Mac Jones' Last Five Games - 2022 vs 2021

[Toofy]

LOL! You think you are objective. That's adorable.

Herbert is one of the best QBs in the league. So is Burrow. Both have elite or superior receiving talent to throw to. And Herbert doesn't have a worse OC.

And by the way, the Pats are on their fourth starting RT and he was on the Jets' practice squad a month ago. Andrews missed a close to a month.

And let's not forget that DeVante Parker has missed a month, Meyers missed three games, Damien Harris missed three or four games. Everyone is dealing with injuries.

So does Tua. And Tua has the benefit of having two receivers who he can throw short passes to and allowing the receivers do all the work after the catch.

Geno Smith is a mobile QB who can make plays outside the pocket.

But Patricia is arguably the worst OC in the league. Many people and not just Mac defenders think he is the worst. Hell, even many people in the media who don't think Jones is not the answer at QB admit that. We literally have receivers who run routes designed to help the defense to cover them.

But again, guys you love like Evan Lazar and Dan Orlovsky, say the same thing I do about Patricia and the o-line.

But who says any of the lines you mentioned are actually worse than the Patriots' o-line. Why because the eyeball test isn't as reliable as "stats" that are compiled based on eyeball tests of other people?

This is why you guys aren't objective. You guys are trying to create a false narrative that Matt Patricia and the offensive line hasn't been all that bad this year and they are really pretty average. If you at least accepted that Patricia is one of the worst OCs in the game, you would have at least a little more credibility.

But most importantly, the guy who signs everyone's paychecks in Foxboro reportedly thinks the offensive coaching staff is awful and wants wholesale changes including the firing or reassignment of Patricia to a non-offense coaching position. If Kraft thought Patricia was just average or slightly below average, I am thinking he might be willing to give him a year two to show he has grown with another offseason.

And I have never said Patricia was all the problems for Jones' issues this year (that is you guys putting words in my mouth). Jones clearly didn't play well the first few months of the season. I think Jones has played fairly well, but inconsistently, since Thanksgiving. But he needs to improve his consistency. But I have said that basically everyone on offense except Trent Brown, Nelson Agholor, and Isiah Wynn gets a free pass this year in my eyes because of Patricia. A lot of the o-line issues have to do with Patricia as the o-line coach and him not giving Andrews as much freedom to make assignment audibles and the poor development of Strange.

And I have said that the #1 issue on this offense is Patricia and #2 isn't even close. I would put Jones at #4 or #5 after Patricia, the o-line, receivers not running good routes, and mental errors. And all the issues from #2 on are at least partially impacted by Patricia and his awful management of the offense.

Yes yes and a resounding yes ...

The Mac hate on this forum is unbelievable.. Brady has really clouded our judgement .QBs don't grow on trees and we made ourqb evaluation task infinitely difficult by having the worst OC, OLine coach,QB coach, ST coach and worst offensive line in operation this year.

How can you compare Herbert and Mac. Their offensive coach is pretty good. Just he makes some boneheaded decisions on 4th down. But not to the level of Patricia who makes tight ends run the same route and cause concussion to a 13 million dollar a year TE who has been having free lunch for 2 years ina row and possibly 3rd one as well.

And we do not have a mike Williams in our team. Dolphins enough said waddle and hill can just carry Patricia if he gives playcalling blindfolded .

Mac has every reason to be livid and so should you as a fan for wasting 1 year of Mac.

Bill wasted one year earlier by trying Cam when we knew he was washed up . Similarly high tower and Collins for an additional year when we knew they were also done.

2/3 years we have had subpar coaching and personnel decisions and that's on Bill.

Give Mac some time in pocket and a slot receiver with decent offensive line and imaginative OC, he can do wonders. Let's not waste his cerebral prowess by asking him to make plays 2ith his feet and scrambles.

 

[Toofy]

I agree with pretty much all of this.

I would say if Mac Jones was in Miami instead of New England with those weapons, people would be talking about him in a more favorable light than people were talking about Tua before he got injured. I think Mac is a better QB than Tua. That isn't saying he is a very good QB, but just better than Tua. Give him Hill and Waddle and McDaniel's system (McDaniel isn't a very good head coach, but a damn good offensive mind) and I think he would have had a pretty good season this year.

I think Mac can be a top 10 QB with the right pieces around him like Tua was this year before he got injured. Unfortunately, Jones doesn't look like he is going to be a QB who can elevate the talent around him if it is subpar like many of the elite QBs. Maybe someday he develops into that type of player, but at this point I wouldn't bet on it.

I think if the Patriots get O'Brien or another solid experienced OC, a solid #1 WR, maybe one or two other good supporting receivers, and fix the issues at offensive tackle; I think we will see a dramatic improvement from Mac next year. But that means Belichick has to realize he isn't Brady who could excel with a bunch of solid, but unremarkable #2 and #3 WR with no legitimate #1 receiver.

Hypothetical question... Do you think Joe burrow can elevate the pats ? If the answer is a No... That itself answers questions about Mac. Nobody outside of mahomes or lamar can elevate this team. With the horrible OLine and coaching probably Justin fields could have been a better fit but would probably not last beyond 2027.

 

[Ian]

Yes yes and a resounding yes ...

The Mac hate on this forum is unbelievable.. Brady has really clouded our judgement .

Like @BaconGrundleCandy has also mentioned, Mac is who he is, and I've lowered my expectations as well. Although, his physical limitations aside, he also needs to mature a bit also. I think there were probably several games where his emotions detracted to what might have been a better performance. I feel like the last two weeks he's done a better job playing in spite of whatever it was aggravating him so that's a start.

 

[crawhammer]

Has to be at least what it was last weekend, with a better performance in the middle. But he missed just four of his final fifteen, which is probably the best he's finished the game in a while. Need another one of those with a turnover-free performance and solid red-zone production. Can't win this one with field goals.

Even somewhat depleted, Buffalo has a much better defense than Miami (whose defense is really bad). If Mac merely plays at the level he did last weekend then he's in for a long day. I think he'll really need to elevate his game to finish with plus numbers in this one. Home-road is a variable too... this one is in Orchard Park.

 

[crawhammer]

Sunday won't change anything in terms of Jones. It doesn't matter if Jones throws three INTS or four TDs. Belichick doesn't evaluate his players based on one game. If he did, he would have cut most of the team after last year's playoff loss.

But he will have to have a good game for the Pats to have any chance of winning and getting into the playoffs.

If Mac throws 3 INTs and they lose badly then he may not be the starting quarterback for the Patriots next season.

 

[Ian]

Even somewhat depleted, Buffalo has a much better defense than Miami (whose defense is really bad). If Mac merely plays at the level he did last weekend then he's in for a long day. I think he'll really need to elevate his game to finish with plus numbers in this one. Home-road is a variable too... this one is in Orchard Park.

Yeah, not feeling great about it. Need some big plays by the offense to at least get some points on the board and keep it from getting out of hand. And probably another key turnover (or two...or three) from the defense.

 

[crawhammer]

Hypothetical question... Do you think Joe burrow can elevate the pats ? If the answer is a No... That itself answers questions about Mac. Nobody outside of mahomes or lamar can elevate this team. With the horrible OLine and coaching probably Justin fields could have been a better fit but would probably not last beyond 2027.

Joe Burrow? Come on, he's practically the best quarterback in the NFL. Of course he would elevate the Patriots. Your want for Mac to be good is clouding your judgment.

 

[Ian]

If Mac throws 3 INTs and they lose badly then he may not be the starting quarterback for the Patriots next season.

That's a little far, but it would alter their plans this offseason, with them potentially evening out the depth chart and adding another player to compete for it. But I still think they'd let him compete for the job.

 

[Ian]

Joe Burrow? Come on, he's practically the best quarterback in the NFL. Of course he would elevate the Patriots. Your want for Mac to be good is clouding your judgment.

Burrow would elevate the Patriots, but he wouldn't be as productive with this team as he's been in Cincinnati under Patricia. With McDaniels or O'Brien? Given what we saw with Brady, I would definitely say yes and I think that's more the crux of the argument there.

 

[Rob0729]

Hypothetical question... Do you think Joe burrow can elevate the pats ? If the answer is a No... That itself answers questions about Mac. Nobody outside of mahomes or lamar can elevate this team. With the horrible OLine and coaching probably Justin fields could have been a better fit but would probably not last beyond 2027.

I think Burrow would be better in this offense than Mac, but I don't know if he would be as much better as a lot of the anti-Mac people think.

 

[crawhammer]

Yeah, not feeling great about it. Need some big plays by the offense to at least get some points on the board and keep it from getting out of hand. And probably another key turnover (or two...or three) from the defense.

The Patriots need to win the turnover battle by a comfortable margin and get a score out of their defense or ST. Straight up game will go heavily in Buffalo's favor. We've seen it before.

 

[crawhammer]

That's a little far, but it would alter their plans this offseason, with them potentially evening out the depth chart and adding another player to compete for it. But I still think they'd let him compete for the job.

What I mean is if they don't bring in another quarterback who's clearly the starter then Mac and Zappe will enter training camp in an open competition for the starting job. That could go Zappe's way.

 

[Ian]

I think Burrow would be better in this offense than Mac, but I don't know if he would be as much better as a lot of the anti-Mac people think.

He'd be pretty good. He'd probably hit some of those windows that Mac would need an extra beat for and has probably missed out on because it closed too quickly for him.

 

[Ian]

What I mean is if they don't bring in another quarterback who's clearly the starter then Mac and Zappe will enter training camp in an open competition for the starting job. That could go Zappe's way.

You said he'd lose the starting job completely. My point is, they'd still let him compete for it.

 

[crawhammer]

Burrow would elevate the Patriots, but he wouldn't be as productive with this team as he's been in Cincinnati under Patricia. With McDaniels or O'Brien? Given what we saw with Brady, I would definitely say yes and I think that's more the crux of the argument there.

Burrow wouldn't have the numbers he currently has with Cincinnati but he would have to throw lefthanded to only have 11 TDs in 13 games.

 

[Rob0729]

Like @BaconGrundleCandy has also mentioned, Mac is who he is, and I've lowered my expectations as well. Although, his physical limitations aside, he also needs to mature a bit also. I think there were probably several games where his emotions detracted to what might have been a better performance. I feel like the last two weeks he's done a better job playing in spite of whatever it was aggravating him so that's a start.

Let's face it. A lot of people thought Brady was done in 2019 because he let his emotions affect his play. He was miserable that year and he let everyone know it. He was whiny in his press conferences. So even the best can let their emotions get the best of them in horrible situations.

I would argue that Jones is in a worse situation this year than Brady was during the season of 2019.

Yes, I would agree at least for one game his emotions appeared to really hurt his play. But I am not sure if a lot of that will transfer in other seasons because this season seems to be an extraordinary season when it comes to the chips stacked against him.

 

[crawhammer]

You said he'd lose the starting job completely. My point is, they'd still let him compete for it.

I said may not but anyway we're actually agreeing on the competition part. I just think if the Patriots lose badly on Sunday and Mac is one of the main reasons then it's going to be an ugly offseason.

 

[Ian]

I just think if the Patriots lose badly on Sunday and Mac is one of the main reasons then it's going to be an ugly offseason.

This part - we're 100% on the same page

 

[crawhammer]

Let's face it. A lot of people thought Brady was done in 2019 because he let his emotions affect his play.

I think you're overstating "a lot of people thought Brady was done." There were no signs of slippage in his play from a physical and mechanical standpoint. By the end of that 2019 season the offense was just garbage around Brady.

 

[Rob0729]

He'd be pretty good. He'd probably hit some of those windows that Mac would need an extra beat for and has probably missed out on because it closed too quickly for him.

I don't know if he would be pretty good. For the guys watching the game film, the problem with Mac having the extra beat has to do with receivers not getting open or looking back for the ball more than Mac's decision making.

Both Jones and Burrow's average time to throw last year was 2.4 seconds and this year they are both are at 2.2 seconds. They seem to be just as quick. Of course this counts both time to release and/or pressure.