2014 Draft Prospect Thread

[manxman2601]

I think in college you're exactly right. I think Shazier for a fit in regards only to the Patriots would need to be more of a coverage LB who can when called upon attack the LOS and blitz. You're suggesting Shazier be allowed to be Ray Lewis or Junior Seau in his SD glory days. I just don't see that as Bill's direction. I can see him playing the role you're advocating with other teams.

Tripp I agree he would play an Urlacher role with how I see the Patriot's defense moving, or hope it's moving.

My problem is that Mayo probably cancels Tripp out in that role and I'm still yet to be convinced that there is a sea change in what BB plans for the defense. There might be, I just don't think that Shazier/Woodyard necessarily represents it. I see Shazier or Woodyard taking on an Adrian Wilson type role. If you think about playing a 4-2-5, you could put Mayo and Collins in at LB, have your two outside corners and then McCourty and Harmon at safety (or Jimmie Ward ) with Shazier or Woodyard playing the role of an in the box safety that can cover a TE or big slot guy deep.

 

[everlong]

My problem is that Mayo probably cancels Tripp out in that role and I'm still yet to be convinced that there is a sea change in what BB plans for the defense. There might be, I just don't think that Shazier/Woodyard necessarily represents it. I see Shazier or Woodyard taking on an Adrian Wilson type role. If you think about playing a 4-2-5, you could put Mayo and Collins in at LB, have your two outside corners and then McCourty and Harmon at safety (or Jimmie Ward ) with Shazier or Woodyard playing the role of an in the box safety that can cover a TE or big slot guy deep.

That's actually closer to what I think Bill will do but that's more the way I was projecting Shazier than him attacking the LOS. I think it's a bonus that he can do it but I see it more on a Rodney Harrison frequency than a Ray Lewis. (LOL @ sneaking in some love for Ward )

 

[sircole]

Personally I like Tripp over Jones and Shazier because:

1.He already has the football production and versatility (came to Montana as safety/hybrid)
2. Believe he has the acumen to understand and explain to teammates whatever exotic football scheme BB could draw up with a new style hybrid defense.
3. Still growing physically and already possess borderline elite athletic abilities.
4. Frees up our first round pick since he could be available later in this draft.

I think Jones/Tripp is definitely splitting hairs in their current abilities (I just see a higher development trajectory for Tripp) and Shazier is a physical freak who might just need to be in a film room with a defensive genius.

Maybe a moot point if Wesley Woodyard signs with us.

 

[mayoclinic]

Personally I like Tripp over Jones and Shazier because:

1.He already has the football production and versatility (came to Montana as safety/hybrid)
2. Believe he has the acumen to understand and explain to teammates whatever exotic football scheme BB could draw up with a new style hybrid defense.
3. Still growing physically and already possess borderline elite athletic abilities.
4. Frees up our first round pick since he could be available later in this draft.

I think Jones/Tripp is definitely splitting hairs in their current abilities (I just see a higher development trajectory for Tripp) and Shazier is a physical freak who might just need to be in a film room with a defensive genius.

Maybe a moot point if Wesley Woodyard signs with us.

Nice summary. Personally, I'd love to get one of Tripp/Jones regardless of whether we sign Woodyard.

 

[manxman2601]

Following on from the discussion about speed linebackers, it's interesting to note that Dekoda Watson who signed with the Jags said that the Pats were one of the teams that expressed an interest in him. His pre-draft measurables were 6-3, 226. 4.40 forty, 6.78 3-cone.

Now I don't know what type of player he is but it's some further evidence that BB is looking to add a smaller and very fast linebacker to this team.

 

[Merril Hoge's Tie Knot]

Not drafting a projection in the first round thins it out pretty thoroughly. Every QB would come off the first round board, as would Greg Robinson and Anthony Barr. Ziggy wouldn't have been a first rounder last year and neither would Dontari Poe two years ago. I'd also question Nate Solder under those rules.

Not getting at you, just pointing out that people draft projections in the first round all the time.

Every player is a projection

 

[patchick]

Following on from the discussion about speed linebackers, it's interesting to note that Dekoda Watson who signed with the Jags said that the Pats were one of the teams that expressed an interest in him. His pre-draft measurables were 6-3, 226. 4.40 forty, 6.78 3-cone.

Now I don't know what type of player he is but it's some further evidence that BB is looking to add a smaller and very fast linebacker to this team.

It's steadily rising up my draft priority list as well. A key missing piece if this defense is going to be matchup flexible.

 

[manxman2601]

Every player is a projection

You don't think I realise this?

 

[manxman2601]

It's steadily rising up my draft priority list as well. A key missing piece if this defense is going to be matchup flexible.

I'm becoming a fan of Telvin Smith.

 

[Merril Hoge's Tie Knot]

You don't think I realise this?

You didn't say it

 

[manxman2601]

You didn't say it

I didn't think it needing saying.

 

[mayoclinic]

I'm becoming a fan of Telvin Smith.

I've been a fan of Telvin Smith's play for a long time (in fact, it was watching video of Smith that first started to get me sold on Christian Jones). He is fairly instinctive, and has great range, and plays bigger than his size. But he is very undersized, and has been projected as a 2nd/3rd round pick, which seems a bit high for me. But he would be in the mix along with Tripp, Jones, and Pierre-Louis, depending on exactly what kind of player the Pats were looking for.

 

[manxman2601]

I've been a fan of Telvin Smith's play for a long time (in fact, it was watching video of Smith that first started to get me sold on Christian Jones). He is fairly instinctive, and has great range, and plays bigger than his size. But he is very undersized, and has been projected as a 2nd/3rd round pick, which seems a bit high for me. But he would be in the mix along with Tripp, Jones, and Pierre-Louis, depending on exactly what kind of player the Pats were looking for.

I quite like the notion of having a heat seeking missile on defense like Shazier or Smith. It's why I used to like Bucannon. But I realise that it needs to be a hybrid player, rather than a strict safety that provides that role.

 

[Luxusdk]

I quite like the notion of having a heat seeking missile on defense like Shazier or Smith. It's why I used to like Bucannon. But I realise that it needs to be a hybrid player, rather than a strict safety that provides that role.

Not saying it should be him, but Wonder if Ebner have that skill set in him

 

[Mark Morse]

I'm becoming a fan of Telvin Smith.

Smith can really cover ... his combine numbers were off the charts ... he is 6' 3" 218 lbs. I would like to see him as a SS. Can you imagine a nickel secondary of Revis, Browner, Dennard McCourty and Smith! We wouldm't be worrying about TEs or RBs beating our safeties.

 

[mayoclinic]

Smith can really cover ... his combine numbers were off the charts ... he is 6' 3" 218 lbs. I would like to see him as a SS. Can you imagine a nickel secondary of Revis, Browner, Dennard McCourty and Smith! We wouldm't be worrying about TEs or RBs beating our safeties.

Haven't seen Smith's SS and 3-cone. It will be hard for me to bump him ahead of Jordan Tripp.

If you have a guy like Browner nominally playing SS opposite McCourty, you can seamlessly go between a 2 CB/2 S scheme and having Browner line up in man coverage playing a 3 CB/1 S scheme with McCourty as the single high safety (which the Pats did a lot of last year). If you add a guy like Telvin Smith - or even a bigger LB like Christian Jones or Jordan Tripp with the speed and agility to drop into coverage fluidly and play a hybrid LB/S role, then you can really get creative with big nickel packages.

 

[All22PatsFan]

Haven't seen Smith's SS and 3-cone. It will be hard for me to bump him ahead of Jordan Tripp.

If you have a guy like Browner nominally playing SS opposite McCourty, you can seamlessly go between a 2 CB/2 S scheme and having Browner line up in man coverage playing a 3 CB/1 S scheme with McCourty as the single high safety (which the Pats did a lot of last year). If you add a guy like Telvin Smith - or even a bigger LB like Christian Jones or Jordan Tripp with the speed and agility to drop into coverage fluidly and play a hybrid LB/S role, then you can really get creative with big nickel packages.

I don't see Browner as a SS, he struggles in zone coverage and off coverage. From what I saw he was a really good press CB, who adds good size to the secondary.

 

[manxman2601]

I don't see Browner as a SS, he struggles in zone coverage and off coverage. From what I saw he was a really good press CB, who adds good size to the secondary.

This makes more sense to me. Can compete with Dennard for CB2 and if he wins, Dennard goes to the slot where he might be best and if he doesn't beat out Dennard then we have a legit press corner to back up both Dennard and Revis. That's how I envisage him fitting.

 

[All22PatsFan]

This makes more sense to me. Can compete with Dennard for CB2 and if he wins, Dennard goes to the slot where he might be best and if he doesn't beat out Dennard then we have a legit press corner to back up both Dennard and Revis. That's how I envisage him fitting.

It always good to have depth at CB. The Patriots will also be playing a ton of man coverage this year with Revis and McCourty.

 

[mayoclinic]

I don't see Browner as a SS, he struggles in zone coverage and off coverage. From what I saw he was a really good press CB, who adds good size to the secondary.

This makes more sense to me. Can compete with Dennard for CB2 and if he wins, Dennard goes to the slot where he might be best and if he doesn't beat out Dennard then we have a legit press corner to back up both Dennard and Revis. That's how I envisage him fitting.

It always good to have depth at CB. The Patriots will also be playing a ton of man coverage this year with Revis and McCourty.

Depth at CB is always good, and I expect Browner would get used some at outside CB in press-man coverage. But I think he'd thrive in a SS role with a guy like Revis to lock down half of the field and a guy like McCourty to guard the deep stuff.

Here's a nice video by Matt Bowen (who also writes for the National Football Post, and who was a former NFL CB) on how Darrelle Revis will allow the Pats to do some interesting coverage stuff. Looking at Bowen's analysis, Browner would fit perfectly into the SS role, who plays a pivotal role in cover 3 and cover 7 packages and who drops into deep coverage at times:

How the New England Patriots Can Maximize Darrelle Revis' Elite Coverage Skills | Bleacher Report

The Seahawks used a ton of these kind of schemes. Bucky Brooks had a nice discussion of their cover-1, cover-1 robber, and cover-3 shell against the Broncos:

Seattle Seahawks walloped Denver Broncos with simple scheme - NFL.com

I think Browner would thrive in this kind of role, and that his addition would have a synergistic effect with the Revis signing; but I'm fine letting BB figure out how to best use him.