Kraft Orchids Case - Prosecuters Want a Tug Rule?

[Hammer of Thor]

The patriots up until 2000 were.
The patriots under Bledsoe were mediocre.
Saying that Bledsoe (and parilli and grogan) is part of why this is the greatest franchise ever is not correct.
As I said before Brady took over it had been close to the worst.

After the 2000 season, what franchises were worse than the Pats through their histories?

The Cardinals - 1 legit championship and 1 illegitimate championship in 81 seasons and no Super Bowl appearances

The Bucs - mentioned already in this thread, they defined losers and laughingstocks until Dungy came along

The Saints - they were just plain bad

Everyone else is debatable. What isn’t really debatable is that the Patriots looked a lot like the Cincinnati Bengals at that point. 2 Super Bowl appearances, a few other playoff seasons, a stretch of some horrid teams, and a few in between. Anyone who thinks the Pats were continual respected contenders prior to BB/Brady should also feel the same way about the Bengals.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Large quantities of talent but never put the time in to excel....that was the case from day one.

With Drew I've always had this belief that his football IQ was middling and didn't have a deep passion for the game.

 

[Huckleberry1]

Yep

Enter Andy Johnson, thread over.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Tony Eason 28-21; 3-2 post season
Drew Bledsoe 63-60; 4-3 post season

Hope is in the eye of the beholder

Eason carried the 1986 team.

 

[Joker]

I was a season ticket holder in the 80's. I was and still am a big Grogan fan. I wanted to pick a fight with Champagne Tony with a passion but, as all the other guys in Section 206 would say, he'd only fall down and curl up in a ball...like he always did when he saw a pass rush.

and yes, I'm biased. Don't bother with stats or feel good stories.

 

[PP2]

Meh. I've been involved with philanthropy and wealthy people for a couple of decades now. I'm not impressed by wealthy people who donate money and make sure people know about it. It has no affect on their actual lives, and if it did in any meaningful way, many of them wouldn't do it. They get a lot of praise for it, which many of them seem to crave, because being wealthy is a challenge to one's self esteem.

The ones who are 1) quiet about it, and 2) thoughtful and strategic about it, I appreciate. Some of them are even likable.

What I am impressed with, and what help keeps my faith in humanity, is the social security widow who gives $10 every month to the local animal shelter, or food kitchen, or similar. Those people actually go without something simply because they know someone else has less or needs it more, and refuse to forget about it. That's impressive.

It's a lot more sinister than that. The very wealthy tend to donate to causes that support their own interests, motivations, or even businesses. They also donate to try and manage their public imagination as in the case of the Sackler family who knowingly manufactured the very addictive opoid that eventually came to be known as oxycotin. They became very wealthy as a result, and donated to museums, universities, and whatever else makes them seem like concerned citizens.

Or they're just brazen and don't care, like the Koch brothers. All donations from the Koch Brothers come with massive strings. You have to be behind their "less goverment is more" tea party philosophy (i.e., less regulation on their oil and coal fortune) to receive any money from them.

Good book to read if you have time:

Dark Money by Jane Mayer | PenguinRandomHouse.com: Books

 

[DaBronxPats14]

New Attorney added to defend RK.....

 

[Huckleberry1]

And despite what Andy Johnson says, Belichick is the one who took over the Patriots, not Brady. Brady is by far the greatest player of all time, but Belichick has been the actually running the franchise since 2000z

 

[RobertWeathers]

And despite what Andy Johnson says, Belichick is the one who took over the Patriots, not Brady. Brady is by far the greatest player of all time, but Belichick has been the actually running the franchise since 2000z

I'm surprised Andy has taken the position you state. He and I are some of the biggest BB fanboys on this board.

 

[BTTA]

Yeah, there's a lot of that. I do try to stay away from really dark material, or potential political triggers, on this forum. I need this to be a happy place if possible, a distraction from the challenges elsewhere.

Some of this is tied to the distinction between "rich" and "wealthy" in the US. What gets lost with all this focus on "the 1%" is the huge distinction between the top 5% of the 1% (the .0005ers) and the rest. Having millions, even hundreds of millions, stashed away provides a lot of security. But it isn't real power if you get it from someone else paying you (like being a CEO, which is just a job) or from a series of singular transactions (like real estate). Serious power lies in owning parts of core industries, like energy (i.e. Kochs).

"Income inequality" is just one issue tearing at the fabric of democracy; the bigger issue is "equity inequality."

But when 90% make less than $35,000, and have less than $1,000 in savings, that distinction can seem trivial.

It's a lot more sinister than that. The very wealthy tend to donate to causes that support their own interests, motivations, or even businesses. They also donate to try and manage their public imagination as in the case of the Sackler family who knowingly manufactured the very addictive opoid that eventually came to be known as oxycotin. They became very wealthy as a result, and donated to museums, universities, and whatever else may make then seem like concerned citizens.

Or they're just brazen and don't care, like the Koch brothers. All donations from the Koch Brothers come with massive strings. You have to be behind their "less goverment is more" tea party philosophy (i.e., less regulation on their oil and coal fortune) to receive any money from them.

Good book to read if you have time:

Dark Money by Jane Mayer | PenguinRandomHouse.com: Books

 

[BTTA]

I literally LOL’d.

Probably only because you don't live down there, PJ.
You don't, right?

 

[Brewskies]

Kraft hired two of the best lawyers in the country to beat the rap because he fears the NFL penalties if he is found guilty. They are looking to throw out the videotape and questioning the legality of the search warrant also saying without voice recordings how Does anyone know what Kraft asked for. Kraft will "get off" in my opinion.

 

[QuantumMechanic]

With Drew I've always had this belief that his football IQ was middling and didn't have a deep passion for the game.

His FB IQ was middling and/or his brain just didn't process things on the field fast enough.

Put him on a 1970s Al Davis team when there was no free agency and you could collect and hold onto burner WRs and good OLmen and he'd have been a hall of famer, though.

 

[PatriotsReign]

Yeah, there's a lot of that. I do try to stay away from really dark material, or potential political triggers, on this forum. I need this to be a happy place if possible, a distraction from the challenges elsewhere.

Some of this is tied to the distinction between "rich" and "wealthy" in the US. What gets lost with all this focus on "the 1%" is the huge distinction between the top 5% of the 1% (the .0005ers) and the rest. Having millions, even hundreds of millions, stashed away provides a lot of security. But it isn't real power if you get it from someone else paying you (like being a CEO, which is just a job) or from a series of singular transactions (like real estate). Serious power lies in owning parts of core industries, like energy (i.e. Kochs).

"Income inequality" is just one issue tearing at the fabric of democracy; the bigger issue is "equity inequality."

But when 90% make less than $35,000, and have less than $1,000 in savings, that distinction can seem trivial.

The median US HH income is somewhere around $60K, so 90% of Americans can’t make under $35k. Unless that was a hypothetical you’re presenting. Today’s poverty line is around $30k per household

 

[RobertWeathers]

His FB IQ was middling and/or his brain just didn't process things on the field fast enough.

Put him on a 1970s Al Davis team when there was no free agency and you could collect and hold onto burner WRs and good OLmen and he'd have been a hall of famer, though.

Yep. Drew needed exceptional talent around him to excel. In Coates, CMart, Glenn,, Gash, Byers, Jeff and even Troy he had it.

 

[Ring 6]

I'm surprised Andy has taken the position you state. He and I are some of the biggest BB fanboys on this board.

Andy hasn’t.
The discussion was about QBs and credited parilli grogan Bledsoe and brady with turning the patriots into the best franchise ever.
I pointed out the first 3 didnt have anything to do with being the best franchise ever.

 

[Ring 6]

And despite what Andy Johnson says, Belichick is the one who took over the Patriots, not Brady. Brady is by far the greatest player of all time, but Belichick has been the actually running the franchise since 2000z

The discussion was about the QBs who get credit.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Andy hasn’t.
The discussion was about QBs and credited parilli grogan Bledsoe and brady with turning the patriots into the best franchise ever.
I pointed out the first 3 didnt have anything to do with being the best franchise ever.

Agree. Brady certainly had a major role.

 

[QuantumMechanic]

The median US HH income is somewhere around $60K, so 90% of Americans can’t make under $35k. Unless that was a hypothetical you’re presenting. Today’s poverty line is around $30k.

Here's the poverty line numbers. Left number is household size.

1   $12,490
2   $16,910
3   $21,330
4   $25,750
5   $30,170
6   $34,590
7   $39,010
8   $43,430

2019 Poverty Guidelines
So poverty line isn't $30K until you get to a family of 5. And it's not $35K until you get to 6.
And as you say, if the median HH income is $60K that means by definition 50% of households make more than $60K and 50% make less.

 

[Ring 6]

Agree. Brady certainly had a major role.

Well the point was thr discussion was from a QBs persepective and from that perspective Brady is the sole, singular, only QB making this the best franchise ever.