A question on my mind virtually every day [Would BB draft Maye]

[Ian]

Coming out of college Maye needed work. BB was not wrong.

He would have screwed up Maye if there was no Josh.

Also, I couldn't agree more with @RobertWeathers' assessment on this. 100% Agree.

 

[mikey m]

Yeah I literally went from nearly worshipping the dude to “I detest that guy” in 3 years.

Now he’s just a joke.

Pretty much this. I still love the idea of the mindset and mystique he built the dynasty (Brady) years around. But that's pretty much it, it was mostly an idea. Not saying he wasn't a damn good coach 2000-2018, but the real magic was #12. Plus, his obvious mental/emotional decline he has been on was in full swing by 2022.

 

[Pape]

How did he do with Brady?

There was no Josh.

He recuperated Vinny Testaverde's career in Cleveland.

Let's not judge Belichick by whatever the hell happened with Mac "Crybaby" Jones.

I love Bill. after the split, I supported Bill. I still do not think he should have been fired, but that is beyond my control. He was, its water under the bridge.

With that said, BB had lost his fast ball by then. He was not making decisions that were for the betterment of the team. Instead the decisions were expedient for Bill, allowing him to retain his shrinking cadre of people he trusted in positions of power. Small hiring circle, smaller staff.

The Matt Patricia as OC experiment should never have been allowed to happen. It absolutely hindered the development of Mac Jones as a quarterback. and I do not care what you think about Mac Jones - There is nothing negative about Mac Jones that you have thought that I haven't said here. With that said, Bill Belichick ruined his potential with his poor decisions.

I see no decision Bill made during that period that would give me confidence that he could responsibly develop a "raw" rookie quarterback like Drake Maye. The only good decision made during those years, even though it did not work out in the end) ? Jettisoning Patricia for Bill O'Brien - and even that was forced on him by Kraft....

The Bill Belichick who made those decisions was not the same Bill Belichick who built the foundation of a 20 year NFL Dynasty.

 

[Free_Pacman]

Belichick drafted the greatest quarterback of all-time, the greatest tight end of all-time, a hall-of-fame defensive end, and drafted multiple Super Bowl MVP-winning wide receivers.

It’s time we all move on.

 

[upstater1]

I love Bill. after the split, I supported Bill. I still do not think he should have been fired, but that is beyond my control. He was, its water under the bridge.

With that said, BB had lost his fast ball by then. He was not making decisions that were for the betterment of the team. Instead the decisions were expedient for Bill, allowing him to retain his shrinking cadre of people he trusted in positions of power. Small hiring circle, smaller staff.

The Matt Patricia as OC experiment should never have been allowed to happen. It absolutely hindered the development of Mac Jones as a quarterback. and I do not care what you think about Mac Jones - There is nothing negative about Mac Jones that you have thought that I haven't said here. With that said, Bill Belichick ruined his potential with his poor decisions.

I see no decision Bill made during that period that would give me confidence that he could responsibly develop a "raw" rookie quarterback like Drake Maye. The only good decision made during those years, even though it did not work out in the end) ? Jettisoning Patricia for Bill O'Brien - and even that was forced on him by Kraft....

The Bill Belichick who made those decisions was not the same Bill Belichick who built the foundation of a 20 year NFL Dynasty.

We disagree on a lot of this but there's no point in discussing this. My point of view is that the coaches were torpedoed starting in 2019. But it would require a book to get to the bottom of it.

I was just commenting on the idea that he doesnt get credit for his work developing QBs. We have very few QBs to look at as a sample, but Testaverde and Brady were positives, and Mac Jones a negative. This is mostly on the players anyway.

But, for instance, Testaverde went from being a megabust, and then suddenly in 1997, he was 12-1 and Keyshawn was crying.

 

[Jackson 2]

You guys are dupes for the horsepucky coming out of the Boston media. It's like you didnt know what you were watching for 20 years.

Thank you. The tons of BS coming out about how BB was never any good is nothing short of incredible. If you want to question his current college coaching, have at it. But, the revisionist history from haters like Chris Gasper, Tara Sullivan, the morons on WEEI and the Sports Hub are idiotic and unbelievably disrespectful and submissive. Bill Belichick, despite his personality "quirks", is among the greatest coaches, not just in the NFL, but in the history of American sports. Those trashing his accomplishments come off as petty and childish.

 

[Pape]

We disagree on a lot of this but there's no point in discussing this. My point of view is that the coaches were torpedoed starting in 2019. But it would require a book to get to the bottom of it.

I was just commenting on the idea that he doesnt get credit for his work developing QBs. We have very few QBs to look at as a sample, but Testaverde and Brady were positives, and Mac Jones a negative. This is mostly on the players anyway.

But, for instance, Testaverde went from being a megabust, and then suddenly in 1997, he was 12-1 and Keyshawn was crying.

fair enough.

Its all water under the bridge.

At this point, I only look back to think of the glory years, not what happened at the end. There's no point in doing anything else. Outsiders do enough to try and tarnish the greatest pairing of Coach & QB in NFL history. I do not want to add to that.

Go Pats!

 

[upstater1]

Thank you. The tons of BS coming out about how BB was never any good is nothing short of incredible. If you want to question his current college coaching, have at it. But, the revisionist history from haters like Chris Gasper, Tara Sullivan, the morons on WEEI and the Sports Hub are idiotic and unbelievably disrespectful and submissive. Bill Belichick, despite his personality "quirks, is among the greatest coaches, not just in the NFL, but in the history of American sports. Those trashing his accomplishments come off as petty and childish.

Since NIL started I stopped watching. But I suspect he's in over his head because anyone would be in the madness. However, I would say that people expecting results in the first 5 games would be out of their minds with an entirely new roster. That being said, I havent watched them play so I dont know if they lack ability as football players or are they undisciplined, penalties, turnovers, etc. Don't know. I just wouldn't have expected much either way.

Nick Saban's first 4 years as a coach in a Power 2 league:

6-5-1
6-6
7-5
6-6

First year at Alabama:

7-6

And this was in a much easier time when you developed your own recruits without a worry about them portaling out for money.

 

[Free_Pacman]

Thank you. The tons of BS coming out about how BB was never any good is nothing short of incredible. If you want to question his current college coaching, have at it. But, the revisionist history from haters like Chris Gasper, Tara Sullivan, the morons on WEEI and the Sports Hub are idiotic and unbelievably disrespectful and submissive. Bill Belichick, despite his personality "quirks", is among the greatest coaches, not just in the NFL, but in the history of American sports. Those trashing his accomplishments come off as petty and childish.

If Belichick didn’t ever so slightly wade into politics in 2016, the criticism he’s getting would never be as loud as it is now.

Yes, by the end of his tenure he had lost his fastball, but the over-the-top criticism he’s gets now from the media and segments of the fanbase is rooted in politics.

As I said, he coached us to 6 Superbowls and drafted the greatest QB, TE, and other legends. It’s time to move on.

 

[reflexblue]

BB has turned into an even more petty, childish, resentful A-hole than he was when he was here. I don't care what he thinks or would've done.

He may have been the greatest nfl coach but hes just as you describe him.

 

[Thelonious]

By the end of his time here, I think Bill was a failed GM and an failing HC. I take no pleasure at all in making this observation. The end of his career, whatever point in time you care to attach to it, is profoundly sad and may in the end even be full-on tragic .I hope somebody who cares about him intervene before that happens. I am watching the SF/ATL game, and it's nice to see Mac get a legit shot after his ugly ill-treatment here. Whatever you may think of his skills or ultimate prospects, he did not deserve the crap Bill put him through here.

 

[Ring 6]

I'm not putting this in the "arrived" thread b/c it's more of a history thing.

When BB was on the 2024 NFL draft coverage and basically dissing Drake Maye, why was he doing it? Was it because he really didn't think highly of Maye, or was he just p*ssing in Kraft's Wheaties? If they had drafted, say, McCarthy, would he have been as negative?

Let me end with a thought experiment: let's assume that somehow BB had actually gotten one last chance in 2024. What do you think he would've done at QB, especially given the trade offers we know were offered?

He was evaluating a player discussing his strengths and weaknesses.

He would have drafted Maye.

 

[upstater1]

He may have been the greatest nfl coach but hes just as you describe him.

Do you guys even realize the stories about him are clickbait lies with no basis in truth? I mean... I see these stories and immediately, a cursory check tells me they are lies and clickbait. "Belichick bans tweets about Drake Maye." I go to the UNC football twitter and what do I see? Tweets about Drake Maye, both before and after the clickbait article.

It's laughable.

 

[Jackson 2]

He may have been the greatest nfl coach but hes just as you describe him.

Well, if people want to call him a petty ******* (most without actually knowing him), that's what it is to them, at least. The problem arises when the disparagement of him expands from his personality to his coaching ability and accomplishments. It's disrespectful and, most importantly, just incorrect.

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

Also, I couldn't agree more with @RobertWeathers' assessment on this. 100% Agree.

Of course, nobody can get inside Bill's head.

But, I think I know enough about him to have an opinion. He did so much good hard work here, which was rewarded in success and accolades. And I love his genuine presence in the pressers, which included irritation along the way. He's always been kind, patient and accessible to fans, as far as I know, and he really loves coaching.

I think Bill Belichick has the right to be resentful. And he doesn't forget things, for example the "**** you, Tom" to Jackson when he stopped in at ESPN I think it was years after 2003.

He's still tight with Parcells, and they consider themselves to be Giants guys. They both didn't and don't appreciate how Kraft treated them and that's fair. When you throw in Fairbanks (who also coached later in NY for the Generals), it seems like when you pour everything into the Patriots and make them great, you get driven away. Kraft has so much in common with Billy Sullivan it's scary.

Anyway, Bill's one of my all time favorite coaches and I'll take the six titles, even if we should have worn our real logo and uniforms.

 

[reflexblue]

Well, if people want to call him a petty ******* (most without actually knowing him), that's what it is to them, at least. The problem arises when the disparagement of him expands from his personality to his coaching ability and accomplishments. It's disrespectful and, most importantly, just incorrect.

I dont give a **** what you think, that was my impression of him almost from the begging. he was a great coach but a Losey person. I watched how he treated people, and watch and listen how he treats people and his old team now.

 

[Jackson 2]

I dont give a **** what you think, that was my impression of him almost from the begging. he was a great coach but a Losey person. I watched how he treated people, and watch and listen how he treats people and his old team now.

That's fine. Pete Carroll is pretty much universally considered a great guy. Would you rather have had him as our coach for 20 years? That's what I thought.

 

[DoubleDeluxe]

That's fine. Pete Carroll is pretty much universally considered a great guy. Would you rather have had him as our coach for 20 years? That's what I thought.

Did he ever say he didn't appreciate his time as a coach?
He said he's a great coach and a lousy person, both can be true.
If you are offended by that, then that's your problem.
He's clearly a petty, immature, resentful A-hole, but that doesn't discredit his coaching chops.

 

[Jackson 2]

Did he ever say he didn't appreciate his time as a coach?
He said he's a great coach and a lousy person, both can be true.
If you are offended by that, then that's your problem.
He's clearly a petty, immature, resentful A-hole, but that doesn't discredit his coaching chops.

Did he ever say he did appreciated him as a coach? I must have missed that. But, I'm sure he's appreciative of your willingness to carry his water.

 

[DoubleDeluxe]

Did he ever say he did appreciated him as a coach? I must have missed that. But, I'm sure he's appreciative of your willingness to carry his water.

"he was a great coach but a Losey person".
So he admits he was a great coach. We won 6 SBs with him as our coach.
You really think because he didn't explicitly state "I appreciated his time as a coach" that as a Pats fan he doesn't appreciate having 6 SBs that BB was part of?
No one is debating he was a great coach for us, but it seems to offend you that people think he isn't a great person.