Patriots Pass Rush Should Upgrade With Collins, Buchanan

[pdangle]

Collins is about to not only breakout but redefine the 21st century NFL linebacker position over the next 2 seasons. The guy is freaky good. Right now. And still totally raw. A BB dream player. He's been looking for this type of player for 5 years.

 

[1960Pats]

I like Buchanan, but would agree we need more than promise if he doesn't make the leap. Also, if Bequette doesn't either play or get cut, I want a Congressional investigation.

You'd be better off using the Keystone Cops than Congress.

It seems like Bellichick gets very patient with some players and not so much with others. I wonder what the criteria is that decides that for him.

 

[pdangle]

He showed promise, but his biggest problem was pushing way too far upfield (particularly against mobile QB's which also indicates poor situational awareness). That will work against an immobile statue like Peyton and Flacco. Not so much against the Geno Smith's of the world, I.E. - when it was Buchanon's direct fault that Smith made that first down run on third and long in the second Jets game. If he fixes that area of his game, bulks up a bit, and learns a few moves (such as the swim) along the way, he could be a very nice asset to have in a DE rotation.

He did fix it IMO. This was mostly early season over exuberance and inexperience. Completely different player 2nd half. I hope he's a naturally smart football player, if so the skies the limit. I saw BB telling him to go to a spot, and just sick boy sick'em. Letting him read and react within his coverage area while not overwhelming the kid. And he was learning too. He Didn't repeat mistakes and was given more complex responsibility. Like the INT he grabbed by dropping into deep zone coverage as LB surprising the QB with the speed and deception getting there, then squeezing the QBs last remaining hope of success using what must have seemed like a 6 foot vertical to snag the ball. Like wtf, what was he even doing there? Who cares. More to come. Hes my "most excited to watch" player for 2014/15 now that I just invented the award. I saw these glimpses (mostly at end of last season) from like no LB I've seen in NE like... ever. If you're bored, go back. Watch what BB had him doing the last few games. NE has never seen anything like it from his position! Next up, public viewings for the rest of the NFL!

 

[pencilneckgeek]

Like MGT implied, Collins can only fill one role at a time. Right now, he projects to Sam in the base and playing alongside Mayo in the nickel. If Mayo is the dime backer, Collins could rotate in as an end, but I'm not sure that's the relief that Nink and Jones need, because we're not about to pull our best to pass rushers out in the dime. With our current roster, Jones might not rotate into a Nascar DT slot as much, when we have Armstead, Chris Jones, Vince, and Kelly as solid choices for DT in those situations.

If Buchanan makes the 2nd year leap, there will be some help there, but another capable player is needed, sooner than last year's week 10 addition of Andre Carter.

I'm interested in seeing whether Hightower gets some time at DE. He had a lot asked of him last year with Mayo's injury, but I'm not sure that the role he was in played into his strengths. He's big enough to hold-up at the end of the line, and with him likely being the odd man out in the nickel, I could see him getting a look as a rotational player. It will be fun to see how Bill makes use of HT and Collins.

 

[Brady6]

Definitely agree- as the saying goes, hope is not a plan. If he uses the offseason to put on some weight, refine his pass rushing moves, and become more disciplined about over pursuing and opening up lanes, I do have high hopes for Buchanan. But it would definitely be a mistake to assume that he'll get there

According to Reiss Jones, Buchanan, and Thompkins are extremely close and are all training together this offseason. This is good news in my opinion because Jones is as hard a trainer as there is in the NFL and has added significant weight over the past two seasons. I hear they are doing a lot of MMA training, which I am sure Jones has a lot of knowledge of due to his big brother.

My overall opinion of Michael Buchanan is that he is going to be one of the real surprises of the 2014 season, I see something very special in him and think he could even push Ninkovich for reps in early down situation. I have him down for 5-7 sacks in 2014 and I actually think it could be more. He was an early round talent; he was involved in some type of physical altercation and lost about 30lbs because his mouth wired shut. He did not have a good senior season and that dropped his stock, back in 2012, there were rumors of him entering the draft and they had him projected to go in round one or two.

If you look at his talent level it is special, he is a Michael Johnson type prospect. Needless to say he is one of my favorite Patriots, I might be overhyping him but I really am high on him.

 

[Brady6]

Like MGT implied, Collins can only fill one role at a time. Right now, he projects to Sam in the base and playing alongside Mayo in the nickel. If Mayo is the dime backer, Collins could rotate in as an end, but I'm not sure that's the relief that Nink and Jones need, because we're not about to pull our best to pass rushers out in the dime. With our current roster, Jones might not rotate into a Nascar DT slot as much, when we have Armstead, Chris Jones, Vince, and Kelly as solid choices for DT in those situations.

I think the key is to get Collins and Jones coming off the same side of the field, or in a sub packages bring Jones, Buchanan, and Collins all off the same side of the field, which would be a very difficult group to contain.

LDE – Ninkovich
LDT – Armstead
RDT – Jones
RDE – Buchanan
WLB/SLB – Collins
MLB – Mayo

 

[Dingleberry]

Could be the perfect storm: The young guys up front combined with what I really think/hope will upgrade the pass rush--Revis and Browner.

 

[LasVegasPatsFan]

I think Ras-I Dowling did this year and then was cut like a week later

Thats because he had a handicap sticker

 

[Ring 6]

If Collins gets penciled in at DE, then I would think that LB would jump up to nearly the top for position needs. That's already a thin group even with Collins.

There is exactly zero chance of Collins playing de

 

[goheels22002]

I like Buchanan, but would agree we need more than promise if he doesn't make the leap. Also, if Bequette doesn't either play or get cut, I want a Congressional investigation.

There's very little out there on Bequette after his draft reports and rookie profiles, unless I'm missing something obvious.

Bequette has played in 8 games of 36 since being drafted, while Nink and Jones have taken 98% of the snaps.

Does anybody know why Bequette hasn't been eased in? He added weight and strength from his draft weight, and always had the quickness to play in the NFL. Any insights?

 

[patchick]

He did fix it IMO. This was mostly early season over exuberance and inexperience. Completely different player 2nd half. ...

FYI, I think the post you're responding to was about Buchanan, while you're talking about Collins.

 

[50-yard-line]

Thats because he had a handicap sticker

As someone who was rooting for Ras-I to succeed here, and excited when I heard he got the parking spot...well, that was still hilarious.

 

[strngplyr]

There is exactly zero chance of Collins playing de

Apparently blowing up change of pace running backs to get after the QB makes you a DE.

Also makes WAY too much sense to put the best coverage LB (as it appears) on the line with his hand in the dirt where he never has to cover anyone.

I'm totally down for this idea.

 

[BradyFTW!]

There is exactly zero chance of Collins playing de

I agree, just pointing out the ramifications of that hypothetical. I expect to see him rush the QB as a LB sometimes, any maybe take some occasional snaps at DE as a change of pace to try to confuse people (Hightower too), but those should both be the exception, not the norm.

 

[BradyFTW!]

There's very little out there on Bequette after his draft reports and rookie profiles, unless I'm missing something obvious.



Bequette has played in 8 games of 36 since being drafted, while Nink and Jones have taken 98% of the snaps.



Does anybody know why Bequette hasn't been eased in? He added weight and strength from his draft weight, and always had the quickness to play in the NFL. Any insights?

If he was playing well enough to earn a spot in the rotation, he would have one. But Buchanan and Andre carter both beat him out for a job, which is not a good sign for his career prospects.

 

[BradyFTW!]

According to Reiss Jones, Buchanan, and Thompkins are extremely close and are all training together this offseason. This is good news in my opinion because Jones is as hard a trainer as there is in the NFL and has added significant weight over the past two seasons. I hear they are doing a lot of MMA training, which I am sure Jones has a lot of knowledge of due to his big brother.



My overall opinion of Michael Buchanan is that he is going to be one of the real surprises of the 2014 season, I see something very special in him and think he could even push Ninkovich for reps in early down situation. I have him down for 5-7 sacks in 2014 and I actually think it could be more. He was an early round talent; he was involved in some type of physical altercation and lost about 30lbs because his mouth wired shut. He did not have a good senior season and that dropped his stock, back in 2012, there were rumors of him entering the draft and they had him projected to go in round one or two.



If you look at his talent level it is special, he is a Michael Johnson type prospect. Needless to say he is one of my favorite Patriots, I might be overhyping him but I really am high on him.

Last year the consensus on this board was that Buchanan was a Dennard-type pick, for the reasons that you mentioned: an upper-tier talent who fell due to both poor late-season/combine/pro day performance and some unusual red flags. I agree with the philosophy of seeking out guys like this when your team is already good, since a flyer on a guy who has the talent to make the team is better than drafting a 7th round talent.

The sense that I got from Buchanan is that in college he was overly reliant on pure athleticism, which translated to the preseason when he was dominant against future insurance salesmen. Once the regular season started, it was clear that he had the athleticism to stick, but his game wasn't refined enough yet.

Training with Jones is definitely good news, because Jones is exactly the lead that he needs to follow re: putting on weight and expanding his pass rushing repertoire (Jones still needs work on the latter, and I'm sure he's working in it). Jones went into his rookie year a little undersized because he went into the draft not knowing if he would be picked as a DE or LB. He put in the weight last offseason, and it showed in his overall game.

There's also some precedent for MMA training, particular jiu jitsu, helping pass rushers. Tamba Hali credits it for a lot of his improvement in that area. Jones spent time last offseason training with his brother, could only help Buchanan if he's with them this offseason.

This is also just speculation, but I think it's been shown that the Jones brothers have pretty crazy work ethics. Art went from late round pick to a premier free agent by dramatically improving every season, and that only happens if you put in the work in the offseason. Jon became the UFC light heavyweight champ only a handful of years after picking up the sport. Same thing. I really like the idea of Buchanan benefitting from that by training extensively with Chandler.

 

[Brady_to_Moss]

I know everyone is excited to see Revis play next year....

I am most looking forward to seeing Collins. Really excited about his potential.

 

[pctronics0072]

I think this is one of the only years where I have been more excited to see the pat's defense play than the offense. I reserve the right to change that opinion depending on who we get at TE.

 

[JMC00]

Just saying it wouldn't surprise me if Pats got 15 sacks out of their LB corp next season.

 

[Ring 6]

I agree, just pointing out the ramifications of that hypothetical. I expect to see him rush the QB as a LB sometimes, any maybe take some occasional snaps at DE as a change of pace to try to confuse people (Hightower too), but those should both be the exception, not the norm.

I do expect to see him blitz a good amount of times.