A Reality Belichick

[MainePatsFan26]

Many of you laughed at my Brady thread and, in retrospect, much of that was deserved. Who knows and honestly who cares.

Anyway, when it comes to analyzing the Patriots, it is easy to look at the Brady situation and wonder when his sharp decline -- and ensuing Patriots decline -- will occur. What never gets brought up in these discussions is when Bill Belichick's decline will occur. We're talking about a 65 year old man who will inevitably lose a mental step at some point (or has been slowly without us noticing). He is the greatest coach of all time, but even the GOAT (coach, player, mascot) will reach a point of decline where the next guy up can do a slightly better job.

The point of this thread, in light of the ESPN nonsense, is to consider whether we are nearing the point where we're better off with a Patricia or McDaniels as head coach rather than sticking with Belichick. It's been taken for granted that Brady will be gone before Belichick, but could Belichick leaving before Brady be a legitimate course of action rather than our greatest fear realized?

 

[Patriot Missile]

This is fringing on the practice squad.

 

[MassPats38]

Every coordinator to leave for a head coaching vacancy has produced substantially less than Belichick, and none has won a Super Bowl. He has won 5, and won last year so his accomplishments are not ancient history.

If you want a serious answer to this question rather than deserved scorn, with that in mind, by what rational basis can you advance that "we're better off with a Patricia or McDaniels as head coach rather than sticking with Belichick"?

Frankly, I cannot think of a single reason to dump likely the greatest coach of this or any time for an apprentice, other than the absurd change for change sake. The losing a mental step at 65 is not a thing if the individual is 20 steps ahead of the field, and I see no evidence that he is diminished at all (there is no particular age that might happen, as an FYI).

 

[StockingAnarchyNumber12]

get a grip!

 

[patman12]

When BB starts to slip with his quick retorts during pressers, I’ll start to worry. Until then, it’s all good.

 

[Nikolai]

I watched the end of SB49 and SB51 and then the video of Falcons fans reacting to 28-3. It made me feel warm inside.

 

[Soliel]

I watched the end of SB49 and SB51 and then the video of Falcons fans reacting to 28-3. It made me feel warm inside.

This is s great idea, I’m gonna go look, all this ESPN crap makes me feel like I’m taking crazy pills.

 

[TheBostonStraggler]

Many of you laughed at my Brady thread and, in retrospect, much of that was deserved. Who knows and honestly who cares.

Anyway, when it comes to analyzing the Patriots, it is easy to look at the Brady situation and wonder when his sharp decline -- and ensuing Patriots decline -- will occur. What never gets brought up in these discussions is when Bill Belichick's decline will occur. We're talking about a 65 year old man who will inevitably lose a mental step at some point (or has been slowly without us noticing). He is the greatest coach of all time, but even the GOAT (coach, player, mascot) will reach a point of decline where the next guy up can do a slightly better job.

The point of this thread, in light of the ESPN nonsense, is to consider whether we are nearing the point where we're better off with a Patricia or McDaniels as head coach rather than sticking with Belichick. It's been taken for granted that Brady will be gone before Belichick, but could Belichick leaving before Brady be a legitimate course of action rather than our greatest fear realized?

Maine,
"nearing the point we're better off" is often/frequently enough self evident. The Patriots earned a bye in 2017 and likely will, at minimum, reach the AFCCG. Sure, maybe we could have gone 19-0 with MP or JM -- who knows for sure -- but that is reckless thinking IMHO. Changing that which is still producing good results is needlessly risking what is a rare and precious commodity in the NFL, good results. Something better is always possible unless you go 19-0, however, the difficulty in repeatedly achieving 11-5, 12-4, 13-3 is something you don't F with because 'something better maybe out there'.

Again specific to the word "maybe" we are better off? IMHO, that kind of thinking gets a team in trouble more often than not. Right now we know that BB often finds a way to rectify problems on the team (for example the D early season) to a sufficient degree even with some misses in decisions. Right now we know with Brady behind center we almost always will score mid 20s to 30s and can put together that last minute winning drive despite laying an egg or two as well as have a bad quarter or two. Would Jimmy behind center right now mean 40 per game nearly every time? Maybe but you don't change good results on the hope of "maybe".

This whole thing is ridiculous IMHO. Shocking and Surprising News! the days of BB and TB are coming to an end. Wow, I'm stunned. Sure, both men in their respective positions are reaching the proverbial manufacturer's EOS (end of service) but I thought they would live forever! . Time can be delayed by some but time will stand still for none. TB respective to his position historically is on a year to year EOS. Maybe the old TBird will keep humming for a few years -- but it'll be a year to year results thing. His results this season speak for themselves. BB respective to his profession is at or within a couple years of EOS where then it will be year to year from there. Again results will guide the thinking.
As to who reaches the EOS finish line first? Who knows but results and/or circumstance will likely make the determination a forgone conclusion. If BB and TB together can keep churning out 11 or more wins a season then the band will stay together for yet another tour.

Look I have no idea what definitely went on behind closed doors and whether BB was trying absolutely everything to hold onto Jimmy through 2017 and keep him there as Brady's instant replacement once he is EOS. But is this not what a good HC would try to do with a player near EOS? But to me it is absurd to think a 13-3 team that is tantalizingly close to a historical 6 SB would change away from Brady. There was no way BB was contemplating changing away from TB for a QB who has 1 completed career game (a QB who was injured in his second start and then apparently was injured again and missed part of the offseason due to it). No matter how good BB thought Jimmy was there is no way he would believe a QB with virtually no game experience would provide the better chance at winning the SB.
I believe BB thought Jimmy was top tier cheap backup for this year (in case the old TBird got a flat) and BB was hoping to keep him around longer for when Brady was showing he was at EOS (again why is that a bad thing for HC to contemplate?). Ultimately it didn't work out with the timing -- welcome to the uncertainty of football -- and the decision IMHO was easy, it was TV. So now BB can use one of his first or one of 2 second round draft picks to get a QB, let him study under Brady in 2018, maybe 2019 or whatever, and then the kid takes over. Anyone believe TB's drop off will be so bad he won't still be able to be better than most QBs? And if he gets a flat that is why you have a Brian Hoyer to fill in gaps. Exactly why is this so unthinkable by most? Is it because Jimmy was so certain to be the next Tom Brady? LOL, anyone, ANYONE, who sits here and says Jimmy is a sure thing hasn't been watching football and especially QBs. The 2000-2017 highway is littered with the wrecks of QBs who looked lights out year 1 or 2 or even 3.

 

[luuked]

Many of you laughed at my Brady thread and, in retrospect, much of that was deserved. Who knows and honestly who cares.

Anyway, when it comes to analyzing the Patriots, it is easy to look at the Brady situation and wonder when his sharp decline -- and ensuing Patriots decline -- will occur. What never gets brought up in these discussions is when Bill Belichick's decline will occur. We're talking about a 65 year old man who will inevitably lose a mental step at some point (or has been slowly without us noticing). He is the greatest coach of all time, but even the GOAT (coach, player, mascot) will reach a point of decline where the next guy up can do a slightly better job.

The point of this thread, in light of the ESPN nonsense, is to consider whether we are nearing the point where we're better off with a Patricia or McDaniels as head coach rather than sticking with Belichick. It's been taken for granted that Brady will be gone before Belichick, but could Belichick leaving before Brady be a legitimate course of action rather than our greatest fear realized?

Given the Brady thread and this one here.. are you sure your mental decline has not started a while ago ? Because, you have lost more than step..

 

[pheenix11]

This thread takes the cake. And that’s saying a lot, especially lately.

 

[Tunescribe]

We're talking about a 65 year old man who will inevitably lose a mental step at some point (or has been slowly without us noticing).

WTF are you basing this on? Some of the sharpest people on this planet are in their eighties. Not that BB would want to stick around that long, but your assumption is ludicrous.

 

[TomPatriot]

WTF are you basing this on? Some of the sharpest people on this planet are in their eighties. Not that BB would want to stick around that long, but your assumption is ludicrous.

Ageism.

 

[italian pat patriot]

What never gets brought up in these discussions is when Bill Belichick's decline will occur. We're talking about a 65 year old man who will inevitably lose a mental step at some point (or has been slowly without us noticing).

probably i am too far away from Usa but from Italy i have not seen at all any BB decline, at least for the moment and i hope it will continue for a long time

 

[MainePatsFan26]

get a grip!

I never said I believe Belichick is on the decline. In fact, he is as sharp as ever. I posted this to see if people believe he may need to go before Brady. There aren't many effective 70 year old coaches across NFL history. Better to go out with a bang then to fade away and all that cliche crap.

 

[MainePatsFan26]

This thread takes the cake. And that’s saying a lot, especially lately.

Hey man, I appreciate the feedback. I've been working on my logical gymnastics lately and think this thread is the result of my own variety of microneurocratic analytics finally paying dividends.

 

[DarrylS]

What never gets brought up in these discussions is when Bill Belichick's decline will occur. We're talking about a 65 year old man who will inevitably lose a mental step at some point (or has been slowly without us noticing). He is the greatest coach of all time, but even the GOAT (coach, player, mascot) will reach a point of decline where the next guy up can do a slightly better job.

How old are you?? I am 70 years old and most of the folks I hang with are older than 65, not one has shown any semblance of mental decline.. there are physical limits, but mentally they are all as sharp as ever...

I know this is anecdotal, but in this world working after 65 is not unheard of and many prestigious jobs in the public and private sector are held by older people.. in the last Presidential election the two main candidates were 70+ and the next contender was 76.

BB will know when to walk away and he will do it on his own terms..

 

[FrodoBagginz]

 

[Simpelton]

I think I'll worry about that man's mind when that man stops being able to achieve 13-3 with a front 7 literally built off the scrap heap.

While the Patriots are still radically outproducing their own on-paper capabilities is an odd time to be talking about the performance of their head coach in any terms other than absolute reverence.

I actually rate it far more likely that Bill loses a physical step and has to step fulltime into a GMing role, turning the day to day coaching over to a former coordinator, than that he loses a mental step and the game passes him by. Right now he's spent a 20 year career leaving most of the league behind, you'll know the league is catching up to him when he's no longer head and shoulders above everyone else. Until that happens, I'm not even gonna worry.

 

[MainePatsFan26]

How old are you?? I am 70 years old and most of the folks I hang with are older than 65, not one has shown any semblance of mental decline.. there are physical limits, but mentally they are all as sharp as ever...

I know this is anecdotal, but in this world working after 65 is not unheard of and many prestigious jobs in the public and private sector are held by older people.. in the last Presidential election the two main candidates were 70+ and the next contender was 76.

BB will know when to walk away and he will do it on his own terms..

The point is that the Patriots need to do what makes their football team have the greatest opportunity to succeed. That doesn't necessarily mean letting Bill walk away whenever he feels like it. I hope he gets to head out on his own terms, but that's often not the nature of the NFL from a business point of view.

And speaking of old candidates... we all know how that worked out. Perhaps a little fresh blood from both parties at the next political jamboree.

 

[MainePatsFan26]

I think I'll worry about that man's mind when that man stops being able to achieve 13-3 with a front 7 literally built off the scrap heap.

While the Patriots are still radically outproducing their own on-paper capabilities is an odd time to be talking about the performance of their head coach in any terms other than absolute reverence.

I actually rate it far more likely that Bill loses a physical step and has to step fulltime into a GMing role, turning the day to day coaching over to a former coordinator, than that he loses a mental step and the game passes him by. Right now he's spent a 20 year career leaving most of the league behind, you'll know the league is catching up to him when he's no longer head and shoulders above everyone else. Until that happens, I'm not even gonna worry.

I have absolute reverence. The point of the thread was to ask whether we might want to consider Belichick leaving/being forced out before Brady. It is taken for granted that Brady will be the first one to leave/retire, but I wanted to switch things up by considering things from this opposite perspective.

Alas, I must have made another whoopsie by asking the wrong type of question.