PostGame Thread OFFICIAL Week 2 Postgame Thread - Patriots Lose 23-20 in OT to Seahawks

[PP2]

He can still play the game itself and then go back and watch the film after, though.

I agree to a point but I feel like you’re not really doing him any favors having him watch someone else do the job badly.

Here's a good example of what's going on at this point.

 

[TommyD4207]

how many times was he sacked?

Would you really be happier with 100 fewer running yards and 100 more passing yards?

If we had a QB that could connect with receivers and could release in 2.5 seconds, our OL would be up to it.

It is hard to judge pass blocking with Brissett as your QB? I'm not sure that 3.5 seconds would be enough for Brissett to be effective.
==========

You're...watching the games, right?

3-4 guys on that offensive line are instantly defeated on every single pass play. Every single one. How Jacoby is able to complete a single pass beyond the line of scrimmage is miraculous.

It's not hard to judge pass blocking, when the offensive lineman is either on his ass, or matadoring a speeding defensive end every. single. time. it's not a running play. And usually when it's a running play too. Stevenson is actually that good. It's a testament to the few key veterans on offense that they're able to move the ball at all. Mac Jones had a marginally better line than this, and he couldn't do it, not even a little. Neither could Bailey Zappe.

 

[rogerthat]

As far as the lack of WR targets, this is why I didn’t want to resign Henry and I wanted to cut Hooper preseason.

Both are veterans and especially Henry, good enough to help a team win. But for this team, they are too much of a security blanket as they take too many targets away from the young players…especially when you only throw the ball 27 times.

I would trade Henry right now if it were up to me. Also- get KJ Osborne out of here and he never should have made the team in the 1st place imo.

 

[TommyD4207]

As far as the lack of WR targets, this is why I didn’t want to resign Henry and I wanted to cut Hooper preseason.

Both are veterans and especially Henry, good enough to help a team win. But for this team, they are too much of a security blanket as they take too many targets away from the young players…especially when you only throw the ball 27 times.

I would trade Henry right now if it were up to me. Also- get KJ Osborne out of here and he never should have made the team in the 1st place imo.

Outside of a bubble screen, there is zero time to get the ball to a wide receiver, without some sort of miraculous movement in the pocket. Pop Douglas has what, 3 targets in 2 games? He's a slot receiver. His patterns should be 3 seconds at the absolute maximum before he's looking for the ball. There's no time to even do that. The majority of Henry's catches were when Brissett broke the pocket (out of necessity), and Henry is looking in the backfield his entire route, and breaking off as soon as Brissett moves. That's really unusual, and something only a veteran could do, without tipping off the defense (although I'm not sure this strategy can last).

The only reason they're able to move the ball at all in the air, is because of what Brissett and Henry have been able to do. It's not even fair to say the receivers aren't getting separation. Who can tell? Brissett is running for his life instantly after every snap for a pass play. You'd think being so run heavy you could do hard playaction? Nope, can't do it. No time. I've honestly never seen anything like it. Even 1990 had Bruce Armstrong.

It's not even that they're low-level pros, they're not pro-level players outside of Onwenu, and sometimes Andrews.

 

[Pape]

Awful coaching in OT and also Brissett was terrible towards the end.

I didn’t expect much out of this team, it’s gonna be a long year and hopefully Drake keeps developing because he will most likely start at some point this season.

Never mind OT, can we talk about the last two minutes of the half,?

Mayo not killing the clock allowed the Seahawks to double dip on scoring - end of the half and beginning of the third... Bad situational football right there

 

[Pape]

I just finished rewatching the 1st half and I can 100% assure you that they did not get outplayed all day long. The OL had a pretty good first half. I could see Maye doing well with the time provided at least in the first half.

Good line play vs bad line play... it's a matter of seconds, tenths of seconds, a matter of percentages ... Onwenu and Lowe were routinely beaten... Lowe isn't, and Maybe onwenu is not tailor made for this scheme... We'll see as the year progresses....

The can play well at times... it's not all doom and gloom... it's when not everything is clicking, when you are playing from behind when clean play matters most... Needs work ... And yes I understand that their effectiveness is impacted by the QB play... I will say I am appreciative of the limited number of penalties... But overall, bad line play all day

 

[rogerthat]

Outside of a bubble screen, there is zero time to get the ball to a wide receiver, without some sort of miraculous movement in the pocket. Pop Douglas has what, 3 targets in 2 games? He's a slot receiver. His patterns should be 3 seconds at the absolute maximum before he's looking for the ball. There's no time to even do that. The majority of Henry's catches were when Brissett broke the pocket (out of necessity), and Henry is looking in the backfield his entire route, and breaking off as soon as Brissett moves. That's really unusual, and something only a veteran could do, without tipping off the defense (although I'm not sure this strategy can last).

The only reason they're able to move the ball at all in the air, is because of what Brissett and Henry have been able to do. It's not even fair to say the receivers aren't getting separation. Who can tell? Brissett is running for his life instantly after every snap for a pass play. You'd think being so run heavy you could do hard playaction? Nope, can't do it. No time. I've honestly never seen anything like it. Even 1990 had Bruce Armstrong.

It's not even that they're low-level pros, they're not pro-level players outside of Onwenu, and sometimes Andrews.

Offensive line has been poor on pass blocking. I don’t know if I would go so far to say historic but poor nonetheless. But you miss my point- if you get rid of the security blanket lbs you FORCE the coaches and players to try to find a way. It’s ‘burn the bridges’ philosophy.

 

[Real fan 02]

You're...watching the games, right?

3-4 guys on that offensive line are instantly defeated on every single pass play. Every single one. How Jacoby is able to complete a single pass beyond the line of scrimmage is miraculous.

It's not hard to judge pass blocking, when the offensive lineman is either on his ass, or matadoring a speeding defensive end every. single. time. it's not a running play. And usually when it's a running play too. Stevenson is actually that good. It's a testament to the few key veterans on offense that they're able to move the ball at all. Mac Jones had a marginally better line than this, and he couldn't do it, not even a little. Neither could Bailey Zappe.

I saw 2 Linemen bump into each other rather than the defensive player. I know Brissett is limited in his physical abilities but he has no time whatsoever to find pop.

Pop is the one guy we have that can get open in short space. The fact that he can't even see the ball is concerning. This o line is problem that is going to be a hindrance all season. On the WRs.. guys known for thier speed like Thornton and baker are absolutely non factors. Mayo's got to make some adjustments at WR.. put baker and polk out there more often. See what can happen.

 

[TommyD4207]

Offensive line has been poor on pass blocking. I don’t know if I would go so far to say historic but poor nonetheless. But you miss my point- if you get rid of the security blanket lbs you FORCE the coaches and players to try to find a way. It’s ‘burn the bridges’ philosophy.

Poor is generous. It's beyond poor. There are three players on that line who are instantly defeated on every pass play, and should not be in the league. I'm not being hyperbolic, they're historically bad.

I don't miss your point. If you take away Hunter Henry, who's not actually running routes, but waiting for Brissett to break the pocket to get open, you're throwing for 40 yards a game. I don't care what scheme or force or tryhard you're trying to do. 3/5 of that line are instantly defeated on every pass play. That's a non-functional pass game. Brady had some below average lines in his time here, but nothing this bad. He wouldn't be able to move the ball either, especially considering he couldn't break the pocket and buy time.

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

Agree that Jacoby will do nothing for WR development. But I still think Maye's development supersedes, and if he ain't ready, then we just got to grit our teeth until then.

Right, its all dependent on him being ready. 2025 should be our focus, whether that means playing him or sitting him.

 

[Real fan 02]

Well this makes it better doesn’t it

We had a teacher, and a banker calling games for a multi billion dollar sport. The NFL has
Had officiating issues for years. They need to hire full time officiating crews like NBA, NHL. Those DPI calls were absolutely bull.

 

[TommyD4207]

I saw 2 Linemen bump into each other rather than the defensive player. I know Brissett is limited in his physical abilities but he has no time whatsoever to find pop.

Pop is the one guy we have that can get open in short space. The fact that he can't even see the ball is concerning. This o line is problem that is going to be a hindrance all season. On the WRs.. guys known for thier speed like Thornton and baker are absolutely non factors. Mayo's got to make some adjustments at WR.. put baker and polk out there more often. See what can happen.

Pop Douglas, the slot receiver, who runs basically 5 yard option routes half the time - has 3 targets in 2 games, because there is no time to get him the ball.

 

[Pape]

Yep. And the lack of athleticism by the tackles really limits their ability to run outside zone. OC Van Pelt is forced to do power gap and inside zone.

And with no deep receiving threat whatsoever, the defense isn’t forced to defend much of the field.

I expect Jacoby and Rhamondre to both get hurt this season. Putting in Maye? Short term gain…but long term could backfire.

Solution? Get decent OTs.

Good post.

Jacoby has been banged up in both games so far, so it's only a matter of time... Rham I'm not sure about... You might see some more of Gibson to prevent that... Tough to tell... I'm more worried about HH getting hurt ... Until the defense took him away, he was having a great game...

As for a deep threat, should we try to force the issue with Thornton? Really work his timing with Jacoby during the week, see if the O can open it up some, at least to keep the defense from crowding the line?

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

Never mind OT, can we talk about the last two minutes of the half,?

Mayo not killing the clock allowed the Seahawks to double dip on scoring - end of the half and beginning of the third... Bad situational football right there

I think they tried to kill it as much as they could as they ran it on first down and let the full playclock run before snapping it again. the problem is Seattle had timeouts so they weren’t going to be able to run it out completely so they felt like they had to try for the first to completely kill it. Could they have forced Seattle to burn the 2 timeouts? Sure but we’re still looking at them having the ball around midfield with 35 seconds left so im guessing theyd have scored anyways. So imo its hard to say whether they were wrong in trying to get the first.

The 3rd and 1 in OT really stings though. You have 2 monsters of a qb in jacoby and milton. Until drake is ready, If theyre not sneaking it with jacoby i would honestly have milton in on 3rd and shorts and run the packages we did with Cam in 2020, they were nearly unstoppable.

 

[TommyD4207]

Good post.

Jacoby has been banged up in both games so far, so it's only a matter of time... Rham I'm not sure about... You might see some more of Gibson to prevent that... Tough to tell... I'm more worried about HH getting hurt ... Until the defense took him away, he was having a great game...

As for a deep threat, should we try to force the issue with Thornton? Really work his timing with Jacoby during the week, see if the O can open it up some, at least to keep the defense from crowding the line?

You need at least 3 seconds to get a go-route or a deep post off - and that's without even looking to see if the guy is open or not.

You can count on 3 fingers the amount of times Brissett has had that kind of time in the pocket.

 

[patsinthesnow]

Brissett is horrible for the development of the young WRs. He refuses to get the ball out quick for Douglas or throw downfield. Maye needs to get in there by week 5.

 

[1960Pats]

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I'm surprised at the negativity. This is only week two and they're 1-1, which is 1 win better than 3/4 of the fans thought they'd have at this point. What I'm excited about is the Pats running game. That should go a long way when Maye comes in to play.

And who around here really gives a flying **** what MHJ is doing?

 

[Real fan 02]

Pop Douglas, the slot receiver, who runs basically 5 yard option routes half the time - has 3 targets in 2 games, because there is no time to get him the ball.

Exactly. There has been plenty of room for pop to work in the middle of the field but as you said no time to throw to him. It's just utter catastrophic how the talk situation is handled. I get it we are a rebuilding team.. however we are never going to really see the full extent of the offense without the porous tackle play.

Our defense without Barmore then loosing Bentley.. still had 3 sacks.. pressure all day on Smith. Consecutive 3 and outs gino Smith had most of his work across the middle.. can't fault them.

I don't know what's going to improve this week.. Jets have quninen Williams who is salivating over playing this Line. Sauce may not even tie his cleats up for our WRs.

 

[PatsFan2]

I remember AJ said when we signed Brissett that we signed a QB worse than Mac Jones. The Book is already out on Brissett he's a very limited QB who hinders his Team the stars have to be aligned for him to get a win.

 

[Real fan 02]

I'm surprised at the negativity. This is only week two and they're 1-1, which is 1 win better than 3/4 of the fans thought they'd have at this point. What I'm excited about is the Pats running game. That should go a long way when Maye comes in to play.

And who around here really gives a flying **** what MHJ is doing?

I agree. My comments were basically on the porous play of the line. It's just frustrating becuase it's limiting the AVP play calling. However all in all we have a win. Baltimore, Bengals play off teams with elite QBs are win less. SF lost to sam darnold.