Antonio Brown

[venecol]

I'll never understand how you Brown defenders believe that sexual assault and rape is no different than going to a hooker.

Yes, Kraft's case is criminal and the other case is much flimsier. But what Kraft is accused of pales in comparison to what Brown is accused of and that's the reason for the difference in treatment.

Just to be clear, all you AB haters, are perfectly fine with the NFL opening investigations into any player that is merely accused of something in a civil case. They can investigate and place said player in the EL as they see fit, and you guys are OK with this, correct?

Or is this only for AB?

 

[Chevy]

Just to be clear, all you AB haters, are perfectly fine with the NFL opening investigations into any player that is merely accused of something in a civil case. They can investigate and place said player in the EL as they see fit, and you guys are OK with this, correct?

Or is this only for AB?

Just for AB? Nope - but I bet this is covered in the CBA.

 

[venecol]

Huh?
You do realize one is a player, the other an owner?

From the NFL's position, these "cases" have no similarity whatsoever.

All things "Antonio Brown" must be handled in accordance with bargained NFLPA guidelines.

Any thing "Kraft" is strictly a Commissioner/Owners issue

What disparity of treatment?
The NFL has made no judgements on either Brown or Kraft.

The "purgatory" you are so distraught about is a figment of your imagination.

Common misconception: "Because of Brown's baggage, the NFL is blocking him from an NFL roster."
His signing with NE demonstrated that the NFL was not interferring with Brown's career.
Only differences between post-Raiders and post-Patriots is Brown's baggage is considerably heavier

Is it Brown's right to be on an NFL roster?
Do NFL teams have the right to fill rosters as they wish?

Don't make the statement "I'm done with the NFL" and expect the NFL to treat you like a current player

I also wonder how the NFLPA would react if the NFL moved forward in the proactive manner you are advocating for and investigated a non roster player while his 8 claims against two NFL teams are being evaluated by the ruling body that hears such grievances.
Likely the NFLPA would frame any NFL investigation during the hearing phase as an act of intimidation against a union member.

It has been widely reported that Owners fall under the same personal conduct standards as players when it comes to protecting the shield (whatever the f%^k that means), and can be punished by the league, so they both should be viewed in the same manner.

You are correct, however, that the reason they are not, is that one is a billionaire Owner, and the other is just a millionaire player, among other things.

NFL is definately blocking any team from hiring AB by formally stating he is under investigation and can be placed in EL at any moment, "once hired by a team."

As to your last point, the NFL already announced they are continuing their AB investigation, so there is that.

The treatment of these two cases couldn't be more White and Black.

 

[venecol]

That's just #927 on the list.........

The only people crazier than AB are the clueless sad sacks arguing for him on this messageboard.

For the sake of humanity I hope those naive people have somebody handling their finances.

.

LMAO at the resident psychiatrist wannabes and judgemental azz whipes.

Maybe you should take a hint from Tom Fu..kin Brady who seems to care about people and lives in a no judgment zone. You worried about TFBs finances?

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Just to be clear, all you AB haters, are perfectly fine with the NFL opening investigations into any player that is merely accused of something in a civil case. They can investigate and place said player in the EL as they see fit, and you guys are OK with this, correct?

Or is this only for AB?

I’ll be right back. I’m going to file a civil lawsuit against Patrick Mahomes. There is literally zero bar of proof to prevent me from doing so.

 

[venecol]

Yes, because people (and thus advertisers) care more about sexual assault and rape (which is what Brown is accused of) than going to a hooker.

Tell that to the other Billionaire caught in Vero Beach, who was forced to resign from his Wall Street venture capital firm, lol. Fact!

 

[venecol]

Just to clarify:

1. I never judged BK in his So Fl fiasco, in fact defended him against police actions and strongly support his acquittal based on cops abuse of warrants. I also believe prostitution should be legal.

2. I have 8 sisters and a daughter, there is nothing more despicable in my view than sexual assault or rape. I am not defending AB of his accusations, and if true, he should be sent to jail, not merely have to settle for a cash-out.

3. I was against hiring AB, actually I never believed the Pats would do it. I was wrong.

4. I believe in process. I deal with Codes every day. One can only play if you know the rules. You can't just go around making sh%^t up. We're about to sue the County over their staff making stuff up.

5. My issue has to do with process. The NFL has never suspended or placed a player in the EL over a civil charge. In fact, the Pats have 2 current cases with "criminal charges" (Kraft and Chung). Yet they are not doing anything about it, but waiting for the outcome.

6. AB case is being treated completely different. Based on everything we know (not made up stuff or conjecture), he is being castigated in a different way than other cases. This is not about the charges, but the process.

7. No one will ever convince me that AB got released over the texts. That is BS. Some on the other side have finally come around to understand the league pressured Pats to release him or he would be placed on EL.

8. One can defend Kraft's case, not like AB, and still believe AB is being treated differently by Kraft and the NFL.

9. Finally, for the moral majority in the crowd that think he is crazy, we'll continue that discussion if and when he prevails in his grievances against both teams. You definately have to be crazy to pay a dude $9M to play one game to catch one TD. I actually saw that $9M TD live. LMFAO.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Just to clarify:

1. I never judged BK in his So Fl fiasco, in fact defended him against police actions and strongly support his acquittal based on cops abuse of warrants. I also believe prostitution should be legal.

2. I have 8 sisters and a daughter, there is nothing more despicable in my view than sexual assault or rape. I am not defending AB of his accusations, and if true, he should be sent to jail, not merely have to settle for a cash-out.

3. I was against hiring AB, actually I never believed the Pats would do it. I was wrong.

4. I believe in process. I deal with Codes every day. One can only play if you know the rules. You can't just go around making sh%^t up. We're about to sue the County over their staff making stuff up.

5. My issue has to do with process. The NFL has never suspended or placed a player in the EL over a civil charge. In fact, the Pats have 2 current cases with "criminal charges" (Kraft and Chung). Yet they are not doing anything about it, but waiting for the outcome.

6. AB case is being treated completely different. Based on everything we know (not made up stuff or conjecture), he is being castigated in a different way than other cases. This is not about the charges, but the process.

7. No one will ever convince me that AB got released over the texts. That is BS. Some on the other side have finally come around to understand the league pressured Pats to release him or he would be placed on EL.

8. One can defend Kraft's case, not like AB, and still believe AB is being treated differently by Kraft and the NFL.

9. Finally, for the moral majority in the crowd that think he is crazy, we'll continue that discussion if and when he prevails in his grievances against both teams. You definately have to be crazy to pay a dude $9M to play one game to catch one TD. I actually saw that $9M TD live. LMFAO.

You should also take a look at the open civil lawsuit against Brown whereby he threw furniture out the balcony, nearly hitting a child, allegedly, that wasn’t worth a league inquiry, since he was on the Steelers back then.

Anyone without complete bias can understand that when the term “unprecedented” is used to describe the way the league approaches a Patriots disciplinary issue, it’s pretty much the norm, and much of the reason for that is that Orchid Bob still didn’t learn his lesson from 2007 and 2015. Another huge disadvantage for the sake of the league’s integrity, as Bob bites again while Tyreek Hill warms up for the season.

It’s always unprecedented because no other owner bends over like Bob.

 

[QuantumMechanic]

7. No one will ever convince me that AB got released over the texts. That is BS. Some on the other side have finally come around to understand the league pressured Pats to release him or he would be placed on EL.

It's the texts that led Roger/NFL to decide to EL him if he wasn't released first.

You can go ahead and excuse the texts as no big deal -- that's you're right to do so even though you're blatantly wrong to excuse them (and you'd never so blithely excuse them if they were sent to your daughter).

However, the NFL knew that the texts weren't gonna fly in a #MeToo world (and reportedly had already been hearing some flak from advertisers) and didn't want Brown playing for the time being. So the told NE something like "We're gonna EL him Monday. Your move." and NE subsequently released him. This is backed up by the memo the league sent to all the teams, which is clearly a veiled threat to EL him if anyone signs him.

And I totally believe Kraft also saw the texts for what they were and may well have ordered Brown's release over them. But even if he hadn't, I firmly believe Brown was about to be ELd and so he was gonna get released regardless of how Kraft felt about the texts.

 

[shmessy]

Really? You are somehow concluding that people critical of Kraft are less aware of the financial aspect of this move? The busted contract is basically the entire reason why people think Kraft should have continued having AB on the roster, since the money is already gone anyway, and he has a huge uphill battle on not paying Brown his signing bonus (by all precedent and logic, he will eventually be forced to pay it out and there will be not future cap credit.) If the Patriots hadn't signed Brown, this thread wouldn't be this length of have this much disagreement. They did sign him, though, and that's why it's nonsensical to "cut your losses" and take a zero when the league is already going to give you an exempt roster spot during any investigation/suspension, which would be a benefit that any reasonable owner would use during a time like this. That you'd refer to the pro-keeping Brown crowd as "naive" when it comes to financials is head-scratching.

Kraft doesn't want to the stain of having Antonio Brown as an official member of the Patriots (even as an inactive/suspended player), which is why he cut him. Belichick and locker room did not make this decision because it's so illogical. The only rationale behind it is that Kraft personally can't handle Brown being associated with his franchise; otherwise, even if there's a 10% chance Brown gets his act together and can still contribute on the field, that's enough of a reason to roll the dice and keep him. The risk has already been taken and the cap hit taken; the only thing left to do is see if there is any reward to that, even if smaller than hoped for (which may still be enough between winning and not winning a Super Bowl.)

In less than 40 weeks he stranded the Steelers in the last game of the season with the playoffs on the line. He then "retired" from the NFL because of his helmet and had to be pulled away from haymaking his GM by Vontaez Effing Burfickt, of all people. Last week he went Jimmy Piersall in a courtroom.

Pray tell, Ice Ice, what on earth makes you think he would last 3 weeks in Foxboro? Most people with sense can see this guy's life is freefalling at an accelerating pace. That boulder is picking up speed down the mountain as we speak.

Everyone else can see it. The few AB defenders that are still hanging in there are remarkably naive.

.

.

 

[BUSTAMOVE]

You're in favor of voluntarily taking a zero on a $9M investment that still has potential upside, just to be clear.

Crystal Clear! I don’t want that ZERO on this team

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

In less than 40 weeks he stranded the Steelers in the las game of the season with the playoffs on the line. He then "retired" from the NFL because of his helmet and had to be pulled away from haymaking his GM by Vontaez Effing Burfickt, of all people. Last week he went Jimmy Piersall in a courtroom.

Pray tell, Ice Ice, what on earth makes you think he would last 3 weeks in Foxboro? Most people with sense can see this guy's life is freefalling at an accelerating pace.

Bill Belichick is well aware of Brown’s problems, signed him and didn’t want to release him. Given that, I don’t think the burden is on me to justify how he’d fit into the locker room. He already was fitting in just fine, by all accounts, in the bubble of their team.

 

[sambam94]

It's the texts that led Roger/NFL to decide to EL him if he wasn't released first.

You can go ahead and excuse the texts as no big deal -- that's you're right to do so even though you're blatantly wrong to excuse them (and you'd never so blithely excuse them if they were sent to your daughter).

However, the NFL knew that the texts weren't gonna fly in a #MeToo world (and reportedly had already been hearing some flak from advertisers) and didn't want Brown playing for the time being. So the told NE something like "We're gonna EL him Monday. Your move." and NE subsequently released him. This is backed up by the memo the league sent to all the teams, which is clearly a veiled threat to EL him if anyone signs him.

And I totally believe Kraft also saw the texts for what they were and may well have ordered Brown's release over them. But even if he hadn't, I firmly believe Brown was about to be ELd and so he was gonna get released regardless of how Kraft felt about the texts.

if kraft is likely on the hook for the $9m which has been reported..why would AB being put on the EL matter? Let the investigation and civil suit play out and he might only miss 6 games or so if innocent. If guilty, cut him then.
The NFL letting kraft know he would go on the EL didn't mean kraft had to cut him beforehand. He probably thought he wouldn't have to pay..and maybe he won't.

 

[Biffins]

I've moved past this nonsense, but I keep on seeing the above and want some source to this.
EDIT: NVM I see no one can come up with a source for this version.

My understanding of events is:

Monday - SI article comes out
Wednesday- AB sends text messages
Thursday - NFL contacted by attorneys for painter. NFL tells AB not to contact painter.

Are you saying NFL told AB not to contact painter on Monday when SI story came out? Nobody knew about this painter until the story broke. Did they ask him not to contact the piranha tank guy too?

I'm coming around to your view here. You're right, all the articles I have found on this state after the fact that AB was told not to contact the accuser. It's not clear at all that he was explicitly told anything.

 

[Biffins]

That's just #927 on the list.........

The only people crazier than AB are the clueless sad sacks arguing for him on this messageboard.

For the sake of humanity I hope those naive people have somebody handling their finances.

.

I run a fund so in fact my professional job is to handle other people's finances............... possibly yours.

 

[Biffins]

I'll never understand how you Brown defenders believe that sexual assault and rape is no different than going to a hooker.

Yes, Kraft's case is criminal and the other case is much flimsier. But what Kraft is accused of pales in comparison to what Brown is accused of and that's the reason for the difference in treatment.

The police has a video of Kraft caught in the act and noone's denied he's broken the law (soliciting). He's getting the case thrown out on technical violations including how the evidence was gathered.

Brown is innocent until proven otherwise in the court of law. And in fact no criminal investigation is being done as the authorities have said the cases have no merit, let alone charges being filed. He's facing one civil suit, which is completely bogus based on known evidence and videos that we are privy too. And in the second case was the victim of a character assassination hit piece from a hack journalist at SI.

You're right that the accusation against Brown is serious, but the presumption of innocence must reign supreme, and the preponderance of evidence points to the accusations being completely bogus. I feel sorry for AB for being the victim here.

 

[Biffins]

WHat is the 'plenty of reason for doubt'? That he can catch a football real good?

Have you not followed the thread? There have been tons of videos posted of AB and the first accuser together after the alleged incident. She claimed in the civil suit that they had a "brother-sister relationship" and videos have surfaced of them in bed together in their underwear. Lots of evidence points to the claims being completely bogus. The police said there's no case to pursue.

The second accuser isn't even filing a civil suit. It's a years old story, dug out by a SI journalist after the media furor, and she was likely paid for participating in the story. The police said there's no case to pursue.

 

[shmessy]

I run a fund so in fact my professional job is to handle other people's finances............... possibly yours.

I sure as hell hope not. Not for me or my clients, for that matter, given you're obvious blindness to risk.

.

 

[Biffins]

Crystal Clear! I don’t want that ZERO on this team

lol

 

[Biffins]

It's the texts that led Roger/NFL to decide to EL him if he wasn't released first.

You can go ahead and excuse the texts as no big deal -- that's you're right to do so even though you're blatantly wrong to excuse them (and you'd never so blithely excuse them if they were sent to your daughter).

However, the NFL knew that the texts weren't gonna fly in a #MeToo world (and reportedly had already been hearing some flak from advertisers) and didn't want Brown playing for the time being. So the told NE something like "We're gonna EL him Monday. Your move." and NE subsequently released him. This is backed up by the memo the league sent to all the teams, which is clearly a veiled threat to EL him if anyone signs him.

And I totally believe Kraft also saw the texts for what they were and may well have ordered Brown's release over them. But even if he hadn't, I firmly believe Brown was about to be ELd and so he was gonna get released regardless of how Kraft felt about the texts.

Not sure what you mean by "excuse them". AB was wrong to send them. That doesn't mean he deserves to be deprived of his livelihood. It's a disproportionate reaction.