DRAFT Cole Strange-Welcome to the Pats

[Guts]

A trip down memory lane…

Remember when he was drafted? The Patriots took him with the 32d pick in the 2005 draft, out of Fresno State. The experts — feel free to apply your own air quotes there — had him pegged as a later-round selection. Some had him multiple rounds later.
When his name was announced during ESPN’s draft coverage, I recall a look of bewilderment crossing Mel Kiper Jr. face while a puzzled Chris Berman asked him, essentially, who the hell is this guy? (I believe what he actually said as he looked Kiper’s way was a shrugged, “Well?”)
He clearly disliked the pick, but he was paralyzed from saying as much because he knew there was a damn good chance he would look foolish for challenging Belichick’s knowledge of the player. So he timidly called it a reach, then wrote this the next day:

"Guard Logan Mankins was a reach in the first round but the Patriots obviously like his size and nastiness, and he will help fill the void left by Joe Andruzzi’s departure via free agency."​

The latter part of the evaluation proved spot on. And, not even in retrospect but in that very moment, should have negated the idea that Mankins was a reach.

www.boston.com/sports/new-england-patriots/2014/08/26/logan_mankins/

Logan Mankins
6× All-Pro (2007, 2009, 2010, 2011–2013)
7× Pro Bowl (2007, 2009–2013, 2015)
NFL 2010s All-Decade Team
New England Patriots All-2000s Team
New England Patriots All-2010s Team
New England Patriots 50th Anniversary Team
Madden Most Valuable Protectors Award (2010)

If he turns out to be as succesful as Mankins it would be an all time great pick. Let's see what happens I didn't like the pick last night and may have overreacted, but now proceeding with optimism. I wouldn't be hard on the people questioning the pick though because he could easily be a bust as well we shall see.

 

[TheRainMaker]

@captain stone where are you? We need your analysis.

 

[A Defiant Goose]

Did we?

No we really didn't lol

 

[upstater1]

I think it means they thought that Strange could help the team more than those other players, i.e. was their best fit for their system and circumstances. Doesn't mean that a different team might have a totally different ranking based on their system and circumstances.

That's basically what BB told Zolak the other day.

My conclusion is that the idea of a universal consensus draft board is a construct created to cater to draftniks. The idea that draft picks should be evaluated by hypothetical universal value achieved has questionable utility to teams drafting but is a construct very useful and dear to draftniks who rely on that construct to score their personal research efforts vs what teams actually do.

It does lead to absurd conclusions, such as validating that Brady was at best a 6th round pick as he actually did fall to there (and the question remains whether he was actually still a reach at the 6th round --he might have fallen to the 7th!) Drafting Brady in say the 2nd round would have been one of the greatest draftnik reaches of all time, because we know he was available at the 6th round and we'd have thrown away a 2nd rounder of universal value needlessly -- despite the present consensus that Brady became the GOAT.

The construct of a universal consensus draft board is hugely useful to draftniks but of no real importance to teams actually drafting, who care primarily about maximizing perceived value to them in their system and circumstances, and secondarily to up to the minute specific intelligence about the likelihood that the players atop their proprietary board might be similarly valued by *any* other team. They don't care about consensus value at all -- unless they are so desperate with their public image that they need to cater for PR reasons to the draftnik consensus.

We're talking about a lot of different players at a lot of different positions. It's not just a couple of positions and a couple of guys.

We're talking about 15 to 20 players that will go between 21 and 40. And many of them will be at positions a lot more dire than OG.

For example, CB. Let's say Belichick snags Kyler Gordon or Andrew Booth. That will go a long way toward reinforcing the logic of the Strange pick.

But what if he doesn't?

There is a very strong case to be made that we had greater need than a guard, and if Strange was a need pick, then why was the position prioritized? Usually a good argument for this would be depth at other positions compared to guard. But outside of Gordon and Booth, no one really sees this depth at CB at all.

 

[Rob0729]

Then STFU and leave. Or block me. Just stop being such a whiny little bee yotch.

You are the one who got offended by what I said even though I didn't direct my comments directly at you. Maybe you should block me.

 

[Kasmir]

If you hate the man running the organization, who has brought more success than anyone in the history of the game, you hate the organization.

I predict that once Belichick and Brady are gone, most will return to rooting for the Pats.

 

[everlong]

Go check out

People really gotta stop using draftnik boards as if teams just use those and don't have their own. You have no clue if he would have been there at 54 or 85.

Go watch the Rams video. He wasn't that high on anyone's board. This is Al Davis drafting Darius Heywood Bey a round too early but since it's Bill people want to defend it. Even if the kid turns out to be Logan Mankins, and I hope he does, they still took him too high. Hopefully it's not another Tavon Wilson.

 

[Wozzy]

If he turns out to be as succesful as Mankins it would be an all time great pick. Let's see what happens I didn't like the pick last night and may have overreacted, but now proceeding with optimism. I wouldn't be hard on the people questioning the pick though because he could easily be a bust as well we shall see.

Nobody thinks Guard is a sexy pick.

If draft picks become great players where they’re drafted is irrelevant.

 

[ashley]

Some Strange love:

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

Starting to warm up to the pick. We still need a strong day 2 / day 3 to keep this rebuild going in the positive motion. One hole seems to be taken care of, now hopefully address cb,lb,dl, special bonus if we land an ot.

Plenty of later picks too for a punter and wr prospect.

 

[203Pat]

A trip down memory lane…

Remember when he was drafted? The Patriots took him with the 32d pick in the 2005 draft, out of Fresno State. The experts — feel free to apply your own air quotes there — had him pegged as a later-round selection. Some had him multiple rounds later.
When his name was announced during ESPN’s draft coverage, I recall a look of bewilderment crossing Mel Kiper Jr. face while a puzzled Chris Berman asked him, essentially, who the hell is this guy? (I believe what he actually said as he looked Kiper’s way was a shrugged, “Well?”)
He clearly disliked the pick, but he was paralyzed from saying as much because he knew there was a damn good chance he would look foolish for challenging Belichick’s knowledge of the player. So he timidly called it a reach, then wrote this the next day:

"Guard Logan Mankins was a reach in the first round but the Patriots obviously like his size and nastiness, and he will help fill the void left by Joe Andruzzi’s departure via free agency."​

The latter part of the evaluation proved spot on. And, not even in retrospect but in that very moment, should have negated the idea that Mankins was a reach.

www.boston.com/sports/new-england-patriots/2014/08/26/logan_mankins/

Logan Mankins
6× All-Pro (2007, 2009, 2010, 2011–2013)
7× Pro Bowl (2007, 2009–2013, 2015)
NFL 2010s All-Decade Team
New England Patriots All-2000s Team
New England Patriots All-2010s Team
New England Patriots 50th Anniversary Team
Madden Most Valuable Protectors Award (2010)

That 2005 roster was lightyears better than this one.

 

[Wozzy]

@captain stone where are you? We need your analysis.

Why?

Everything sucks… Captain analysis.

 

[crawhammer]

Unfortunately, yesterday was like Christmas to the Belichick Haters Club. Whether they are part of the Brady over Patriots crowd or just think Bill lost it or whatever, they all were hoping that Bill would trade down and then reach for a player at a position that a majority of people don't see as one of the biggest priorities. A lot of this has nothing to do with the selection or the player and more about another chance to pile on Bill.

And before I am jumped on for this post, I am not saying everyone is piling on Bill today are part of this group, but the usual suspects are here and some are doing the most piling on.

No. The pick sucks. Belichick made it. Who else should take the criticism?

Look, you said it right there, Belichick literally did exactly what you said... trade down and then reach for a player... completely ridiculous. It's the god damn 21st pick of the 1st round of an exceptionally deep draft and there were several players with definite 1st round talent sitting right there to be taken and he ends up with a creampuff that he could have taken much later in the draft. MAJOR FAIL.

 

[Wozzy]

That 2005 roster was lightyears better than this one.

What does that have to do with adding a great guard prospect, a position of need?

 

[1960Pats]

But itt doesn't change the fact that they are poising the wells to make the piling on worse. There is a difference between legitimately criticizing the pick and just coming in to pill on Belichick because you hate the guy.

I have no problem with people who legitimately hate the pick without bias against Belichick, but the Boo Hoo Brady Crew always come out of the woodworks on days like this and just make the board unreadable.

Btw, the first negative responses I saw, and there were a sh!tload of them, were in response to a negative post by Ken, one of the most respected posters here and clearly not part of the "Boo Hoo Brady Crew" that you're whining about.

And how the f*** are you helping this thread with more Brady bs out of nowhere? Aren't you happy that Ian moved the Brady talk to it's own forum? By the look of this post and many others here, that was one of Ian's best moments. He knew what was coming.

 

[patsfan13]

um, whuh huh?

I am generally critical of Bill Belichick's abilities as a general manager. This morning, far more people are agreeing with that criticism than disagreeing. How is that "truth hurts"...? Seem to me that you are the one with the butthurt more than others. Happy Columbus Day!!

Kyle Dugger says hi. along with R Seymour, L Mankins.

 

[XLIX]

You are the one who got offended by what I said even though I didn't direct my comments directly at you. Maybe you should block me.

Why would I do that? Your posts provide me with some of the best laughs I have had all month....

Basically the Patriots traded Shaq Mason and a 1st round pick for Cole Strange, a 6th round pick, and some salary cap space. I think you are the only person in this forum who cannot see how horrible of a move that is.

 

[Nunchucks]

A trip down memory lane…

Remember when he was drafted? The Patriots took him with the 32d pick in the 2005 draft, out of Fresno State. The experts — feel free to apply your own air quotes there — had him pegged as a later-round selection. Some had him multiple rounds later.
When his name was announced during ESPN’s draft coverage, I recall a look of bewilderment crossing Mel Kiper Jr. face while a puzzled Chris Berman asked him, essentially, who the hell is this guy? (I believe what he actually said as he looked Kiper’s way was a shrugged, “Well?”)
He clearly disliked the pick, but he was paralyzed from saying as much because he knew there was a damn good chance he would look foolish for challenging Belichick’s knowledge of the player. So he timidly called it a reach, then wrote this the next day:

"Guard Logan Mankins was a reach in the first round but the Patriots obviously like his size and nastiness, and he will help fill the void left by Joe Andruzzi’s departure via free agency."​

The latter part of the evaluation proved spot on. And, not even in retrospect but in that very moment, should have negated the idea that Mankins was a reach.

www.boston.com/sports/new-england-patriots/2014/08/26/logan_mankins/

Logan Mankins
6× All-Pro (2007, 2009, 2010, 2011–2013)
7× Pro Bowl (2007, 2009–2013, 2015)
NFL 2010s All-Decade Team
New England Patriots All-2000s Team
New England Patriots All-2010s Team
New England Patriots 50th Anniversary Team
Madden Most Valuable Protectors Award (2010)

What were the needs on that team? Did the defense play like dog crap for the last quarter of the 2004 season? Nope, they had just won the superbowl.

 

[archstanton543]

@captain stone where are you? We need your analysis.

Anyone check the Zakim?

 

[XLIX]

Btw, the first negative responses I saw, and there were a sh!tload of them, were in response to a negative post by Ken, one of the most respected posters here and clearly not part of the "Boo Hoo Brady Crew" that you're whining about.

And how the f*** are you helping this thread with more Brady bs out of nowhere? Aren't you happy that Ian moved the Brady talk to it's own forum? By the look of this post and many others here, that was one of Ian's best moments. He knew what was coming.

It is hilarious how the people who most complain about how much this board talks about Tom Brady are always the one who bring him up into every single thread.