it was good to lose to BUF as a wakeup call to focus the team's attention.

I have 2 things to watch for in the next couple of weeks:
1) health
2) to see May NOT turn over the ball twice and offer it up at least two more times as possible easy interceptions. This game could have become the PITT game with 5 turnovers.
 
This was a great game. As one of mediots pointed out, perhaps, it was good to lose to BUF as a wakeup call to focus the team's attention.

I have 2 things to watch for in the next couple of weeks:
1) health
2) to see May NOT turn over the ball twice and offer it up at least two more times as possible easy interceptions. This game could have become the PITT game with 5 turnovers.
If we could stop turning it over in red zone that would be great.
 
Jets simply don’t have the talent to compete (besides ST)..
 
Jets simply don’t have the talent to compete (besides ST)..

It looks like they have quit on the season, but the Patriots still need to show up these next two weeks. I think there's a good chance the Chargers beat the Bronco's the final week of the season.
 
So, tell me, do we REALLY need to get a 30MM (or higher) FA next season to be successful? Or do we resign Boutte, and hope Kyle continues his slow progression into someone who EARNS more targets, Keep Diggs who should be at least as good as he is now, but with a better feel for Drake and Josh's offense, and perhaps Hollins who is older, but seems like a dependable guy to keep around and add a draft pick to develop. AND then spend that big money on the OL or add a couple of defensive speed LB's and better DB depth. This is the kind of bonus you get to have when you have a QB like Maye. You don't have to overpay on WR's to elevate your QB. Your QB elevates the receivers.

THIS^^^^
 
So, tell me, do we REALLY need to get a 30MM (or higher) FA next season to be successful? Or do we resign Boutte, and hope Kyle continues his slow progression into someone who EARNS more targets, Keep Diggs who should be at least as good as he is now, but with a better feel for Drake and Josh's offense, and perhaps Hollins who is older, but seems like a dependable guy to keep around and add a draft pick to develop. AND then spend that big money on the OL or add a couple of defensive speed LB's and better DB depth. This is the kind of bonus you get to have when you have a QB like Maye. You don't have to overpay on WR's to elevate your QB. Your QB elevates the receivers.

THIS^^^^


It won't take 30 million per but the Patriots should make Tyler Lindebaum the highest paid center in football. They could get it done for 4 years 88 million. Put him in front of Drake Maye and then draft a RT ( Caleb Lomu) and a Guard. Maye was exceptional the other night under all sorts of pressure, if you give him a clean pocket to step up into he will be unstoppable, and they will still have plenty of cap space left even after that deal.
 
So, tell me, do we REALLY need to get a 30MM (or higher) FA next season to be successful? Or do we resign Boutte, and hope Kyle continues his slow progression into someone who EARNS more targets, Keep Diggs who should be at least as good as he is now, but with a better feel for Drake and Josh's offense, and perhaps Hollins who is older, but seems like a dependable guy to keep around and add a draft pick to develop. AND then spend that big money on the OL or add a couple of defensive speed LB's and better DB depth. This is the kind of bonus you get to have when you have a QB like Maye. You don't have to overpay on WR's to elevate your QB. Your QB elevates the receivers.

THIS^^^^

I don't think they will have any problem keeping their own free agents, they love playing for Vrabel and don't want to leave. As for Williams people need to realize that most receivers coming into the league are coming from simplistic college offenses where getting open is the only requirement, and they are coming into the most complex offense in football, it's like going from learning to read to learning to read Latin. Williams, by all accounts has a great attitude and work ethic, and will become a very good receiver for him when he gets it fully. And although I don't know the answer to this my hope is that they have a virtual reality system similar to the one LSU has that turned Jayden Daniel's from a projected 5th round pick to the second player taken overall. Every player on the team would benefit from immersion in that type of system, especially the young players they are developing.

Along the line of developing players I just happened across an interview with Matt Light from the beginning of the Mayo era, and he said that the biggest issue in the league is developing players, and that the last deal with the players union introduced practice rules that made it impossible for coaches to develop players. And if anyone understands this it's Vrabel and Co. I have heard Vrabel say repeatedly throughout this season that developing players is their priority, and I believe they will use every tool at their disposal to achieve that goal, and I think we will see great results from that when all of this years rookies hit the field next season. Ironically it was the one who went to the practice squad ( Bradyn Swinson) who shed the most light on this. When he was elevated from the PS Swinson said that he had multiple opportunities to sign with other teams, which would have put him on an active roster, but decided to stay with the Patriots because he believed they would develop him into the best player he could be. Apparently they told him that he was doing everything wrong. From nutrition to working out etc... he said they were teaching him how to be a professional player, and he wants to stay in this program and become the best player he can be. Imo this is huge. I'm sure players hear variations of this all the time, but in the Patriots case Vrabel has made it clear that if they buy in and do the work there will be a place and a role for them, and he has proven to them that he will stand by them, stick with them, and give them the opportunities when they come. And while things like sticking with Stevenson during his fumbling issues make fans crazy, they demonstrate to the players that Vrabel has their backs, and, as it turned out, sticking with Rham ended up paying off big time for them. Vrabel has these players believing in him, and the result is the team buying in and believing in themselves, and we get to see the benefits from that. Regardless of what happens the rest of this season I think we are going to see these players buy into the off-season programs, and will return much better players than when this season started. They were favorites to really suck to start 2025, they will be favorites to contend for a Super Bowl in 26'.
 
It looks like they have quit on the season, but the Patriots still need to show up these next two weeks. I think there's a good chance the Chargers beat the Bronco's the final week of the season.
The only problem with the LC/Denver game is that the game may not mean anything to LC if they lose to Houston this week.
 
The only problem with the LC/Denver game is that the game may not mean anything to LC if they lose to Houston this week.


Thats why this week may be the first time in 10 years that all of Patriots-Nation cheers on the Queefs. LOL
 
Stevenson was decent for a change, but he'll have to show more consistency in gaining yards in the meat-and-potatoes job of running on early downs before I buy that there's been a renaissance. Every so often he shows a little something, and the blocking is a plus, but then he falls back into his three-yards-a-pop rut. That's been going on for a couple of years now. I still think we can do better in an early/every-down back, and I hope we to try snatch one mid-draft.

Henderson is still inconsistent in reading what's in front of him, then in acting on what he sees. He needs to think before he hits the nitrous button. It's almost as if he runs with his eyes closed. At itmes he really does just run into the nearest defender, It is as if he think she's paid to collide with people rather than move on down the field. The big plays are nice, but his size, his limitations as a blocker, and his struggles with consistency mean he'll never likely be an every-down back. He hasn't been as much of a factor as a pass catcher either as I had hoped. I think we still need our next Faulk, and it seems that Henderson, as nice an option as he occasionally can be, isn't that guy.

The O-line has been a really pleasant surprise. It helps, of course, to have our Boy Genius working his magic behind you.

The NFL need full-time, trained, regularly and rigorously evaluated refs. A bunch of aging plump hobbyists and unvetted DEI hires, left to their own devices, ain't ever gonna get it. I see no valid reason to accept incompetence in this important area as "part of the game." They already have the colleges doing their farm team work for free. They can afford to spend some dough on competent refs.

The red zone deficiencies on both sides of the ball will have to be a priority for next year. I suspect one or the other or both of these problems will boot us out of the playoffs this year, but that's OK.

I think this year is already a remarkable success for a team in eseentially the first year of a rebuild from the dismally-low state to which late-Belichick and Mayo had reduced the team
 
Do you really think the so-called DEI hires are worse than the white guys they already have?
In case you’ve missed recent developments it is now Politically Correct to dismiss anyone who is not an old white guy as a DEI hire, in any field of endeavor. Thelonious is simply showing the depth of his thinking by following that trend. Give it the intellectual weight it deserves.
 
In case you’ve missed recent developments it is now Politically Correct to dismiss anyone who is not an old white guy as a DEI hire, in any field of endeavor. Thelonious is simply showing the depth of his thinking by following that trend. Give it the intellectual weight it deserves.
Im fairly anti-DEI myself (yes, just another old guy [JAOG]), but I don’t see that as main problem.

The main problem is one of two things, and I’m not sure which it is in any particular game:
1. You can’t tell me Vegas or ‚somebody w a betting interest‘ doesn’t have an interest in some of these games and isn’t using whatever leverage they may have. The basketball issues this past year tell me it has to be there in nfl and other sports too.

2. The NYJFL under GoToHell has shown since SB XL (40) postseason in 2005 that they have no reluctance in steering outcomes.
Roger the dodger has issued numerous „ points of emphasis“ over the years that essentially created new rules, or muddied the waters enough that national announcers have to say „we‘ll have to wait and see what they rule, because we can’t tell what the rules are anymore.“.
Initially the emphasis I think was on making the product „ more watchable, by a larger audience“.. hence in 2005, the registers favored Paymeaton until he **** the bed & they switched favoritism to Rapistburger. GotoHell wanted a popular face for the league.

Then, like the bogus safety call in the Gints SB, I think it was more about trying to keep a competitive balance in a particular game. I firmly believe that same NE play in 3Q would have been ho-hum, nothing. But they were worried Pats would blow out Gints, so they figured the 5 points (2+3 fog) at beginning would keep it competitive, not determine the outcome.

Over the years this constant hand on the ref tiller has given the impression it is ok to adjust the rules for your own reasons & not just the Ommissioner’s or that there are no rules but what we want today.

I am confident there is at least one set of refs firmly in GotoHell‘s pocket & taking direction. The calls in our Jill’s game in particular & a couple others seem oriented around ensuring game 17 relevance to playoffs & keeping viewers in front of screens rather than on the events on the field of play. The calls vs Ratbirds were so egregious that I don’t know what to think.. thank god justice was served.
 
I have heard Vrabel say repeatedly throughout this season that developing players is their priority, and I believe they will use every tool at their disposal to achieve that goal, and I think we will see great results from that when all of this years rookies hit the field next season.
Food for thought: the Iggles have a guy whose job centers on developing the players, especially those who aren't consistently playing. Right now that guy is the patron saint of binkies, Connor Barwin.
 
I agree that it always feels like one's own team gets the short end of the stick. As a bitter old man I've been savagely teasing Chiefs and Bills fans on social media, so the algorithms think I am following those teams. Their fan bases are convinced that the league is fixed against them too. I know it's really us the NFL was set up to disadvantage and all, I'm just saying that everybody thinks that about their teams too Even though only we're right about it. That "DEI hire" thing looks like a weird shoehorning-in, whatever one thinks of those politics.
 
This was the big concern ( meaning, one of the few remaining concerns) and this Sunday’s “clutch” win was a great showing from Maye. His upside is just looking better and better!!

I never saw this as a concern at all, I thought it was ********. Anyone who expected him to bring last year's team back in the 4th quarter, as he ran for his life on every snap, was clearly deluded . And he's had his team ahead in the 4th quarter virtually all season in 25', so the opportunities have been few and far between. Maye has been consistently converting 3rd and long situations all season, turning drives that would have died in the crib into scoring drives that consistently put them ahead and in control of games. That hasn't happened since Brady, and is definitely clutch. It was fun to watch, and made Felger and Co. smash their TV's, but Drake Maye's clutch gene has been there all along.
 
Food for thought: the Iggles have a guy whose job centers on developing the players, especially those who aren't consistently playing. Right now that guy is the patron saint of binkies, Connor Barwin.

This is a job for ... ADAM SEWARD!
 
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