Week 5 Thoughts: Can 17 Point Wins be Ugly?

[Oswlek]

Why don't some of you spoiled fans go back to the days like the year 1990 when we were THRILLED to win at all let alone winning by 17 points

This is ridiculous to even discuss - A win is a win / F-ck the stats

If we happen to win the next 12-14 games by 12-14 points in total (1 point winning margin) thats good enough for me,Unfortunately some fans want nothing but domination

Look back on these days in several years from now when NE is again a 5-11 club or worse...Then you will be thankful you were alive to be a part of this era which will NOT come along again in your lifetime in all likelyhood

I know because a true fan should never critique the team after a win.

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

I know because a true fan should never critique the team after a win.

The old saying goes "A good effort in a win is better than an awesome effort in a loss" - Guys who criticize wins have not been paying attention to some of those years of the Patriots sucking from pre-1993 or maybe too young to have even been a part of watching it with disgust.

 

[Oswlek]

The old saying goes "A good effort in a win is better than an awesome effort in a loss" - Guys who criticize wins have not been paying attention to some of those years of the Patriots sucking from pre-1993 or maybe too young to have even been a part of watching it with disgust.

You caught me. I jumped on board the bandwagon in Feb of 2002.

 

[BradyManny]

The old saying goes "A good effort in a win is better than an awesome effort in a loss" - Guys who criticize wins have not been paying attention to some of those years of the Patriots sucking from pre-1993 or maybe too young to have even been a part of watching it with disgust.

Dude, a major strength of this board is critical analysis that many posters here provide, win or lose, tight game or blowout. If you're hear for just "ra ra, go team, go", then find another board.

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

Dude, a major strength of this board is critical analysis that many posters here provide, win or lose, tight game or blowout. If you're hear for just "ra ra, go team, go", then find another board.

I don't think your opinion means much to me as a matter of fact its garbage, but thanks anyway

The nature of this thread is if we don't humiliate every opponent something is wrong and its going to be that way since fans are used to those 20 point wins - Grow up,Its the NFL,Not little league or high school

The Patriots are NOT going to dominate every game in 2007 - Get it through your thick heads,Take wins for what they are,Very hard to win and even harder to keep it up week after week

I think if ANY head coach or player would hear this,his response would be the same...A win is a win,Ugly or not -its hard to win in the NFL consistently either by 1 point or 30

 

[Deus Irae]

I don't think your opinion means much to me as a matter of fact its garbage, but thanks anyway

The nature of this thread is if we don't humiliate every opponent something is wrong and its going to be that way since fans are used to those 20 point wins - Grow up,Its the NFL,Not little league or high school

The Patriots are NOT going to dominate every game in 2007 - Get it through your thick heads,Take wins for what they are,Very hard to win and even harder to keep it up week after week

I think if ANY head coach or player would hear this,his response would be the same...A win is a win,Ugly or not -its hard to win in the NFL consistently either by 1 point or 30

What is it with the koolaid drinkers of any team that makes them so unable to accept the observation that their team isn't perfect? No team is, after all.

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

What is it with the koolaid drinkers of any team that makes them so unable to accept the observation that their team isn't perfect? No team is, after all.

Finally a person (as quoted) who understands of how important winning is in the NFL - NOT dominating opponents - Belichick could give a crap of how much his team blows away opponents - He wants TO WIN,nothing more,nothing less.

If Brady throws 2 interceptions per game for the rest of the year and Randy Moss has only 45 or less yards per game and we still win then thats all that matters,Anything expected beyond that shows how immature and ungrateful a fan is.

I compare threads like these to a 16 year old rich kid who cries because his father bought him a brand new Lexus instead of a Lamborghini

 

[aluminum seats]

I don't think your opinion means much to me as a matter of fact its garbage, but thanks anyway

The nature of this thread is if we don't humiliate every opponent something is wrong and its going to be that way since fans are used to those 20 point wins - Grow up,Its the NFL,Not little league or high school

The Patriots are NOT going to dominate every game in 2007 - Get it through your thick heads,Take wins for what they are,Very hard to win and even harder to keep it up week after week

I think if ANY head coach or player would hear this,his response would be the same...A win is a win,Ugly or not -its hard to win in the NFL consistently either by 1 point or 30

Yeah, this would be a great board if the only comments allowed were, "A win is a win." It's called discussion of the game, if you don't like go somewhere else.

Back to the main post, regarding Harrison: I think the team's staggering start has hidden his importance a little bit--and I do hope we don't need him as much as in the past. But for now, he is a HUGELY important player for this defense--that softness in the middle of the field we've seen on occasion this year seems to go away with Rodney laying on the hits.

 

[Oswlek]

Yeah, this would be a great board if the only comments allowed were, "A win is a win." It's called discussion of the game, if you don't like go somewhere else.

Back to the main post, regarding Harrison: I think the team's staggering start has hidden his importance a little bit--and I do hope we don't need him as much as in the past. But for now, he is a HUGELY important player for this defense--that softness in the middle of the field we've seen on occasion this year seems to go away with Rodney laying on the hits.

As long as Rodney stay's healthy, it will allow NE to use a "Big Nickle" type defense against teams like Dallas and Indy. I really do view him as a critical part of this season despite NE's success in his absence. I feel the same way about Seymour, BTW. I think that some here forget just how good Richard was in 2003, 2004 and down the stretch in 2005. If that Seymour returns then this D will go to a new level. I'm talking Ravens in 2000 level.

Oh, and I realize that the last time we heard about the "Big Nickle" was with Victor Green in 2002, but that team had a significantly worse DL and a worse secondary.

 

[Deus Irae]

Finally a person (as quoted) who understands of how important winning is in the NFL - NOT dominating opponents - Belichick could give a crap of how much his team blows away opponents - He wants TO WIN,nothing more,nothing less.

If Brady throws 2 interceptions per game for the rest of the year and Randy Moss has only 45 or less yards per game and we still win then thats all that matters,Anything expected beyond that shows how immature and ungrateful a fan is.

I think you misunderstood my post. I was defending Oswlek. No game is perfect, and no game should be free from being broken down by interested parties. Perhaps if you re-read his original post, you'll see that he wasn't just blindly complaining or anything of that sort.

 

[aluminum seats]

As long as Rodney stay's healthy, it will allow NE to use a "Big Nickle" type defense against teams like Dallas and Indy. I really do view him as a critical part of this season despite NE's success in his absence. I feel the same way about Seymour, BTW. I think that some here forget just how good Richard was in 2003, 2004 and down the stretch in 2005. If that Seymour returns then this D will go to a new level. I'm talking Ravens in 2000 level.

Oh, and I realize that the last time we heard about the "Big Nickle" was with Victor Green in 2002, but that team had a significantly worse DL and a worse secondary.

Agreed on Seymour as well--for the additional reason of the enormous boost that gives the depth/rotation of the D-line, and the entire defense. To date, this has not been the best Pats' defense I've seen in the past few years. But continued (knock wood) health, along with the additions of Harrison and Seymour, would make this D one for the ages, sez me.

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

I think you misunderstood my post. I was defending Oswlek. No game is perfect, and no game should be free from being broken down by interested parties. Perhaps if you re-read his original post, you'll see that he wasn't just blindly complaining or anything of that sort.

Its not just Oswlek but you can almost feel in this forum that some fans are not happy because we are not totally dominating the game or putting it away by early 3rd quarter - That is really my point here

The team definately does not have to prove that its good or dominating to the media - All that counts is the final second ticking off and a 'W' on the scoreboard.

 

[Deus Irae]

Its not just Oswlek but you can almost feel in this forum that some fans are not happy because we are not winning the game or putting it away by early 3rd quarter - That is really my point here

People were making this same sort of comment yesterday, but I think you're wrong. People are going to be comparing this team to the all-time great teams, as well as the current Colts and Cowboys teams. The bar has been raised, as it should be. When the fans see what happened yesterday, with kickoffs going out of bounds, punts averaging only 35.8 yards, miscommunications, blown assignments, needless and thoughtless penalties, and the like, they are rightfully concerned. This game wasn't even 'put away' until Gay returned that fumble with less than a minute left in the game.

Belichick was just on WEEI, and he made it quite clear that the team did not play very well. I don't see why fans pointing out the same thing is a problem.

 

[Oswlek]

People were making this same sort of comment yesterday, but I think you're wrong. People are going to be comparing this team to the all-time great teams, as well as the current Colts and Cowboys teams. The bar has been raised, as it should be. When the fans see what happened yesterday, with kickoffs going out of bounds, punts averaging only 35.8 yards, miscommunications, blown assignments, needless and thoughtless penalties, and the like, they are rightfully concerned. This game wasn't even 'put away' until Gay returned that fumble with less than a minute left in the game.

Belichick was just on WEEI, and he made it quite clear that the team did not play very well. I don't see why fans pointing out the same thing is a problem.

Thanks for the backup. :rocker:

I will say that BB showing concern doesn't necessarily mean much. It is a coaches job to find fault even in a dominant effort. That said, this was far from a dominant effort and many of the failings were obvious to the naked eye. I love the Pats, but I call 'em like I see 'em.

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

People were making this same sort of comment yesterday, but I think you're wrong. People are going to be comparing this team to the all-time great teams, as well as the current Colts and Cowboys teams. The bar has been raised, as it should be. When the fans see what happened yesterday, with kickoffs going out of bounds, punts averaging only 35.8 yards, miscommunications, blown assignments, needless and thoughtless penalties, and the like, they are rightfully concerned. This game wasn't even 'put away' until Gay returned that fumble with less than a minute left in the game.

Belichick was just on WEEI, and he made it quite clear that the team did not play very well. I don't see why fans pointing out the same thing is a problem.

I will be the first to say it was not a pretty game,but 2 things stand out to me....

a) We are not going to play shabby on a regular basis and this was the rare game you will probably not see very often,Expect a few crappy games along the way and probably even a loss as well

b) It was a win,Ill take it

You can best be sure the team will have its 'A' game when playing Indy and Dallas,This team has done so much from the draft & FA to putting up with scrutiny that you must expect their very best especially those 2 games which we are going to need every bit to stay competitive in those games,Whether its good enough to win those 2 particular games,we will see,I think an A- or even a B+ game is good enough to win the other games left on the schedule in 2007.....

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

When was the last time BB did not find fault in his team's performance?

Whose team are you a fan of?

Last time I looked,BB is NEVER totally happy about ANY game and dissapointed in one thing or another,Even in those 38-14 wins and in games years past.

You can't act ****y and say your team has played perfect or you will get your foot shoved in your mouth.

 

[Patriot_in_NY]

I wll say this. Credit Romeo a little too. Cleveland is not the Doormat they once were. There is talent there. Also, he had a great gameplan. Take out Moss (which they did), take out Welker (which they did) and make them win with running and our other receivers.

I'm concerned that it seemed to take us a little while to recognize this and get into a mode where we didn't make them pay more dearly for that. I think that once we went to Watson and Stallworth (outside a few of his drops) we had some success. It was just inconsistant.

In the end, I think it's a good thing because moving forward that will be alot of our opponant's plan. We need to learn how to seemlessly adjust to the open guys (which will usually be Stallworth/Gaffney and Watson.

We didn't play the greatest, but give credit its due, Romeo and the Browns made us struggle a bit. We'll need to change that. Our offense needs to be able to impose it's will against all comers.

 

[Oswlek]

I wll say this. Credit Romeo a little too. Cleveland is not the Doormat they once were. There is talent there. Also, he had a great gameplan. Take out Moss (which they did), take out Welker (which they did) and make them win with running and our other receivers.

I'm concerned that it seemed to take us a little while to recognize this and get into a mode where we didn't make them pay more dearly for that. I think that once we went to Watson and Stallworth (outside a few of his drops) we had some success. It was just inconsistant.

In the end, I think it's a good thing because moving forward that will be alot of our opponant's plan. We need to learn how to seemlessly adjust to the open guys (which will usually be Stallworth/Gaffney and Watson.

We didn't play the greatest, but give credit its due, Romeo and the Browns made us struggle a bit. We'll need to change that. Our offense needs to be able to impose it's will against all comers.

The reason for my criticism is that it did *not* take NE long to diagnose what was happening. They knew what was happening, got the matchups they wanted and then just screwed up. Of course the other team deserves credit for taking Moss and Welker out, but Stallworth catches the pass and it is 27-0. Also as I said, Brady completely missed on three balls that all would have given first downs in the 3rd quarter.

It wasn't a case of confusion, it was a case of making a mistake.

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

The reason for my criticism is that it did *not* take NE long to diagnose what was happening. They knew what was happening, got the matchups they wanted and then just screwed up. Of course the other team deserves credit for taking Moss and Welker out, but Stallworth catches the pass and it is 27-0. Also as I said, Brady completely missed on three balls that all would have given first downs in the 3rd quarter.

It wasn't a case of confusion, it was a case of making a mistake.

Yes Brady is NOT god and he WILL make mistakes,Are you expecting perfection? - Not on this earth - Brady is great,Not perfect.

Brady will make more mistakes this year but hopefully they will not cost us a game but mistakes happen to the best players and things like his errors in throws on sunday will happen more than just once during a long grueling NFL season..

You didn't expect Brady to continue his 75% or more passing percentage completions throughout all season did you?

 

[Patriot_in_NY]

The reason for my criticism is that it did *not* take NE long to diagnose what was happening. They knew what was happening, got the matchups they wanted and then just screwed up. Of course the other team deserves credit for taking Moss and Welker out, but Stallworth catches the pass and it is 27-0. Also as I said, Brady completely missed on three balls that all would have given first downs in the 3rd quarter.

It wasn't a case of confusion, it was a case of making a mistake.

Well, perhaps I didn't state it well. They were going to Stall early enough, but Watson was pretty much a non-factor early and it seemed to take a while before they started going to him, and when they did it was immediatly feective.. Also, early Tom seemed to be looking Moss's way to much. Couple early catches, but we also tried to forced a few into really good coverage when other guys had a little more space. Tom was also not as Sharp.

Given the preoccupation of Moss and Welker, Watson was open all day practicaly. Even Stallworth had an okay time getting a little space. I tell you though, for a guy known for "great hands" he sure has had a few big drops in the last few games.

Anyway, that's just my overall impression (I didn't break film down or anything). They just seemed to struggle and not be in rythem when Moss and Welker were covered, at least for the most part. Perhaps it was just execution as you say. That certainly was the case in the 3rd.