Wide Receivers depth chart

[BaconGrundleCandy]

If Thornton gets red-shirted this year but Tre Nixon becomes a Pro Bowl caliber player and they make the playoffs... the negative types will still whine about the Tyquan pick and ignore how this team is winning. It has always been thus...

I hear you. There will always be negative types, for sure. Some people can hold several different thoughts in their head though.

 

[Wozzy]

I was all for spending money last offseason on some weapons for Mac. In the case of Henry and Bourne it’s paid off. With Jonnu and Nelson to this point not so much.

I get that Nelson had a great year in 2020 and yes going from a vet in Carr to a rookie in Mac will have an effect on stats. But I’m not going to put it on our rookie as to why his yardage was cut in half from the previous season. If that was the case then Bourne’s numbers would’ve taken a hit as well. Maybe part of it was Agholor just falling back to his career averages in those 5 years in Philly before Vegas.

Agholor had a very specific position last year, he was the field stretcher on the offense. He was literally the only “fast” WR on the active roster.

If someone can’t figure out why a rookie Mac might thrive throwing to Bourne in the slot or underneath routes versus deep bombs downfield to Agholor then nobody can explain it to them.

Agholor took some time to develop in Philly, the fans were upset and impatient. But he ended up posting back to back 700+ yard seasons in years three and four, mostly playing in the slot. He went to Oakland and reinvented himself as a deep ball threat with Carr. That’s what earned him his deal in New England.

Is he amazing… no, but he’s solid. People act like the Patriots gave him a ton of money, he signed to a two year deal.

Tyreek just got 4 years, Davante Adams got a 5 year deal… hell Zay Jones got a 3 year deal for more than Agholor and he’s never left his “bust” status behind, Christian Kirk got a massive 4 year $72,000,000 deal and he’s never eclipsed 1000 yards once… this is the cost of free agent WR’s.

A rookie QB needs vet weapons and players around him, they can’t all be rookies out there bumbling around trying to learn what it takes to be a pro.

 

[Wozzy]

I hear you. There will always be negative types, for sure. Some people can hold several different thoughts in their head though.

Yet some people can’t get N’Keal Harry out of their heads….

Or accept that because he failed or Chad Jackson failed a decade before him that doesn’t preclude Thornton, Nixon, Wilkerson or even Marcus Jones possibly from being good/great in 2022.

 

[Water Boy]

All the players draft guides and grades get wrong rarely comes up in these conversations… it’s only after the results come in that so & so said this… ignore the hundred other examples they got wrong.

Where did they have Terry McClaurin I wonder?

N’Keal doesn’t suck because of “separation,” he sucks because he’s a dunce when it comes to football smarts and softer than Charmin tissue.

Why are we revisiting a 2019 draft pick anyway… are we going to flagellate ourselves for the next decade or so?

Good point. Not trying to flagellate. Just trying to wrap my head around the BB WR draft thought process. PFF's rankings weren't as dead nutz as I thought. They still had Harry as a late 2nd rounder ahead of McClaurin.

Here's the 2019 PFF Big Board:

17 Metcalf
20 AJ Brown
23 Whiteside
30 Isabella
31 Marquise Brown
42 Hakeem Butler
52 Deebo Samuel
61 N'Keal Harry
68 McClaurin

 

[jimnance]

Yet some people can’t get N’Keal Harry out of their heads….

Or accept that because he failed or Chad Jackson failed a decade before him that doesn’t preclude Thornton, Nixon, Wilkerson or even Marcus Jones possibly from being good/great in 2022.

Why waste your time with those posters?
Any Pats fan with half a brain knows that for every Nkeal there's been a Deion Branch, a Malcolm Mitchell. Troy Brown( who BB developed,not Parcells), Julian Edelman. Belichick's GOAT status,like Brady's, is intact.
I don't usually respond to morons,because they're, well,morons.
But there's plenty of legit posters who still question Belichick's mistakes. As long as they are balanced and acknowledge his greatness too,nothing wrong with that.
I mean,even I make fun of Nkeal's slowness because he is slow. It's sports, we're supposed to have fun with it. I don't agree with captain stone much,but he makes me laugh and I know he's a legit Pats fan. As for those few always negative and football-ignorant posters,I just ignore them.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Troy Brown( who BB developed,not Parcells),

Care to elaborate on this? Brown's numbers went up by default when Jefferson left after 1999 and went up again in 2001 when Glenn left. He certainly did a fine job picking up the slack as the go to WR, but his touches rightfully went back down and moved back to more of his traditional slot/3rd down role when better WR's like Branch and Givens emerged starting in 2002.

I see the same thing happening to Jacobi Meyers if Parker, Agholor or Thornton emerge with Bourne already breathing down his neck.

 

[Salsalife]

Agholor, 32 receptions, 473 yards 14.8 mil cap, 2 year deal
Smith, 28 receptions, 294 yards, 13.7 mil cap, 4 year deal
In my opinion Thorton starts all season. I believe he can get 28 yards a game to beat these peices of deadwood. It is what it is.
Any time theses guys get playing time is a waste for Thorton.

 

[captain stone]

If Thornton gets red-shirted this year but Tre Nixon becomes a Pro Bowl caliber player and they make the playoffs... the negative types will still whine about the Tyquan pick and ignore how this team is winning. It has always been thus...

You write as if you are placing equivalency between the two events, when the Entire World knows which of them is far, Far, FAR more likely to happen... Your point is therefore invalid because one has nothing whatsoever to do with the other.

 

[captain stone]

Again…we had a rookie QB last season. Is that so hard to understand? You can’t catch the ball if it’s not thrown to you.

If you're referring to Agholor, then was that also the problem for him in Philadelphia? Because he wasn't very good there either...

 

[Zuma]

If you're referring to Agholor, then was that also the problem for him in Philadelphia? Because he wasn't very good there either...

I’m referring to our rookie QB Mac Jones. Agholor had 896 yards in 2020. But yeah I understand your point.

 

[jimnance]

Care to elaborate on this? Brown's numbers went up by default when Jefferson left after 1999 and went up again in 2001 when Glenn left. He certainly did a fine job picking up the slack as the go to WR, but his touches rightfully went back down and moved back to more of his traditional slot/3rd down role when better WR's like Branch and Givens emerged starting in 2002.

I see the same thing happening to Jacobi Meyers if Parker, Agholor or Thornton emerge with Bourne already breathing down his neck.

How many times did Parcells cut Brown?

 

[jimnance]

Care to elaborate on this? Brown's numbers went up by default when Jefferson left after 1999 and went up again in 2001 when Glenn left. He certainly did a fine job picking up the slack as the go to WR, but his touches rightfully went back down and moved back to more of his traditional slot/3rd down role when better WR's like Branch and Givens emerged starting in 2002.

I see the same thing happening to Jacobi Meyers if Parker, Agholor or Thornton emerge with Bourne already breathing down his neck.

Lol. Either you got a bad memory or you didn't watch all of Troy's career. Parcells barely utilized him.
Pistol Pete did better but nothing on the scale that BB did.
Troy's wr #'s spiked immediately when Belichick took over. Yes,they went down a bit in 2007 when they had Moss and Welker. Nuff said there.
BB also used more than anyone else as a punt returner and he started 12 games as a cb in 2004. 3 ints 17 tackles in 12 games for the undefeated reg season Pats.
You surely aren't trying to argue that Parcells is responsible for Troy's development are you? Lol

 

[TheRainMaker]

Lol. Either you got a bad memory or you didn't watch all of Troy's career. Parcells barely utilized him.

Your memory seems shot too given that Glenn and Jefferson were guys that more deserving of the ball. Troy Brown was always known as the Pats slot guy on 3rd downs. They also had Coates who was Bledsoe's go to guy when they needed a chain moving grab. He also got banged up in 1998 and 1999. You also probably don't remember teams ran the ball a lot more, so passing opportunities were limited to 3rd and 4th WR's. Prior to 1996, I don't know what to tell you.

You surely aren't trying to argue that Parcells is responsible for Troy's development are you? Lol

I never said that, nor did I imply that.

Yes,they went down a bit in 2004 when they had Moss and Welker. Nuff said there.

If you're going to be a smart azz with your quote in bold above, it's probably a good idea to know your history that he didn't play in 2007 when Moss and Welker arrived - not 2004. And they went down immediately with the additions of Branch in 2002 and Givens emerging in 2003 - not 2004.

BB also used more than anyone else as a punt returner and he started 12 games as a cb in 2004. 3 ints 17 tackles in 12 games for the undefeated reg season Pats.

Again, he was their primary punt/kick returner two years prior to Bill's arrival.

I tried to give you the benefit of the doubt, but you came back with what I expected - no argument.

 

[zipster9]

Tyquan Thornton better hold up in the winter games.... He is like a straw-framed and has no insulation...

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

Agholor, 32 receptions, 473 yards 14.8 mil cap, 2 year deal
Smith, 28 receptions, 294 yards, 13.7 mil cap, 4 year deal
In my opinion Thorton starts all season. I believe he can get 28 yards a game to beat these peices of deadwood. It is what it is.
Any time theses guys get playing time is a waste for Thorton.

You know Agholor's name but not Thornton's? I always find it hard to respect the opinion of someone who is so invested that they do not even know the guy's name.

 

[jimnance]

Your memory seems shot too given that Glenn and Jefferson were guys that more deserving of the ball. Troy Brown was always known as the Pats slot guy on 3rd downs. They also had Coates who was Bledsoe's go to guy when they needed a chain moving grab. He also got banged up in 1998 and 1999. You also probably don't remember teams ran the ball a lot more, so passing opportunities were limited to 3rd and 4th WR's. Prior to 1996, I don't know what to tell you.

I never said that, nor did I imply that.

If you're going to be a smart azz with your quote in bold above, it's probably a good idea to know your history that he didn't play in 2007 when Moss and Welker arrived - not 2004. And they went down immediately with the additions of Branch in 2002 and Givens emerging in 2003 - not 2004.

Again, he was their primary punt/kick returner two years prior to Bill's arrival.

I tried to give you the benefit of the doubt, but you came back with what I expected - no argument.

Lol. Obviously I meant 2007 not 2004 for Pats undefeated season. Obvious typo. So that's the bulk of your argument. Which is,you have no argument.
You absolutely implied Parcells had more to do with his development than BB,which is bs.
Yes he was the primary punt returner b4 BB got there. But BB used him more. His highest punt return and wr #'s were with with BB,not Parcells or Pete.
And neither of them used him as a cb.
You're so full of ****.

 

[Pats2000]

All the players draft guides and grades get wrong rarely comes up in these conversations… it’s only after the results come in that so & so said this… ignore the hundred other examples they got wrong.

Where did they have Terry McClaurin I wonder?

N’Keal doesn’t suck because of “separation,” he sucks because he’s a dunce when it comes to football smarts and softer than Charmin tissue.

Why are we revisiting a 2019 draft pick anyway… are we going to flagellate ourselves for the next decade or so?

I plan on flagellating until I die. Sometimes you gotta do what the wife isn't in the mood for that day.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

Agholor, 32 receptions, 473 yards 14.8 mil cap, 2 year deal
Smith, 28 receptions, 294 yards, 13.7 mil cap, 4 year deal
In my opinion Thorton starts all season. I believe he can get 28 yards a game to beat these peices of deadwood. It is what it is.
Any time theses guys get playing time is a waste for Thorton.

Tyquan Thornton: 0 receptions, 0 TDs, 0 catches eva. Slow your roll. I like the upside too, but he'll be in year 1 of the Pats playbook, and we do not know how good he is or isn't yet. I want him to be though, same with Wilkerson, and I am hoping for Agholor to "get it" and getting up near 900 yards like in 2020 with the Raiders. I mean, is Agholor broken now, or just still getting used to the Pats & our rookie QB. He might be okay. Jonnu played as a middle of the pack TE but is being paid like a good one. But you're not replacing a TE with Tyquan Thornton.

The receivers ahead of TyThorn include Bourne, Parker, Meyers, and Agholor, the odds-on faves to be the starting guys going 4 deep.) Those are the ones it would mean he is REALLY kicking butt out of the gate if he suppllants.

I'll add, howeever, that if he's phenomenal in camp. he brings something they don't, except Agholor sort of, in his straight-line speed.

Tre Nixon made his case in the minicamp however, and right now you have to consider him ahead of Thornton too. Kristian Wilkerson is also full of upside. I see them as having a ton of different skill sets in camp. Whoever is active each week. we have quality depth. No real star, yet, but with this kind of depth do we even want Mac staring down that one must-feed guy? Well, sure, if he's that good. Hey, could be Tyquan.

Oh and by the way, a lot of guaranteed money in both Agholor's and Smith's deal. If you're paying anyway, good to have their services. Sort of dumb to declare that locked-in spend a waste of playing time for an unproven -- and inexpensive -- rookie prospect. He's ours on the cheap for a while. He's the one we can afford to be patient with, unless he is that good.

 

[Patsgofor4]

Agholor, 32 receptions, 473 yards 14.8 mil cap, 2 year deal
Smith, 28 receptions, 294 yards, 13.7 mil cap, 4 year deal
In my opinion Thorton starts all season. I believe he can get 28 yards a game to beat these peices of deadwood. It is what it is.
Any time theses guys get playing time is a waste for Thorton.

A. If you are going to write rubbish about their talented, explosive, but fairly raw, rookie WR, at least spell his name correctly.

B. Currently, Agholor is a much better NFL WR than Thornton. If the goal is to win as many games as possible this season, Thornton absolutely does not start all season. If he progresses to the point where he is ready to overtake one of the vets and assume a full-time role by Nov/Dec, that would be a huge win. It is what it is.

 

[Salsalife]

Tyquan Thornton: 0 receptions, 0 TDs, 0 catches eva. Slow your roll. I like the upside too, but he'll be in year 1 of the Pats playbook, and we do not know how good he is or isn't yet. I want him to be though, same with Wilkerson, and I am hoping for Agholor to "get it" and getting up near 900 yards like in 2020 with the Raiders. I mean, is Agholor broken now, or just still getting used to the Pats & our rookie QB. He might be okay. Jonnu played as a middle of the pack TE but is being paid like a good one. But you're not replacing a TE with Tyquan Thornton.

The receivers ahead of TyThorn include Bourne, Parker, Meyers, and Agholor, the odds-on faves to be the starting guys going 4 deep.) Those are the ones it would mean he is REALLY kicking butt out of the gate if he suppllants.

I'll add, howeever, that if he's phenomenal in camp. he brings something they don't, except Agholor sort of, in his straight-line speed.

Tre Nixon made his case in the minicamp however, and right now you have to consider him ahead of Thornton too. Kristian Wilkerson is also full of upside. I see them as having a ton of different skill sets in camp. Whoever is active each week. we have quality depth. No real star, yet, but with this kind of depth do we even want Mac staring down that one must-feed guy? Well, sure, if he's that good. Hey, could be Tyquan.

Oh and by the way, a lot of guaranteed money in both Agholor's and Smith's deal. If you're paying anyway, good to have their services. Sort of dumb to declare that locked-in spend a waste of playing time for an unproven -- and inexpensive -- rookie prospect. He's ours on the cheap for a while. He's the one we can afford to be patient with, unless he is that good.

Thanks for the insight. I see your point. Bethel Johnson ran a 4.38 and was on 2 Super bowl teams. Here is what i see for Tyquan this rookie season. Explosive. Punt returner starter, special team gunner and 10 plays a game, perfect.