MNF 12/12 Pre-game thread: Pats @ Arizona

[PatsFan2]

Here's a question with Nick Caley being a McDaniels disciple why give Fat Matt the OC's job in the first place?? What was BB thinking??

 

[PatsFan2]

He could still do that - I'd guess "dramatic changes" means changing the offensive scheme with a new OC, whereas changing the person calling the plays within the same scheme who already works on the staff is not "dramatic."

I'd guess if it was anyone to take over it would probably be Bill. Judge already lost out to Patricia, and Nick Caley seems bound to leave anyway. So who else?

Good for Nick Caley I wouldn't blame him if he leaves.

 

[Triumph]

We may need to lower expectations on that 10 - 7 season.

The Chiefs have the easiest remaining schedule left and will likely win out. Buffalo may need to keep the foot on he pedal and play NE full roster.

 

[cmasspatsfan]

Here's a question with Nick Caley being a McDaniels disciple why give Fat Matt the OC's job in the first place?? What was BB thinking??

He seemed to be the consensus front runner before the season, not sure what happened.

 

[Ross12]

Supposedly Mike Reiss also said this on radio today:

 

[ashley]

Good morning everyone, getting you ready for a Tuesday:

 

[Sicilian]

Supposedly Mike Reiss also said this on radio today:

Part of me wonders if that was always the plan (unless it went surprisingly well), assuming someone was available in the offseason that they liked (O'Brien as an example). Now, I imagine the change would be made regardless. The biggest obstacle I foresee is that the league trend right now is team's hiring OC's to be their head coach, meaning the good ones are moving up and their protege's are likely taking their place on their respective teams (or following them to their new one). It makes it harder to poach young offensive minds from other teams.

Hard to imagine anyone having a lot of faith in someone already on the staff given how the year has gone, but perhaps Nick Caley just needed another year and is ready in 2023, and Troy Brown could be a dark horse candidate. I think the players respect him, at least.

 

[ashley]

 

[Ross12]

Part of me wonders if that was always the plan (unless it went surprisingly well), assuming someone was available in the offseason that they liked (O'Brien as an example). Now, I imagine the change would be made regardless. The biggest obstacle I foresee is that the league trend right now is team's hiring OC's to be their head coach, meaning the good ones are moving up and their protege's are likely taking their place on their respective teams (or following them to their new one). It makes it harder to poach young offensive minds from other teams.

Hard to imagine anyone having a lot of faith in someone already on the staff given how the year has gone, but perhaps Nick Caley just needed another year and is ready in 2023, and Troy Brown could be a dark horse candidate. I think the players respect him, at least.

Yeah, obviously with Josh leaving and taking Mick Lombardi and others with him, Bill was left with only so many in-house options. Perhaps he didn’t love what was out there and felt the best choice was Bill O’Brien who would be available in 2023, so ran this “experiment” for a year to both see how it went and also to have a permanent backup guy. If your next OC leaves after a year or two years, you have someone who understands the basics of the offense and hopefully picked up a few things from the OC and can help impart that to whoever takes over. Basically, Patricia creates a layer of basic offensive knowledge security against future turnover, and is someone who can do the job in a pinch if need be... One train of thought I can sort of see.

 

[State]

Here's a question with Nick Caley being a McDaniels disciple why give Fat Matt the OC's job in the first place?? What was BB thinking??

Family and friends come first.

 

[ashley]

Asked Evan what he thought our biggest issues are offensively, he gave a pretty good and detailed answer:



Q: Hi Evan, what is the biggest issue with the Patriots offense: Mac, Matt Patricia, the offensive line, or the rest of the personnel? - @ashley1992_
Hey Ashley, good question. Let's rank them: one, the offensive line. You can have a rudimentary scheme and an inexperienced play-caller, but if you can block, that'll cover up a lot. Two, Patricia, because his play sequencing and non-imaginative schemes hurt this team. Three, Mac, mainly his inability to play under pressure causing the issues with the offensive line to be exacerbated. That leaves the other personnel in the last spot. They still have enough to be a respectable offense at the skill position if 1-3 were in order. Are they great there? No. But they need to get the most out of their receiver group.

 

[Sicilian]

Asked Evan what he thought our biggest issues are offensively, he gave a pretty good and detailed answer:



Q: Hi Evan, what is the biggest issue with the Patriots offense: Mac, Matt Patricia, the offensive line, or the rest of the personnel? - @ashley1992_
Hey Ashley, good question. Let's rank them: one, the offensive line. You can have a rudimentary scheme and an inexperienced play-caller, but if you can block, that'll cover up a lot. Two, Patricia, because his play sequencing and non-imaginative schemes hurt this team. Three, Mac, mainly his inability to play under pressure causing the issues with the offensive line to be exacerbated. That leaves the other personnel in the last spot. They still have enough to be a respectable offense at the skill position if 1-3 were in order. Are they great there? No. But they need to get the most out of their receiver group.

Short answer: Everything other than Rhamondre Stevenson.

 

[State]

Put together a game plan that establishes the run. Then the play-action passing game.

Involve the $50 million TE Jonnu Smith and the super fast WR from Baylor with the wrist size of an elderly woman in a nursing home you folks moved up to draft in the second round.

It’s your last call, Matt Patricia. Time to make it happen.

Here, let me help as you put together the scripted drives.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

He seemed to be the consensus front runner before the season, not sure what happened.

Breer: Why Patriots passed on two strong candidates for OC job

Why is Matt Patricia calling plays for the Patriots this season instead of Bill O’Brien or Nick Caley? Albert Breer broke it all down Sunday on Patriots Pregame Live.

www.nbcsports.com

But what about Caley, who is one of the longest-tenured offensive coaches in New England (hired in 2015)?


"He's been the one who has had to explain the offense and essentially teach the offense to a lot of people inside that building," Breer noted of Caley. "But he doesn't have a contract past this year. In fact, my understanding is that one of the reasons he didn't sign an extension is because he couldn't get clarity on his role.

"And now it's the same thing with Bill O'Brien where, because Bill Belichick doesn't know if Caley's going to be here past this year, he doesn't want to have to go through the process of replacing him (in 2023)."

It sounds like Belichick didn't want to change play-callers three times in three seasons and thus didn't want to risk naming an offensive play-caller who might leave the team next season. Thus, he landed on a trusted confidant in Patricia, who is entering his 16th season working with Belichick.

 

[ashley]

Short answer: Everything other than Rhamondre Stevenson.

lol, love me some Rham too, but I got the feeling that he thought you could win with our skilled players, just have to block and draw up plays better.

 

[Sicilian]

Breer: Why Patriots passed on two strong candidates for OC job

Why is Matt Patricia calling plays for the Patriots this season instead of Bill O’Brien or Nick Caley? Albert Breer broke it all down Sunday on Patriots Pregame Live.

www.nbcsports.com

And in the end, due to performance, he may have to go with a third in three years anyway. It's Oedipus. In an attempt to avoid his fate, he unwittingly brought about it's culmination.

 

[Sicilian]

lol, love me some Rham too, but I got the feeling that he thought you could win with our skilled players, just have to block and draw up plays better.

Oh I agree, just felt like being snarky this morning!

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

We also gotta gradually mix marcus jones into the offense more.

Thornton has disappointed, not sure if its him or the offensive incompetence, or maybe a bit of both. But that would be 2 legit home run threats. Exactly what this offense needed to add from last year’s version. Then there is strong also who im guessing gets a role next year.

Resign meyers , get a tackle, and get a coordinator who has a clue. Rhamondre / strong / Meyers/ bourne/ thornton / marcus / henry /parker has potential

 

[PatsFan2]

One reason why Nick Caley would pass on a Patriots extension is that he couldn't get clarification on his role. Great move HC/GM BB watch Caley latch on with McDaniels and become a household name.

 

[Sicilian]

We also gotta gradually mix marcus jones into the offense more.

Thornton has disappointed, not sure if its him or the offensive incompetence. But that would be 2 legit home run threats. Exactly what this offense needed to add from last year’s version. Then there is strong also who im guessing gets a role next year.

I think Thornton is a combination of things:

1) Injury set him back a little.

2) The offensive line not holding up really hampers using his biggest strength, which is deep speed.

3) He still needs to learn some technique for getting free at the line. There have been two or three plays in particular I can remember where Mac threw to a spot that was open if Thornton got a clean release.

4) Play design isn't really doing anyone on the offense many favors, Thornton included.

That said, he's a rookie and shoulders his share of the blame. No guarantee he gets better, even if those things are corrected, but it's hard to evaluate him (or anyone on offense) in a vacuum right now.