What Are Chances Patriots Make Splash Trade For Justin Fields?

[Headcase]

You have 1. Free Agency and 2. the Draft. Presently we have the most cap space over the next 3 years due to frugality (it might have been RK not BB - we do not know). It would be OK, IMO, to use some future cap years (void years) and still have the 15th, for example, most cap space over 3 years.

There are very few offensive FAs worth paying for. Defensively there are a bunch of good FAs. That could change as teams use their franchise tags. If we spent money on defense in FA ( because our defense is good and 2 to 4 FAs would make it great), we could then pick mostly offense in the next two drafts.

Could be a very good team in 2025 with good offensive drafts. Adding a few top defensive FAs is not a big risk. The offensive draft picks are the big risk in my plan above.

This is very much what people are missing 1) FA isn't great this year for positions we need on Offense (Once you consider who will be resigned and franchised. 2) We can't just focus on Offense, we have almost the entire Defense hitting FA in the next two offseasons....like 25 guys.

 

[mike_usagisan]

This is very much what people are missing 1) FA isn't great this year for positions we need on Offense (Once you consider who will be resigned and franchised. 2) We can't just focus on Offense, we have almost the entire Defense hitting FA in the next two offseasons....like 25 guys.

Right, but it's a nuanced approach.

On the offensive side, hopefully Wolf is grading who we have, seeing if the FA is an upgrade, and if that upgrade is worth the money as opposed to other places that money could go. There are potentially good WRs in the FA market and good TEs. OL is terrible. And nobody knows what we're doing at QB and what kind of vet we want to bring in.

On the defensive side, hopefully Wolf is already starting to think about who we want to stay over the next two years and who we can afford to lose and replace with draft picks.

 

[Real fan 02]

So Bill was responsible for every iota of what went wrong up until his exit, but wasn't responsible for anything good... like cleaning up the books?

The Patriots are the same fiscally responsible team they were starting back in 2000 when BB and Pioili arrived and set the standard. We'll see if it continues from this point forward. But I think the Krafts understand the concept of spending to the cap and fielding a competitive team annually, rather than having a team that spends erratically and deals with peaks and valleys.

Oh ok so now he's responsible with cleaning the books? But he's not responsible for Mac? Juju? Not paying Myers and countless others Over the years. As I've said at nuasem bill was great, what he accomplished will never be replicated in the NFL. Not disparaging him at the least.

 

[Wozzy]

Oh ok so now he's responsible with cleaning the books? But he's not responsible for Mac? Juju? Not paying Myers and countless others Over the years. As I've said at nuasem bill was great, what he accomplished will never be replicated in the NFL. Not disparaging him at the least.

BB’s financial model was one of the things he brought to the Patriots. There’s many early examples of him pointing out how the top tier of players on the team he inherited in 2000 were bloated and overpaid, his model of a robust middle class is well known.

The morons who hated him called it cheap, it wasn’t cheap, it was fiscally responsible and something the team should perpetuate going forward.

BB is supposedly responsible for everything the Patriots have done, not just the things that turned out poorly.

 

[Real fan 02]

BB’s financial model was one of the things he brought to the Patriots. There’s many early examples of him pointing out how the top tier of players on the team he inherited in 2000 were bloated and overpaid, his model of a robust middle class is well known.

The morons who hated him called it cheap, it wasn’t cheap, it was fiscally responsible and something the team should perpetuate going forward.

BB is supposedly responsible for everything the Patriots have done, not just the things that turned out poorly.

He has a hand in everything, the entire organization save for ownership was designed around him. For 23 seasons that's the way it was. The system with brady ran like a well oil machine. Not having to worry about a QB and having that QB take less for the greater good more often than not makes an organization very easy to be fiscally sound. Obviously the QB contracts weren't what they are today of course. However Bill did a great job of managing things. He was masterful at running things. Bill was given a budget and he did a good job managing their budget. However in sports for alot of greats it usually never ends on a high note.

 

[DW Toys]

Yes! People have to remember we are a 4-13 team, worse offense in the NFL. We need talent at the skill positions badly!

Exactly Cousin,
Good morning sports Fans. Had a nice breakfast of cinnamon swirl french toast with maple syrup and butter and a slice of Boar's Head ham with some mint tea and a glass of cranberry-pomegranate juice. I am ready to get my derriere handed to me on this post. .

We have too many holes to fill to put all of our chips on the table for a youngster who could turn into Zach Wilson while everybody thinks their pick is the next Stroud. We also need a threat or two to bother the DC of our competitors. Who do we have now? Nyet!

Interesting segment I heard from Felger I believe of all people yesterday.a writer by the name of Fowler who suggested that the Vikings would like to move into the top three to get their "franchise" QB now because they fear they might lose Captain Kirk anyway. And his price is through the roof.



The Bears won't trade with the Vikings who tried to get into the top QB chase last year. So that leaves Wshington or the Pats. Washington avctually have some playmakers that they can surround a rookie QB with. We have oogatz. It makes sense the "redskins"----oops sorry...Just a joke.....take one of the big three.

The proposal chatted about was our#3 pick for the Vikes #11, number, Vikes #1 in 2025 and.....Justin Jefferson. Jefferson is on his final year and will demand big bucks in 25 but the kid is only 25 years old.......pay him! He's 25 and his contract might be cheap in a few years.

Why would the Vikes do this? They have two #1 WRs in Addison and Jefferson ...we have..oh yea "0" They also have Hockenson as a threat. They will have to pay Jefferson or lose him next year anyway. They get their Franchise" kid QB.

Why would the Pats do this? ................Jefferson....a threat to any DC. and maybe our nest WR since Moss. A real #1. At pick #11 we can still get a blue chip OT. A #1 pick in 2025 is icing on the cake.

The rest of the story for entertainment purposes?
Now what to do about the QB> We have two noodle arms on the team right now. They will not be able to leverage his skills. Yes I am going Fields. Not my cup of tea but better than what we got. He has two years to prove his worth or he is gone. At least he can get the ball out there. Our pick at #68 in the third is probably realistic to trade with Mac included because they need a placeholder for Williams. and we get their 4th rounder at #111. I am sure there will be pitchforks and torches on this proposal. Yep I would gamble.

You cousins say "DW, we still need a QB?" How about at #34 we take Spencer Rattler who was the best QB at the Senior Bowl. He willed South Carolina through their season with the worst OL in the SEC who had a ton of injuries. Best arm out there in Mobile. He was a pain in the arse punk at Oklahoma and matured nicely at South Carolina. Rattler was a third round prospect but moved into the second with flair. Better than Nix or Penix.

So at #104 you might consider Roman Wilson WR or OT Patrick Paul who is still raw BUT a nice piece of clay to work with and then at #111 how about some LB speed in JD Bertrand who was all over the field in Mobile.

Thoughts?
Threats?
DW Toys

 

[Real fan 02]

Doing this - a high pick for Fields - would be a thousand times worse than the Sanu pick. That pick happened when they were desperately trying to squeeze out that last season of the dynasty, had started 8-0, and were suddenly empty at the WR position.

It would have worked a lot better, I think, if they hadn't put him on the field for that punt that got him injured!

I don't believe we do a high pick.. as I've mentioned late round pick, Mac or Parker and a 6th would probably be what I'd offer?

 

[jmt57]

I really don't know why people would be against it.. for a 4th for an athletic QB, with a rocket arm.. I'm all in.. why not..

I hear you; in a vacuum, a 4th round pick for an athletic QB with a rocket arm, for a team in dire need of a QB does make perfect sense.


My issue is that Fields will be a free agent in 2025 (unless the Bears do not pick up the 5th year option). A 4-13 team in major rebuilding mode does not need a one year rental; they need draft picks. In this scenario the team may as well sign a veteran free agent QB and retain that 4th round pick. And if an early 4th rounder is considered to be too much of a rarity to be a hit, use it to trade up for a better player now, or trade out for a 2025 3rd. Sure, Maxx Crosby, Amon-Ra St. Brown and Rhamondre Stevenson are recent 4th round exceptions compared to the average talent found in the 4th, but most 4th rounders do turn out to be good enough to start at some point.

And if Chicago does pick up that option, then the Patriots are now on the hook for $25 million to him in 2025 - and he would be a free agent the following year. That's a big commitment for a QB whose career stats are just a hair over 60% completion rate, 40TD: 30Int, and has a career record of 10-28.


Fields' 2023 rankings:
22nd, 86.3 in Passer Rating
24th, 46.1 in QB Rating
22nd, 2.4% in Interception Percentage
25th, 5.50 in Net Yards per Attempt
29th, 61.4 in Completion Percentage
29th, 38.4 in Success Rate (defined as: "A successful pass gains at least 40% of yards required on 1st down, 60% of yards required on 2nd down, and 100% of yards required on 3rd and 4th down. Denominator is pass attempts + times sacked.")


From what I am reading on the web, the Bears are supposedly going to get at least a 2nd round pick for Fields. I don't see the value for a team in the position of the Patriots in giving up that much for him. Maybe it makes sense for a team like Minnesota, who was 13-4 two years ago, to get back to being a contender. But for teams like Washington, New England or NYG - no.

 

[Real fan 02]

I hear you; in a vacuum, a 4th round pick for an athletic QB with a rocket arm, for a team in dire need of a QB does make perfect sense.


My issue is that Fields will be a free agent in 2025 (unless the Bears do not pick up the 5th year option). A 4-13 team in major rebuilding mode does not need a one year rental; they need draft picks. In this scenario the team may as well sign a veteran free agent QB and retain that 4th round pick. And if an early 4th rounder is considered to be too much of a rarity to be a hit, use it to trade up for a better player now, or trade out for a 2025 3rd. Sure, Maxx Crosby, Amon-Ra St. Brown and Rhamondre Stevenson are recent 4th round exceptions compared to the average talent found in the 4th, but most 4th rounders do turn out to be good enough to start at some point.

And if Chicago does pick up that option, then the Patriots are now on the hook for $25 million to him in 2025 - and he would be a free agent the following year. That's a big commitment for a QB whose career stats are just a hair over 60% completion rate, 40TD: 30Int, and has a career record of 10-28.


Fields' 2023 rankings:
22nd, 86.3 in Passer Rating
24th, 46.1 in QB Rating
22nd, 2.4% in Interception Percentage
25th, 5.50 in Net Yards per Attempt
29th, 61.4 in Completion Percentage
29th, 38.4 in Success Rate (defined as: "A successful pass gains at least 40% of yards required on 1st down, 60% of yards required on 2nd down, and 100% of yards required on 3rd and 4th down. Denominator is pass attempts + times sacked.")


From what I am reading on the web, the Bears are supposedly going to get at least a 2nd round pick for Fields. I don't see the value for a team in the position of the Patriots in giving up that much for him. Maybe it makes sense for a team like Minnesota, who was 13-4 two years ago, to get back to being a contender. But for teams like Washington, New England or NYG - no.

Great information! Makes perfect sense in everything you're stating. I just think it all hinges on what mayo wants. I believe we still take a QB.. I just don't know if it will be at #3.. I've seen scenarios where we trade down to #8 and trade that pick for Jefferson wich I'd absolutely love!!

However fields of course would be a bridge QB.. So for instance say we had him, the draft pick, another veteran in camp. I'd like that option better than anything we currently have on the roster.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

Agreed.

This is very much what people are missing 1) FA isn't great this year for positions we need on Offense (Once you consider who will be resigned and franchised. 2) We can't just focus on Offense, we have almost the entire Defense hitting FA in the next two offseasons....like 25 guys.

Agreed. We have tremendous flexibility to reshape the roster, but that means we have a lot of decisions. Do we resign Duggar when Mapu might be good enough to replace him? Same question with Onwenu being replaced by Sow? Do we let Godchaux go and sign a FA DT?

Our run defense was really good so I think they hold onto Godchaux, but maybe not. Onwenu has a lot of flexibility so we will see. How bad is Strange's injury? I think Andrews can replace Andrews so center is not a need. We need to save money to sign Barmore.

If we sign a free safety, a LB, a press corner, and a DE on defense we are all set on defense for 2 years.

 

[Headcase]

Agreed.


Agreed. We have tremendous flexibility to reshape the roster, but that means we have a lot of decisions. Do we resign Duggar when Mapu might be good enough to replace him? Same question with Onwenu being replaced by Sow? Do we let Godchaux go and sign a FA DT?

Our run defense was really good so I think they hold onto Godchaux, but maybe not. Onwenu has a lot of flexibility so we will see. How bad is Strange's injury? I think Andrews can replace Andrews so center is not a need. We need to save money to sign Barmore.

If we sign a free safety, a LB, a press corner, and a DE on defense we are all set on defense for 2 years.

Mapu was woefully out out place at safety, I hope the new, former middle linebacker, HC realizes where he should be placed.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

Mapu was woefully out out place at safety, I hope the new, former middle linebacker, HC realizes where he should be placed.

Duggar took a year or two to settle in. Barmore did too. Patience young Skywalker.

 

[Headcase]

Duggar took a year or two to settle in. Barmore did too. Patience young Skywalker.

Neither of them were making position changes.

 

[Thelonious]

Fields has had multiple coach's and OCs over his short career. Never good for a young QB.. I'd say trade Mac, and a 6th for him. He has more upside IMO than any QB we have on the roster right now.

That's for sure. I suppose I'd trade him for Mac straight, not so much because I want him as because I think we owe Mac afresh start. I would not offer any draft capital, nor would I give Fields any sort of leg up re the backup, let alone the starting position. I think we need a promising newbie on a cheap, lengthy contract, so I'd draft one. It will take at least two, more likely three years to regain competitiveness, which makes the longer rookie contract more advantageous.

 

[venecol]

Agreed.


Agreed. We have tremendous flexibility to reshape the roster, but that means we have a lot of decisions. Do we resign Duggar when Mapu might be good enough to replace him? Same question with Onwenu being replaced by Sow? Do we let Godchaux go and sign a FA DT?

Our run defense was really good so I think they hold onto Godchaux, but maybe not. Onwenu has a lot of flexibility so we will see. How bad is Strange's injury? I think Andrews can replace Andrews so center is not a need. We need to save money to sign Barmore.

If we sign a free safety, a LB, a press corner, and a DE on defense we are all set on defense for 2 years.

The only D FA I'd like to see signed is Winfield Jr. We need a game changing FS to replace McCourty's role in the 2ndary.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

Neither of them were making position changes.

Duggar was a CB and safety in college. He now plays free safety and strong safety with a lot of LB coverage of TEs. Mapu was a LB is college and plays a lot of strong safety and free safety. They are both hybrid players, LB and safety like Peppers. This was from a draft writeup about Mapu:

Mapu has thrived in a hybrid safety/linebacker role, much like current Patriot Kyle Dugger. Standing at 6-foot-3, 221 pounds and with a 78.75 inch wingspan, Mapu has physical traits that could allow him to play all over New England’s defense.

Mapu and Duggar are similar. Can Mapu make the transition to the NFL line Duggar did? I do not know but Mayo should know.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

The only D FA I'd like to see signed is Winfield Jr. We need a game changing FS to replace McCourty's role in the 2ndary.

That is the only defensive FA you would like to see the Pats sign? Dude, are you hammered at dinnertime?

I agree that Winfield Jr. should be signed, but the only defensive FA? What?

 

[venecol]

That is the only defensive FA you would like to see the Pats sign? Dude, are you hammered at dinnertime?

I agree that Winfield Jr. should be signed, but the only defensive FA? What?

Yup. That and a LB. Focus on O.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

Yup. That and a LB. Focus on O.

Silly. I will respond when I am at my laptop. Unfortunately this is probably the common approach on PatsFans. The focus has to be on FA value and winning, not short term solutions that are long term mistakes.

 

[Real fan 02]

That's for sure. I suppose I'd trade him for Mac straight, not so much because I want him as because I think we owe Mac afresh start. I would not offer any draft capital, nor would I give Fields any sort of leg up re the backup, let alone the starting position. I think we need a promising newbie on a cheap, lengthy contract, so I'd draft one. It will take at least two, more likely three years to regain competitiveness, which makes the longer rookie contract more advantageous.

Agreed, now fields is also cheap. On the same rookie contract. Yes, Mac is owed a fresh start somewhere. So how about Mac, Parker & and a 6th for fields? So it would be fields, zap unfortunately, draft pick ,and veteran to battle it all out in camp. Zap would have the advantage over everyone by virtue of him being here. However everyone would be coming in fresh becuase Mayo's/ AVPs offense is going to be a Version of the west coast offense.