Patriots Pregame Thread Week 5 pregame discussion: Saints @ Pats

[Lagaffe_07]

Evan Lazar said the opposite in his analysis saying the receivers are consistently covered. Bedard said the same about the Cowboys game (but said there wasn't a single person on offense who played well). Without seeing the All 22s and seeing when receivers are open or not open, sometimes people can look open by aren't because they were open after the release. And visa versa, someone who looks covered could have been open if the ball was release a half a second quicker.

I know last year, some people on this board made some of those mistakes looking at film.

And also, we have to look at the pressure. Sometimes there isn't time for a QB to scan the field if the pocket collapses quickly or a defender is right on top of him.

You may be right, but I think people on both sides of the argument see the film the way they want to see it sometimes. And I don't exclude myself from that.

I don’t know if you watched Lazar review of Mac today in his audio assessment because on every bad play Lazar reviewed there was an open receiver. And he didn’t even review the play where Parker or Juju was wide open coming across the field and he threw it over his head and behind. Mac melted down on a day where he had the most time to throw of the season. The pressure came because Mac held the ball too long because he was unable to read the field properly.

 

[Real fan 02]

Them are fighting words to the Homers becareful Real.

I'm one of the most die hard optimistic fans.. but like many I've been given a reality check this season. We have some good pieces on defense for the future.. but it appears this roster needs to either play much better to it's ceiling or a complete make over in the off season. This is a early 2000s NFL roster not a 2023 roster. Every team just about has a premiere #1 ..

 

[Rob0729]

I don’t know if you watched Lazar review of Mac today in his audio assessment because on every bad play Lazar reviewed there was an open receiver. And he didn’t even review the play where Parker or Juju was wide open coming across the field and he threw it over his head and behind. Mac melted down on a day where he had the most time to throw of the season. The pressure came because Mac held the ball too long because he was unable to read the field properly.

I haven't listened to his podcast from today, but he has been trashing the receivers for not getting open. He doesn't take the blame off of Mac, but he blames the receiver inability to get open too.

BTW, Bedard has said the same thing although he blames the o-line more.

 

[mike_usagisan]

@mike_usagisan BOB takes blame for Offensive woes...way to man up silent partner.

I think Bob came in and gave Mac the tools to make the offense work and Mac and WRs (with help from the OL and RBs) have stunk it up.

 

[Real fan 02]

Even the Giants are statiscally better than us go figure.

Wow! And they are terrible on offense DJ has severely regressed.. and he has weapons.

 

[Lagaffe_07]

I haven't listened to his podcast from today, but he has been trashing the receivers for not getting open. He doesn't take the blame off of Mac, but he blames the receiver inability to get open too.

BTW, Bedard has said the same thing although he blames the o-line more.

A good read and watch for you.

After Further Review: Where do the Patriots and QB Mac Jones Go From Here Following Sunday's Loss to the Cowboys?

 

[Rob0729]

A good read and watch for you.

After Further Review: Where do the Patriots and QB Mac Jones Go From Here Following Sunday's Loss to the Cowboys?

Pretty much what I said. He blames Mac for not seeing the field (but clearly states that is usually his strength), but he also says that Mac is in tough position because he has no outside receiver, JuJu sucks, and the o-line is a mess. I think you may be reading this and seeing it the way you want.

Lazar is fairly positive about Mac Jones in general, but thought he sucked in this game, but he also that the reason he sucked is in part of not having receiving and o-line talent.

This is directly from the article you posted:

Regardless of who's under center and calling plays, the issues for the offense won't go away until the talent level increases for the entire unit. If the offense continues down this same path, there's a chance they'll have a different quarterback next season. But whether it's this guy or the next guy, most quarterbacks are a product of their environment, and even the GOATs struggle relative to expectations when things around them go haywire (see: Brady, 2019).

If the Patriots don't address the root cause of their issues on offense, the fear is that they'll be spinning the tires for years until they put better talent around whoever is at quarterback.

 

[patsfanfromoversea]

Note:
First round talent Mac Jones currently sits #1 in Points Gifted to Opposing Defenses

 

[Uptown]

 

[Mack Herron]

Pretty much what I said. He blames Mac for not seeing the field (but clearly states that is usually his strength), but he also says that Mac is in tough position because he has no outside receiver, JuJu sucks, and the o-line is a mess. I think you may be reading this and seeing it the way you want.

Lazar is fairly positive about Mac Jones in general, but thought he sucked in this game, but he also that the reason he sucked is in part of not having receiving and o-line talent.

This is directly from the article you posted:

I said all summer the OL and specifically OT were anchors on the offense. But I find it hard to believe that BB didn’t understand the talent at OL and WR. It is possible that the OL simply hasn’t played together enough to gel. We will find out because there are no options now except to stay with it and see. If they can run, that will open the offense for Mac.

 

[TheBeers]

Gonna sound like a broken record but Douglas needs to be on the field more, when Thornton is healthy he needs to be on the field.. and Boutte should be playing as well. I don't care who has to sit at WR to make this happen. This team is not winning the SB, so develop our young players and lets see what they can do.

 

[Ross12]

Gonna sound like a broken record but Douglas needs to be on the field more, when Thornton is healthy he needs to be on the field.. and Boutte should be playing as well. I don't care who has to sit at WR to make this happen. This team is not winning the SB, so develop our young players and lets see what they can do.

I think Douglas, Thornton and Boutte need to be on the field because they can actually create separation. That may actually be their best trio from an athletic standpoint. Mix in Bourne periodically.

 

[lancerman]

If the Patriots can't beat this Saints team, then we really should just look to next season. That's like the height of mediocrity in the NFL, you can't get past them and you got issues. Sure we might get W's off the Raiders, Giants and Jets again... but that doesn't mean much.

 

[Hyped]

I think that one play literally destroyed any chance of Meyers returning.

And probably endeared him to the Raiders too....

 

[Patsfan1958]

Game Preview: Saints at Patriots

2023 REGULAR SEASON	NEW ENGLAND	NEW ORLEANS
Record	1-3	2-2
Division Standings	3rd	2nd (T)
Total Yards Gained	1,281	1,141
Total Offense (Rank)	320.3 (17)	285.3 (23)
Rush Offense	93.5 (24)	87.5 (25)
Pass Offense	226.8 (12T)	197.8 (21)
Points Per Game	13.8 (30)	15.5 (25T)
Total Yards Allowed	1,188	1,217
Total Defense (Rank)	297.0 (10)	304.3 (11)
Rush Defense	101.0 (10)	103.3 (11)
Pass Defense	196.0 (10)	201.0 (12)
Points Allowed/Game	24.3 (21)	19.0 (9)
Possession Avg.	28:54	29:26
Sacks Allowed/Yards Lost	8/48	15/94
Sacks Made/Yards	10/73	9/52
Total Touchdowns Scored	6	5
Penalties Against/Yards	24/188	24/237
Punts/Avg.	22/43.9	21/43.1
Turnover Differential	-5 (27)	0 (15T)

 

[Stu Pidassle]

If the Patriots can't beat this Saints team, then we really should just look to next season. That's like the height of mediocrity in the NFL, you can't get past them and you got issues. Sure we might get W's off the Raiders, Giants and Jets again... but that doesn't mean much.

The Saints are bad because they played the "cap is crap" game too long and lost their generational QB. They are a good reference for where we are with the Pats and a good reminder that it is extremely difficult to rebuild while staying competitive. In addition to the injuries, the Pats roster still has major holes at WR and possibly/probably QB. Unwatchable games like Sunday are very discouraging parts of the process. A process that has been delayed 1 year due to the MP/JJ debacle last year which makes things feel even worse because we have not seen tangible evidence of progress for two years. Let's hope that the Saints game is the first where the pieces start coming together into a cohesive team.

 

[Patsfan1958]

 

[Rob0729]

The Saints are bad because they played the "cap is crap" game too long and lost their generational QB. They are a good reference for where we are with the Pats and a good reminder that it is extremely difficult to rebuild while staying competitive. In addition to the injuries, the Pats roster still has major holes at WR and possibly/probably QB. Unwatchable games like Sunday are very discouraging parts of the process. A process that has been delayed 1 year due to the MP/JJ debacle last year which makes things feel even worse because we have not seen tangible evidence of progress for two years. Let's hope that the Saints game is the first where the pieces start coming together into a cohesive team.

They are also a team that didn't have a contingency plan for post HOF QB. They should have drafted a QB high a year or two before Brees retired. They drafted a QB in the seventh round in Brees' last season, but they never drafted a QB in the first four rounds since 2015 prior to Brees retiring.

 

[Stu Pidassle]

They are also a team that didn't have a contingency plan for post HOF QB. They should have drafted a QB high a year or two before Brees retired. They drafted a QB in the seventh round in Brees' last season, but they never drafted a QB in the first four rounds since 2015 prior to Brees retiring.

I agree that no viable replacement at QB sunk both the Pats and the Saints. Between late draft position while the HOF QB is playing, ego conflicts and the fact that finding an elite QB is hit and miss makes developing the next guy while keeping the HOF QB is almost impossible. Montana to Young and Farve to Rogers are the exceptions.

 

[Rob0729]

I agree that no viable replacement at QB sunk both the Pats and the Saints. Between late draft position while the HOF QB is playing, ego conflicts and the fact that finding an elite QB is hit and miss makes developing the next guy while keeping the HOF QB is almost impossible. Montana to Young and Farve to Rogers are the exceptions.

The Pats did at least try with Garoppolo. Their sin was underestimating how long Brady would last in the league. They did have a good succession plan for what was the typical lifespan of a HOF QB career in place. But Brady defying the odds ruined that plan. The Patriots' sin was not going right back to the same strategy after they traded away Jimmy G.