Why do people say Mac Jones has a weak arm?

[Schmo]

An example I can think of is last game, or the game before (?), he threw a 10 yard out to the sideline and it just barely beat the cb that was breaking on the throw. That's one of the times a cannon arm is useful, but it can be overcome with anticipation and timing. Receivers at this level can usually turn and locate the ball when it's already in the air.

His college film is full of 50+ yard throws, so that really isn't a concern. The main reasons why I think he isn't getting a lot of velocity on his throws is that he is having to get the ball out quicker than he'd like and is picking up a habit of throwing off his back foot before he can shift his weight.

Strong arm, not a cannon like Elway or Rodgers. Still, he's generally making good decisions and being very accurate, even under pressure. He has a VERY quick release, and has a handful of plays this year where he completes the pass when a qb like Cam would get strip sacked while winding up.

 

[TheRazorsEdge]

Mac Jones is a good qb.

That's all I got.

 

[RobertWeathers]

You don't need a lightening bolt of an arm to be a great QB.

I could give exactly 2 ****s if Mac is in the bottom 1/2 of strong-armed QBs.

All that matters is he wins and runs the offense to its optimal efficiency.

 

[Joker]

Mac Jones is a good qb.

That's all I got.

keep searching young man...indeed you are well on the road to self enlightenment and understanding your relationship to the universe...

 

[Rob0729]

No, he didnt have a stronger arm than brady his first few years. I hear this a lot, you guys need to go back and look at some of those early throws by Brady. That one to brown to beat miami in OT, I have never seen anything like that from Jones. I am not sure where this Brady does not have good arm strength came from. When brady has actually had a deep threat, he leads everytime in deep passing.

Brady had decent arm strength too when he came into the league, but he got much better over the years.

I just think Jones’ arm strength is underrated because how he throws. He throws more touch passes than a zip passes. When does throw a ball with velocity, he has plenty of zip on the ball. But touch passes look like they are weak passes because they tend to be a bit slower because the passes focus more on accuracy than velocity and tend to be more arching. But the advantage of touch passes is they are more pin point accurate. Manning had good arm strength (pre-surgeries) and most of his passes were touch passes. Brady on the other hand has a good mix of both touch and zip passes.

And Brady never had a real deep threat until 2007. That was six years into his career. He had complete retooled his body by then and had six off seasons where he would train with a throwing coach to improve his passing skills.

 

[Rob0729]

2 offseasons with Tom House and he's golden on arm strength. Although he can already make all the throws out to 50 yards *right now* if the OLine doesn't suck.

.

For most of Brady’s career, he worked out with a throwing coach during the offseason working on his mechanics and strength. Over the years you can see a huge change in his passing. Most of the best QBs in the league use throwing coaches in the offseason.

 

[NormZauchin]

Who is pretending? PatsFans love the theoretical suggestions that do not exist. No-one is pretending, unless you are.

The ball velocity required is dependent on when you recognize and throw the ball. If the QB "sees" the play earlier and throws the ball a half second sooner, the QB does not need as much velocity on the ball to "squeeze it in". Fans always like the pass when there is a lot of spin and zip on it, but those balls are harder to catch. When asked, Kendrick Bourne said that Mac's throws are like catching a pillow because he throws the ball so early he does not have to throw it as hard (not as much zip). Another way to say it is that Mac adds as much zip as is required, that is why you can not differentiate his short and long throws, both look effortless.

The comparison to Chad Pennington only means you never watched Chad Pennington throw. Mac looks completely different than Pennington. Chad used a painful motion to throw, Mac looks effortless.

Talking about the ability of receivers to catch the throw is a forgotten point. I would be interested to see the number of drops per team and compare the "cannon arm" passers with those quarterbacks who throw a softer ball. Over the years, I've watched a lot of strong-armed quarterbacks throw a laser to a halfback ten yards away and see it bounce off the guy's hands, sometimes for an interception.

 

[JarOfMayo51]

Hey all. Yesterday I send a question in to Patriots Playbook on Patriots.com



If you don't want to watch the video my question is basically why do people say Mac Jones has a weak arm? I'm not a master talent evaluator by any means but he seems to be able to throw the ball down the field.

I'm just wondering where this comes from, like what is the actual evidence his arm is weaker than his peers? The Eye test? or are there some actual metrics I haven't seen. Just trying to learn more about the game and the position.

Thanks everyone!

He doesn't have a weak arm, its just a result of today's social media trend... If a QB doesn't have the #1 laser, rocket arm in the league, he has a "weak" arm.

He also uses touch on the ball, which people confuse as "weakness," because after all, why would you not throw it 150 mph at a receiver every single time? Gotta show off the cannon!

 

[doesntmatter1]

His arm isn't weak, but I wish it had a little more zip on those out patterns. Those can easily be pick6s if you aren't careful. His arm will be tested the day we have to play in high winds and snow.

Also, people have to nitpick things like arm strength because he playing far better than a rookie qb should.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

Talking about the ability of receivers to catch the throw is a forgotten point. I would be interested to see the number of drops per team and compare the "cannon arm" passers with those quarterbacks who throw a softer ball. Over the years, I've watched a lot of strong-armed quarterbacks throw a laser to a halfback ten yards away and see it bounce of the guy's hands, sometimes for an interception.

I only realized it with the Kendrick Bourne interview. I thought it made sense, and obviously if Bourne is catching the passes, it must be right.

 

[upstater1]

Theres an unofficial combine metric called "Ball Velocity" that is the closest thing we have to empirical evidence in this area. Unfortunately, there was no combine in 2021, so we don't have the numbers for Mac. Based on the eye test alone, he definitely seems to throw it slower than average for the NFL level. That doesn't necessarily mean he has a weak arm though.

It's really all irrelevant when it comes to games. Brady was considered to throw the fastest ball of all and that was because of his mechanics and accuracy. I really don't care about the Jeff George's and Jamarcus Russell's of the world. If you can put mustard on it and be accurate, that's what matters. Throwing hard at a combine and putting zip on it in a game are two different things.

 

[BigPeteG]

It's really all irrelevant when it comes to games. Brady was considered to throw the fastest ball of all and that was because of his mechanics and accuracy. I really don't care about the Jeff George's and Jamarcus Russell's of the world. If you can put mustard on it and be accurate, that's what matters. Throwing hard at a combine and putting zip on it in a game are two different things.

The book on Jones was that he doesn't run that well and he doesn't have a huge arm. He is more brains then brawn so to speak.

"Jones might top out in the NFL as a backup quarterback. He has a quality arm, but does not elite arm strength and is not a running threat for the next level. Jones has ability in terms of moving his feet in the pocket, so he is not a statue, but he will not be a dual-threat quarterback in the pros.

While Jones does not exceptional arm strength or playmaking ability with his feet, he is an accurate passer. He places his ball well, putting it in position for his receiver to make the catch while avoiding putting the pass in danger of being intercepted. Jones is a smart decision maker who protects the ball well and doesn't get careless or panic. He also demonstrated anticipation to help throw receivers open in 2020."

(From WalterFootball.com)

I am going to say it - book was pretty accurate in some ways.. I don't think his arm is like Josh Allen or Rodgers. He is just not as big or strong as those guys - so why would he throw a better ball? Generally big strong guys can throw the ball faster and farther..

What Mac has going for him is that BB and company look for what he has - and do not need a guy with elite arm talent. They want someone accurate who can make good decisions. They want someone tough - mentally.. They want someone dedicated to the team..

I think they have all that in Mac - and that's why on the Pats he can be a starter. FWIW all the "bad" comparisons people like to make - guys like Alex Smith and Kirk Cousins - they would have had a very different career in the Patriots system. Circumstances matter a lot in the NFL. If BB was the coach of the 49ers - Alex Smith would have won that super bowl - IMHO..

It's the same with Jones running speed. He is not a slug like old man Ben. But he isn't putting the fear of god into defenses with his legs. His mobility is normal for an NFL QB. Fields as he was scouted is way more mobile. Guy looks a little like Lamar out there. Scouts as it turns out are not clueless.. Some teams just put different values on different aspects of a player..

 

[Deus Irae]

Brady had decent arm strength too when he came into the league, but he got much better over the years.

I just think Jones’ arm strength is underrated because how he throws. He throws more touch passes than a zip passes. When does throw a ball with velocity, he has plenty of zip on the ball. But touch passes look like they are weak passes because they tend to be a bit slower because the passes focus more on accuracy than velocity and tend to be more arching. But the advantage of touch passes is they are more pin point accurate. Manning had good arm strength (pre-surgeries) and most of his passes were touch passes. Brady on the other hand has a good mix of both touch and zip passes.

And Brady never had a real deep threat until 2007. That was six years into his career. He had complete retooled his body by then and had six off seasons where he would train with a throwing coach to improve his passing skills.

Brady won the NFL Challenge longest throw in 2003.

 

[Ivan]

Because someone said he has a bad arm.

 

[Rob0729]

Brady won the NFL Challenge longest throw in 2003.

That is a bunch of guys in shorts and t-shirts screwing around for a free trip to Hawaii. And the deep pass competition was not an deep ball accuracy competition.

If I remember correctly he didn’t do nearly as well in some of the accuracy competitions where he was more accurate passer than almost every QB competing. That competition was entertaining to watch, but did little to tell you who these QB was.

 

[Tbone7112000]

keep searching young man...indeed you are well on the road to self enlightenment and understanding your relationship to the universe...

huh? seems like a guy that believes in what he's seen as Mac as a better than average QB. he wasn't disparaging anyone's opinion. What does the rest of your "self enlightenment and universe" BS have anything to do here? Perhaps you should speak with Kyrie Irving. This guy seems just fine to me!!!! Because you called him out as a young man ... perhaps your age has made you a grumpy old man?

 

[mgcolby]

You don't need a lightening bolt of an arm to be a great QB.

I could give exactly 2 ****s if Mac is in the bottom 1/2 of strong-armed QBs.

All that matters is he wins and runs the offense to its optimal efficiency.

Kinda like this guy.....

 

[Joker]

huh? seems like a guy that believes in what he's seen as Mac as a better than average QB. he wasn't disparaging anyone's opinion. What does the rest of your "self enlightenment and universe" BS have anything to do here? Perhaps you should speak with Kyrie Irving. This guy seems just fine to me!!!! Because you called him out as a young man ... perhaps your age has made you a grumpy old man?

Uh...OK....you are 100% WRONG. I was remarking about his MONIKER..The Razor's Edge...a novel by W. Somerset Maugham. B.S.? Only to an uneducated kneejerk azzole looking for a message board fight...add to that your ageist bigoted remark you absolute MORON.


The Razor’s Edge, philosophical novel by W. Somerset Maugham, published in 1944.


The novel is concerned in large part with the search for the meaning of life and with the dichotomy between materialism and spirituality. Set in Chicago, Paris, and India in the 1920s and ’30s, it involves characters from sharply different worlds. The main focus of the story is on Larry Darrell, who has returned from service as an aviator in World War I utterly rejecting his prewar values. He is concerned chiefly with discovering the meaning of human existence and eliminating evil in the world. To that end, he spends five years in India seeking—but not finding—answers.

Perhaps YOU should ponder your own ignorance and keep that in mind before you try to go off on me half-cokked again.

 

[NormZauchin]

The book on Jones was that he doesn't run that well and he doesn't have a huge arm. He is more brains then brawn so to speak.

"Jones might top out in the NFL as a backup quarterback. He has a quality arm, but does not elite arm strength and is not a running threat for the next level. Jones has ability in terms of moving his feet in the pocket, so he is not a statue, but he will not be a dual-threat quarterback in the pros.

While Jones does not exceptional arm strength or playmaking ability with his feet, he is an accurate passer. He places his ball well, putting it in position for his receiver to make the catch while avoiding putting the pass in danger of being intercepted. Jones is a smart decision maker who protects the ball well and doesn't get careless or panic. He also demonstrated anticipation to help throw receivers open in 2020."

(From WalterFootball.com)

I am going to say it - book was pretty accurate in some ways.. I don't think his arm is like Josh Allen or Rodgers. He is just not as big or strong as those guys - so why would he throw a better ball? Generally big strong guys can throw the ball faster and farther..

What Mac has going for him is that BB and company look for what he has - and do not need a guy with elite arm talent. They want someone accurate who can make good decisions. They want someone tough - mentally.. They want someone dedicated to the team..

I think they have all that in Mac - and that's why on the Pats he can be a starter. FWIW all the "bad" comparisons people like to make - guys like Alex Smith and Kirk Cousins - they would have had a very different career in the Patriots system. Circumstances matter a lot in the NFL. If BB was the coach of the 49ers - Alex Smith would have won that super bowl - IMHO..

It's the same with Jones running speed. He is not a slug like old man Ben. But he isn't putting the fear of god into defenses with his legs. His mobility is normal for an NFL QB. Fields as he was scouted is way more mobile. Guy looks a little like Lamar out there. Scouts as it turns out are not clueless.. Some teams just put different values on different aspects of a player..

"he will not be a dual threat quarterback in the pros." And this is, at least, part of what the geniuses at WalterFootball.com would have us believe limits Mac Jones to the role of backup quarterback in the NFL. Just forget that the GOAT quarterback may also be the slowest qb to ever play the game. No, you have to be a dual threat and they make this statement after Brady wins another Super Bowl. Why anyone would read anything that these morons write about draft prospects is beyond me.

 

[NormZauchin]

Uh...OK....you are 100% WRONG. I was remarking about his MONIKER..The Razor's Edge...a novel by W. Somerset Maugham. B.S.? Only to an uneducated kneejerk azzole looking for a message board fight...add to that your ageist bigoted remark you absolute MORON.


The Razor’s Edge, philosophical novel by W. Somerset Maugham, published in 1944.


The novel is concerned in large part with the search for the meaning of life and with the dichotomy between materialism and spirituality. Set in Chicago, Paris, and India in the 1920s and ’30s, it involves characters from sharply different worlds. The main focus of the story is on Larry Darrell, who has returned from service as an aviator in World War I utterly rejecting his prewar values. He is concerned chiefly with discovering the meaning of human existence and eliminating evil in the world. To that end, he spends five years in India seeking—but not finding—answers.

Perhaps YOU should ponder your own ignorance and keep that in mind before you try to go off on me half-cokked again.

Liked the book a lot. Thought the movie was good, but not great. However, I loved watching Gene Tierney, one of the great beauties of the silver screen.