Patriots Player Departure Mac Jones traded to Jags for a 6th

[Wozzy]

That is a gross misrepresentation of what the story was. The story was that Belichick felt that the Pats could draft Davis Mills in the third and make him a starter who could be the franchise QB, but deferred to his scouting that drafting Mac Jones at 15 was a much better option to be a contender again. The story never was he was against drafting Mac Jones. It was basically he felt both guys could be starters, but there wasn't enough of a difference between the two and drafting Mills in the third was a better value.

BTW, Belichick was wrong about Mills. And I think his thinking of why he wanted Mills over Jones was flawed.

But either way, not one report said he didn't want Mac Jones. If he felt Jones couldn't play, he wouldn't have drafted him. Plain and simple. If Kraft let Belichick put Patricia and Judge in charge of the offense a year later, he would have let Belichick pass on Jones in favor of Mills.

Dance…

 

[Ian]

Better than a 6th rounder….

Last offseason, probably. At least the 2022 season was good enough where he finished with some benefit of the doubt. He wiped out his remaining currency with his performances this season. They were truly epically bad.

 

[Wozzy]

While I favor your viewpoint, it's not really a retort considering "ESPN" said 11 of 12 balls were underinflated by over 2psi.

If I hadn’t given a total of three different sources it would be substantially less credible.

 

[Rob0729]

Dance…

It isn't a dance. The article said he preferred waiting to the third to draft Davis Mills, not that he was against drafting Mac Jones or that he didn't want him. That is not in any article written on the subject. Preferring one draft strategy over another doesn't mean you are against the other draft strategy.

 

[Jim Beankie]

Anyway, this is a sneaky trade for the Jaguars. Lawrence has not put together a fully great season, and they haven't extended Lawrence yet.

This could mean something, just saying.

Related to your point, a few weeks ago, I looked at the 2025 QB FA chart and thought... if Lawrence pseudo sucks this year, how cheaply could the Pats get him for next year?

 

[Wozzy]

Grier was GM during Brady draft. Everyone had input: Weiss, Grier, Pioli, Belichick. They all liked him, so he was selected.

2021: Belichick was GM during Jones draft. Everyone had input: Ziegler, Groh, Wolf, Belichick. They all liked him, so he was selected.

Kraft NEVER said he took the draft away from Bill. That is a lie. You've been exposed as a liar. You have zero credibility.

In 2000 BB sent his newly hired QB coach to scout two QB’s from the draft class. Tim Rattay and Tom Brady, the team took Tom Brady on the advice of **** Rehbein, the newly hired QB coach.

First sign of a BB hater… BB didn’t draft Brady. Laughable.

 

[signbabybrady]

He also fired Brady.

Pretty important detail.

Yeah I don't run around defending that decision but he didn't fire him he was unable to re-sign him after the contract ran out. They should of done whatever it took to keep Brady.

I generally let the Bill bashers say what they want about that I just don't like the rewriting of history and stripping of what did actually happen when things were perfect. Years 20-23 obviously weren't.

 

[Wozzy]

It isn't a dance. The article said he preferred waiting to the third to draft Davis Mills, not that he was against drafting Mac Jones or that he didn't want him. That is not in any article written on the subject. Preferring one draft strategy over another doesn't mean you are against the other draft strategy.

Either BB had autonomy to draft who he wanted in 2021 after Kraft announced to the world it would now be a group effort or he didn’t. BB also reportedly wanted to cut bait with Mac a year later and Kraft asked him to give him another chance.

No… you people are dancing around reported facts because BB has to look as bad as possible.

 

[Since1960]

Last offseason, probably. At least the 2022 season was good enough where he finished with some benefit of the doubt. He wiped out his remaining currency with his performances this season. They were truly epically bad.

First round #3 pick bad at that!

 

[Jim Beankie]

This is a good question. What are all you that ran out to buy a Mac jersey doing with yours? @Ian?

Well... at least they took their shot... I drove by this almost every day.

 

[Wozzy]

He also fired Brady.

Pretty important detail.

lol… Brady was a free agent.

It’s the “free” in free agent that must have you confused.

 

[Ian]

Yes but did Brees win a Superbowl without Payton?

How's Payton Denver run looking?

You can't tell Bill Belichicks Superbowl story without Brady.

You can't say the same for Brady so I don't know why he chose to give all the credit to Bill.

You can look at a lot of coaches and try and make the argument but none of them win without a good quarterback. Coaches draw up the game plans but they can’t be dominant without great players, especially at QB. People oversimplify that argument, but it applies to all of them. In our case, you put together the best coach and the best quarterback and it led to two decades of dominance.

You put Brady with Dungy or another coach at that level and maybe he wins 3-4 Super Bowls and makes noise in the regular season the way Manning did (except Brady knew how to finish). But football in January the last two years has been a reminder of how much a great coach matters, and Bill remains at the top there. And it’s because Brady executed what he asked him to flawlessly. It was the perfect match.

At the end of the day, Bill’s roster building - and ego - at the end is what cost him. But it doesn’t - and shouldn’t - take away what they accomplished together. He ultimately moved on from Brady just three years too early. We should be thankful it wasn’t 6-7 years because we would have potentially missed out on two more championships.

 

[Rob0729]

Either BB had autonomy to draft who he wanted in 2021 after Kraft announced to the world it would now be a group effort or he didn’t. BB also reportedly wanted to cut bait with Mac a year later and Kraft asked him to give him another chance.

No… you people are dancing around reported facts because BB has to look as bad as possible.

He had final say with Jones as he has had with every other draft pick in his tenure. Nothing changed. Do you really think that this was the first draft pick that people sold him on? I am sure there were many times over the years that Belichick preferred one player over another and someone in the war room sold him to take another player. I guarantee you every single time including with Jones that he like the player he drafted, but just liked another one more and was talked into the player he ended up drafting.

I am not dancing around reported facts. I am dancing around your biased interpretation of the facts. Your interpretation of the facts are not facts. They are opinions.

Post the direct quote that said that Belichick didn't want Mac Jones and was pressured into taking him. I have never seen a single report that explicitly stated that Belichick didn't like Jones and didn't want him including the one you claim does. The one you site says he preferred taking Mills in the third round, but never gave Belichick's opinion on Jones and whether he liked him or not.

Belichick has been reported to believe that he could plug almost any QB in his offense and still win. He doesn't value drafting QBs high.

 

[Patriot Missile]

I just hope in the future we can have a regime that’s not cloaked in area 51 stealth rumors
And conspiracies. It’s makes for a lot of he said/shesaid talk on this forum that gets tiresome after a while. I don’t known who or what to believe anymore. Just want a black and white normal season of the team trending in the right direction.

 

[Jim Beankie]

Hard to argue, zap had the best game of his career against Cleveland that day. I wouldn't put any stock into zap if he had to line up against that Cleveland defense now. Give me Brissett, and let's get the QB of the future right this time around.

I'm surprised Zap's Ratings vs PIT and DEN were almost similar to what he put up at CLE. 3pts and half a point under, respectively. That being said, BB was all but wanting to give Zap the starting job, but he kept f'ing it up (like that horrid fake spike INT vs the Colts). For now, I'm still hangin by a thread on team Zap while drafting a top 5 QB in this draft.

 

[Wozzy]

He had final say with Jones as he has had with every other draft pick in his tenure. Nothing changed. Do you really think that this was the first draft pick that people sold him on? I am sure there were many times over the years that Belichick preferred one player over another and someone in the war room sold him to take another player. I guarantee you every single time including with Jones that he like the player he drafted, but just liked another one more and was talked into the player he ended up drafting.

I am not dancing around reported facts. I am dancing around your biased interpretation of the facts. Your interpretation of the facts are not facts. They are opinions.

Post the direct quote that said that Belichick didn't want Mac Jones and was pressured into taking him. I have never seen a single report that explicitly stated that Belichick didn't like Jones and didn't want him including the one you claim does. The one you site says he preferred taking Mills in the third round, but never gave Belichick's opinion on Jones and whether he liked him or not.

Belichick has been reported to believe that he could plug almost any QB in his offense and still win. He doesn't value drafting QBs high.

He had final say with Mac is an opinion, and I’m not claiming to know anything beyond what was reported or what came directly from Kraft’s mouth.

You BB haters simply want to dismiss any report that don’t support your agenda.

 

[Ian]

He had final say with Jones as he has had with every other draft pick in his tenure. Nothing changed. Do you really think that this was the first draft pick that people sold him on? I am sure there were many times over the years that Belichick preferred one player over another and someone in the war room sold him to take another player. I guarantee you every single time including with Jones that he like the player he drafted, but just liked another one more and was talked into the player he ended up drafting.

I am not dancing around reported facts. I am dancing around your biased interpretation of the facts. Your interpretation of the facts are not facts. They are opinions.

Post the direct quote that said that Belichick didn't want Mac Jones and was pressured into taking him. I have never seen a single report that explicitly stated that Belichick didn't like Jones and didn't want him including the one you claim does. The one you site says he preferred taking Mills in the third round, but never gave Belichick's opinion on Jones and whether he liked him or not.

Belichick has been reported to believe that he could plug almost any QB in his offense and still win. He doesn't value drafting QBs high.

People keep talking about Bill not wanting him but I mean, Jones was Saban’s National Championship-winning guy. The meetings during the pre draft process went well and Lombardi said it best, he was a smart player who they thought - based on what they had seen - was that he’d be good enough to be “an overachiever” the same way Brady had been and that their defense would take care of the rest. Bill absolutely was in on him. I 100% believe that because back then, he had no reason not to be.

Unfortunately, his other attributes ended up offsetting that and McDaniels leaving - and poaching of the staff - clearly played a big role there. Hoyer painted a picture of how dysfunctional the 2022 preseason was in a recent podcast with Curran and that unfortunately derailed a promising start. Add in Jones’ apparent resentment of his circumstances and his inability to take as much accountability as he should have and it obviously led to what happened.

In the end, taking him was the right move because in this league, you have to continually draft QBs and take chances and 2022 would have absolutely gone worse with Newton - I have no doubt about that. It’s just too bad this one ended as badly as it did.

 

[Rob0729]

He had final say with Mac is an opinion, and I’m not claiming to know anything beyond what was reported or what came directly from Kraft’s mouth.

You BB haters simply want to dismiss any report that don’t support your agenda.

No it isn't. Belichick has had final say on draft picks from day one. No one has reported that he was overruled by Kraft or anyone else. Again, not even the report that you cite.

One report said that Belichick gave in because he said to Kraft that he would be open to other people's suggestions and he didn't want to go back on his word on the first pick under his promise. But even then, the report was Belichick had final say.

I don't dismiss the reports. I just am not putting a biased spin on the what was reported. Again, post the direct quote. You won't because it doesn't say what you claim it does.

 

[Huckleberry1]

Those here wanting a $$$$ WR should be heartened by the Mac trade. I really think they made the deal today to send a message to WR’s that Mac will not be their quarterback.

 

[Ian]

Those here wanting a $$$$ WR should be heartened by the Mac trade. I really think they made the deal today to send a message to WR’s that Mac will not be their quarterback.

I think they’re going to finalize a deal for a veteran in the next day or so in order to be able to attract free agents. Draft is too questionable right now to make assumptions and sell guys based on hypotheticals.