Player Signing Patriots use 2nd Round Tender on Jacobi Meyers

[captain stone]

There is little reason to believe that a WR chosen by Belichick in the first would be better than Myers. I understand that many here believe that any WR THEY WOULD draft in the 2nd surely would be better than Myers.

And for good reason too.

 

[rochrist]

Ok fair enough. And we agree that NE would take the 2nd in all likelihood. It would be an opportunity to get an equivalent guy who's 4 years younger and save $3m+ on the cap.

As others have said, Meyers is similar to Jabbar Gaffney who was a valuable contributor. Doesn't have top end speed or high YAC, but is smart, tough, and moves the chains. He'll be on this team for the next 8 years.

Except Gafney never sniffed 83 catches. He topped out at 68. With NE he was in the mid-30s.

 

[dliverey44]

Jakobi is a very good route runner because he has to be due to his lack of explosiveness and I will take his dedication to his craft all day. We have all seen players that are more physically gifted but lack work ethic fail in this league. Give me the WR that understands his limitations and is willing to put in the work to make sure he stays on the field. He is not flashy but has been very clutch at times over the last 2 years.

I really don't understand the desire by some to want to see him leave. Mac seems to trust him; he understands the system and comes up big when needed. Sure a 2nd round pick Could be good, but I think the smart move is sticking with a valuable piece of the offense. Just my opinion.

 

[Kasmir]

Jakobi is a very good route runner because he has to be due to his lack of explosiveness and I will take his dedication to his craft all day. We have all seen players that are more physically gifted but lack work ethic fail in this league. Give me the WR that understands his limitations and is willing to put in the work to make sure he stays on the field. He is not flashy but has been very clutch at times over the last 2 years.

I really don't understand the desire by some to want to see him leave. Mac seems to trust him; he understands the system and comes up big when needed. Sure a 2nd round pick Could be good, but I think the smart move is sticking with a valuable piece of the offense. Just my opinion.

He gets his opportunities schematically. Mac's accuracy and anticipation works with him because of his size and hands and because they're on the same page. But his inability to get YAC makes him a liability. Mac to Meyers was 72nd in DVOA, i.e. below average. If he's taking opportunities away from Bourne, it's a problem, as Mac to Bourne was the #1 DVOA combo in the league. Bourne ran a 4.53s 40 and a 6.73s 3-Cone, so he's faster and much more agile than Meyers, hence the much superior YAC and production. I think Bourne would be the much better slot receiver. His measurables are much closer to Edelman and Welker.

Given what Mac has been able to do with inferior talent, if Edelman were to return to the Pats, I think Mac to Edelman would be a unstoppable combo. I think finding a replacement for Edelman is much more important to Mac than a upgrade to Agholor. Improving downfield production is more a matter of scheme and Mac's improving his arm strength.

 

[mgteich]

Are we saying that we can get a much better WR with our 2nd pick than Myers (much better)?

If so, then we certainly should draft a WR with our 2nd pick.

 

[Jim Beankie]

tl;dr - Jakobi is explosive enough (37" Vert Jump / 1.56s 10yd split). He just has terrible top end speed.

I got so confused a few months ago after finding out that Jakobi had the 3rd highest avg speed out of 89 WRs (with
min 200 routes) after 1 second post snap (through Week 13 this season - Bourne was 1st). It didn't make too much sense because he just seems so slow (unless they count motion plays like jet sweeps - hope not). It wasn't until I started analyzing the historic* 10yd splits of the recent combine that it all made sense. Despite his slow 40 time, his 10yd split is pretty fast. His 1.56s split is faster than a lot of these Pro Bowlers.

mike evans 1.6
kupp 1.62
davante adams 1.64
justin jefferson 1.57
deebo samuel 1.6
SDiggs 1.53

(pro day so prob hand time and inaccurate / not electronic)
Ja'maar 1.59
Tyreek 1.5

As far as the 10yd split is concerned, he's officially the 2nd fastest on the Patriots, with JJones at 1.47 (which
until this year* is REAALLLY fast) the only one faster. CDavis (1.51), SWade (1.53), KWilkerson (1.45!!!) were all pro days, so probably hand times, which are going to be inaccurate, so I'm not going to count them. Here are other Patriots of note:

Bourne 1.61
Agholor 1.59
Edelman 1.52 (pro day prob ht)
Gronk 1.58
Mccourty 1.6

The guy has good acceleration from a stop (until a governor kicks in early) and is kindof explosive, but just has terrible top end speed (heck if there's such a thing called medium end speed, it wouldn't be great, either). It's probably why his YAC is not that great. It's clear to me now that he needs to work with a track coach to improve his cadence (steps per minute). Peaking at high 250s ain't gonna get it done at his height - he's running like a 400m runner. (Edit: he does get up to 280 during the combine but his steps are short/choppy.)

Side note - imho, I have a feeling Wilkerson has a lot of untapped potential (1.45ht 10yd, 39.5 VJ, 6.68 3cone) and could conceivably be the next good slot receiver assuming he can improve the drops. He just needs more opportunities and time and a move away from his reps at mostly X. Barring an injury, it's probably not going to happen this year (or ever) since Bourne needs to be in there more.

 

[Kasmir]

tl;dr - Jakobi is explosive enough (37" Vert Jump / 1.56s 10yd split). He just has terrible top end speed.

I got so confused a few months ago after finding out that Jakobi had the 3rd highest avg speed out of 89 WRs (with
min 200 routes) after 1 second post snap (through Week 13 this season - Bourne was 1st). It didn't make too much sense because he just seems so slow (unless they count motion plays like jet sweeps - hope not). It wasn't until I started analyzing the historic* 10yd splits of the recent combine that it all made sense. Despite his slow 40 time, his 10yd split is pretty fast. His 1.56s split is faster than a lot of these Pro Bowlers.

mike evans 1.6
kupp 1.62
davante adams 1.64
justin jefferson 1.57
deebo samuel 1.6
SDiggs 1.53

(pro day so prob hand time and inaccurate / not electronic)
Ja'maar 1.59
Tyreek 1.5

As far as the 10yd split is concerned, he's officially the 2nd fastest on the Patriots, with JJones at 1.47 (which
until this year* is REAALLLY fast) the only one faster. CDavis (1.51), SWade (1.53), KWilkerson (1.45!!!) were all pro days, so probably hand times, which are going to be inaccurate, so I'm not going to count them. Here are other Patriots of note:

Bourne 1.61
Agholor 1.59
Edelman 1.52
Gronk 1.58
Mccourty 1.6

The guy has good acceleration from a stop (until a governor kicks in early) and is kindof explosive, but just has terrible top end speed (heck if there's such a thing called medium end speed, it wouldn't be great, either). It's probably why his YAC is faaarrr from great (that and his elusiveness / ability to break tackles is subpar). It's clear to me now that he needs to work with a track coach to improve his cadence (steps per minute). Peaking at high 250s ain't gonna get it done at his height - he's running like a 400m runner.

Side note - imho, I have a feeling Wilkerson has a lot of untapped potential (1.45ht 10yd, 39.5 VJ, 6.68 3cone) and could conceivably be the next good slot receiver assuming he can improve the drops. He just needs more opportunities and time and a move away from his reps at mostly X. Barring an injury, it's probably not going to happen this year (or ever) since Bourne needs to be in there more.

So Bourne was the fastest WR off the line in the league and the #1 DVOA receiver? He also had the 3rd highest catch rate in the league. He needs to get more targets and more slot assignments. Could see a major 2nd year FA leap here...

And someone needs to get on the horn to Edelman to see if he's actually contemplating un-retiring before he pulls a Gronkowski move on them.

 

[Sfpat]

A second round pick don’t guarantee anything,

We could get UDFA who run faster than 4.63 in the 40, couldn’t we?

What did Jerry Rice run? Asking for a friend

 

[mgteich]

What did Jerry Rice run? Asking for a friend

You all should make up your mind.

Is it desirable for a WR to have good speed?

Yes, there are very fast players who are JAGs or wore.

And yes, there are slow players that have succeeded.

That does NOT inform the issue. Or, perhaps the combine and pro day should simply throw away the clocks and watches.
============
My BOTTOM LINE is that improving the speed of patriot WRs is NOT an issue.

 

[WhatJustHappened]

Plenty of GREAT WRS that didn't have exceptionally fast 40's.

Look around for lists that show what people consider "Top All-time WR", and those lists are loaded with GREAT WRS with Mediocre 40 times...then look at the fastest combine 40 times by WRS, and compare.

I personally want to see more "Short Area quickness" types like KW get a shot, maybe he just needs to learn the playbook or nuances of the position better, but shaking loose at the line, recognizing where the soft spot will be, and getting there quickly are really important IMO.

While straight line speed is awesome to have, the unemployment line has been loaded with fast guys forever.

 

[VJCPatriot]

nobody will give up a 2nd for Meyers. That's why we tendered him.

 

[PatsFan2]

Jim Beankie: did an excellent job explaining Meyers: his lack of top end speed is like a handicap for him right now. Really hope he improves that because he looks lumbering on tape. He would really struggle against good CB's no need to mention elite.

 

[WhatJustHappened]

Jim Beankie: did an excellent job explaining Meyers: his lack of top end speed is like a handicap for him right now. Really hope he improves that because he looks lumbering on tape. He would really struggle against good CB's no need to mention elite.

He's useless because some useless **** SAYS he is?
Wake up, he's useful, he KNOWS the route tree, understands the program.
STFU you FKN IMBECILE, you're part of this discussion was fine after your 1st post.
Reject...bah, you're WORSE THAN PATHETIC.
**** OFF.

 

[PatsFan2]

He's useless because some useless **** SAYS he is?
Wake up, he's useful, he KNOWS the route tree, understands the program.
STFU you FKN IMBECILE, you're part of this discussion was fine after your 1st post.
Reject...bah, you're WORSE THAN PATHETIC.
**** OFF.

You need to stop drinking.

 

[Jim Beankie]

He's useless because some useless **** SAYS he is?
Wake up, he's useful, he KNOWS the route tree, understands the program.
STFU you FKN IMBECILE, you're part of this discussion was fine after your 1st post.
Reject...bah, you're WORSE THAN PATHETIC.
**** OFF.

Dude I'm very confused - you liked my analysis (or my post) then it looks like you just called me some useless ****? Ouch. I definitely didn't say he was useless - actually Jakobi's been my favorite player on the Pats since his rookie year (yes over TB12). This isn't to you, but I've mentioned this before - he gets open against great CBs (like XavienH) consistently (or for example against TDiggs in the Cowboys game in OT on the deciding 3rd and short - Mac just decided to go elsewhere which was the wrong decision). It's just that once he catches the ball, he's going to get caught in no time - hence the poor YAC stat.

 

[WhatJustHappened]

You need to stop drinking.

You've been a fkn idiot on here for YEARS, I Laugh at your PATHETIC NONSENSE, routinely you are a fkn CLOWN.
Dude, your opinion means as much as my Drip, you're PATHETIC.
**** Off!

 

[WhatJustHappened]

Dude I'm very confused - you liked my analysis (or my post) then it looks like you just called me some useless ****? Ouch. I definitely didn't say he was useless - actually Jakobi's been my favorite player on the Pats since his rookie year (yes over TB12). This isn't to you, but I've mentioned this before - he gets open against great CBs (like XavienH) consistently (or for example against TDiggs in the Cowboys game in OT on the deciding 3rd and short - Mac just decided to go elsewhere which was the wrong decision). It's just that once he catches the ball, he's going to get caught in no time - hence the poor YAC stat.

He's a DECENT player, NOT a Superstar, and NOONE that likes him here says he is.
If anyone says he should be CUT, they are PATHETIC, and they just don't understand football.
Hope that helps Jim.

 

[Grogan14]

What did Jerry Rice run? Asking for a friend

also Antonio Brown

 

[Jim Beankie]

He's a DECENT player, NOT a Superstar, and NOONE that likes him here says he is.
If anyone says he should be CUT, they are PATHETIC, and they just don't understand football.
Hope that helps Jim.

Ah I see - thanks for the clarification. I misread your post (it wasn't directed to me). My bad.

 

[Pape]

What did Jerry Rice run?

Hills