Edelman may be worth $6-$8 million, but is he worth that to a team that has Amendola?

[Brady6]

Let me start this out by saying I am a fan of Edelman, and if I was asked to choose between Edelman or Danny Amendola it would be a no brainer for me, I would take Edelman every day of the week and twice on Sundays. That acknowledgement aside, I have to accept the fact that this team has to play the cards dealt. They have Danny Amendola under contract for $5.7M APY; does it really make sense for them to pay another $6M+ to retain Edelman? I am not sure!

Could we structure it with the intent that Amendola is gone after 2015? Sure, we could do that, but are we committing to a direction; what if Amendola does do what many think he is capable of doing in 2014, and Edelman underwhelms or has an injury-filled season. Then what do we do, should we flip a coin for 2015, or continue to pay $12M APY for two players who are best suited for the same position.

As I have given it more thought over the offseason the best thing for this team may be to proceed with Amendola, sign a player like Andre Roberts to back him up and take the rest of the money and spend it on a position that we did not invest $28.5M into just one offseason ago.

 

[ripatsfan91]

Re: Edelman may be worth $6-$8 million, but is he worth that to a team that has Amend

Structure it in a way so that you keep Edelman at a low cap hit. Then after the 2014 season, the option is to either cut, trade, or keep Amendola depending on his performance.

Plays bad: Cut him.
Plays well: Trade him.
Plays well (option 2): Keep him

I am not sure Edelman/Amendola offer that redundant of a skill set. They both offer options that can threaten the short/intermediate parts of the field. Couple that with Dobson and Gronkowski to stretch the field vertically and you could have a very diverse offense.

Two guys that stretch field horizontally: Edelman and Amendola
Vertical threats: Dobson and Gronk
Add in Vereen as an elite pass catcher out of the backfield and it seems like a very balanced offense to me.

They key is Amendola's health though. I say sign them both and see how next season plays out. If Amendola is hurt/doesn't perform well it will be an easy decision to cut him.

 

[Observer]

Re: Edelman may be worth $6-$8 million, but is he worth that to a team that has Amend

Is it possible to trade Amendola to somebody for something slightly useful?

 

[Deus Irae]

Re: Edelman may be worth $6-$8 million, but is he worth that to a team that has Amend

Is it possible to trade Amendola to somebody for something slightly useful?

There's no utility for a receiver who had 54 catches in 12 games?

 

[SalemPats]

Re: Edelman may be worth $6-$8 million, but is he worth that to a team that has Amend

I fear that Amendola is not good enough to be an outside receiver that we need with Edelman around/ Saying that Edelman is much better than DA, so we need Edelman

 

[50-yard-line]

Re: Edelman may be worth $6-$8 million, but is he worth that to a team that has Amend

Everything fell right for JE this year. He never had 350 yards in a season before this one.

He stayed healthy.
He was the only returning WR/TE Brady really knew until Gronk came back.
Vereen went down early.
Gronk didn't last.
Amendola got wrecked in week 1...his route-running suffered+ he was new to the system.
The rookies became a revolving door with injuries.

Everything went JE's way. The result is really great for him, likely. He'll get paid. Last preseason, no one made him an offer. Maybe the Pats see him as their outside guy and make him a decent offer, and maybe he'll take a little bit of a hometown discount to stay.

Hope so, but I doubt it. The stars aligned to pay big $$$$$ for JE.

 

[Observer]

Re: Edelman may be worth $6-$8 million, but is he worth that to a team that has Amend

There's no utility for a receiver who had 54 catches in 12 games?

Honestly, I am not seeing any usefulness to Danny Amendola. He was brought to replace Welker, a job performed quite satisfactorily by Edelman. The team would do better by keeping only Edelman and replacing Amendola with a TE or something.

 

[50-yard-line]

Re: Edelman may be worth $6-$8 million, but is he worth that to a team that has Amend

Honestly, I am not seeing any usefulness to Danny Amendola. He was brought to replace Welker, a job performed quite satisfactorily by Edelman. The team would do better by keeping only Edelman and replacing Amendola with a TE or something.

Tough crowd...guy tears his groin apart in week 1.

Still, in half the snaps, has almost exactly half the targets/production as JE...and he's got no usefulness to you.

But JE, who never did anything previous to this year...

 

[Snake Eyes]

Re: Edelman may be worth $6-$8 million, but is he worth that to a team that has Amend

Tough crowd...guy tears his groin apart in week 1.

That's just the problem, he always seems to get hurt. With his poor production and Edelperson emergence the money being paid to Amendola seems excessively high.

I'm hoping we can do a trade and package Amendola and Mallett, and perhaps Ridley, off to another team in exchange for players/picks.

I'd rather give Amendola's salary to Eds.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Re: Edelman may be worth $6-$8 million, but is he worth that to a team that has Amend

Everything fell right for JE this year. He never had 350 yards in a season before this one.

He stayed healthy.
He was the only returning WR/TE Brady really knew until Gronk came back.
Vereen went down early.
Gronk didn't last.
Amendola got wrecked in week 1...his route-running suffered+ he was new to the system.
The rookies became a revolving door with injuries.

Everything went JE's way. The result is really great for him, likely. He'll get paid. Last preseason, no one made him an offer. Maybe the Pats see him as their outside guy and make him a decent offer, and maybe he'll take a little bit of a hometown discount to stay.

Hope so, but I doubt it. The stars aligned to pay big $$$$$ for JE.

Wish I could like this twice. I like Edelman a lot, but he isn't a $6-8M per year receiver. In 5-10 years, when Edelman is out of the league, I'm pretty confident that 2013 will stand out as the best season of his career by a fairly significant margin.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Re: Edelman may be worth $6-$8 million, but is he worth that to a team that has Amend

That's just the problem, he always seems to get hurt. With his poor production and Edelperson emergence the money being paid to Amendola seems excessively high.

I'm hoping we can do a trade and package Amendola and Mallett, and perhaps Ridley, off to another team in exchange for players/picks.

I'd rather give Amendola's salary to Eds.

The same is true for Edelman, to a moderately lesser extent. Edelman and Amendola have been on IR the same number of times, and both are injury-prone in their own rights.

 

[50-yard-line]

Re: Edelman may be worth $6-$8 million, but is he worth that to a team that has Amend

That's just the problem, he always seems to get hurt. With his poor production and Edelperson emergence the money being paid to Amendola seems excessively high.

I'm hoping we can do a trade and package Amendola and Mallett, and perhaps Ridley, off to another team in exchange for players/picks.

I'd rather give Amendola's salary to Eds.

Well, you can't "give" Amendola's salary to Eds, sorry - doesn't work that way. You'll LOSE 4.8 million in that trade over the next two years.

And your premise is really flawed.

Both have been in the league for 5 years.

Edelman has played 64 games.
Amendola has played 54 games - the difference is 2011, when Edelman played in 13, Amendola in 1 (mostly because he came back too soon from an injury).

In those 5 years...

Amendola has 250 receptions for 2359 yards
Edelman has 174 for 1770

Amendola has 9 TDs
Edelman has 10TDs

Amendola averages 43.7 ypg
Edelman averages 27.7 ypg

Amendola has 16 20+yd receptions and 3 40+yd
Edelman has 15 20+yd receptions and 4 40+yd

Amendola has 133 First downs
Edelman has 88 first downs

Amendola averages 9.4 ypc, but it's gone up every year to 11.7 this year
Edelman averages 10,2 ypc, and it's been steady (10.1 this year)

You really see eating 4.8 million over the next two years as worth it, given their history? The guys are mirror images of each other, but ONLY because the stars aligned for JE this year. Other than this year, their numbers aren't close, and favor DA.

 

[DocHoliday]

Edelman may be worth $6-$8 million, but is he worth that to a team that has A...

Let him walk, resign Collie.

DA/Collie man the slot and the rooks step up on the outside.

If TJ Moe is any good have him compete with Collie in camp.

 

[Deus Irae]

Re: Edelman may be worth $6-$8 million, but is he worth that to a team that has Amend

Honestly, I am not seeing any usefulness to Danny Amendola. He was brought to replace Welker, a job performed quite satisfactorily by Edelman. The team would do better by keeping only Edelman and replacing Amendola with a TE or something.

I don't know how many times this has to be pointed out.


Julian Edelman did not replace Wes Welker. Edelman took more than half his snaps as an outside receiver, even with all of Amendola's issues.

Danny Amendola is the Wes Welker replacement.

 

[moosekill]

Re: Edelman may be worth $6-$8 million, but is he worth that to a team that has Amend

I don't know how many times this has to be pointed out.


Julian Edelman did not replace Wes Welker. Edelman took more than half his snaps as an outside receiver, even with all of Amendola's issues.

Danny Amendola is the Wes Welker replacement.

But he is short and white so he must have taken over for Wes.

 

[Snake Eyes]

Re: Edelman may be worth $6-$8 million, but is he worth that to a team that has Amend

Well, you can't "give" Amendola's salary to Eds, sorry - doesn't work that way. You'll LOSE 4.8 million in that trade over the next two years.

And your premise is really flawed.

Both have been in the league for 5 years.

Edelman has played 64 games.
Amendola has played 54 games - the difference is 2011, when Edelman played in 13, Amendola in 1 (mostly because he came back too soon from an injury).

In those 5 years...

Amendola has 250 receptions for 2359 yards
Edelman has 174 for 1770

Amendola has 9 TDs
Edelman has 10TDs

Amendola averages 43.7 ypg
Edelman averages 27.7 ypg

Amendola has 16 20+yd receptions and 3 40+yd
Edelman has 15 20+yd receptions and 4 40+yd

Amendola has 133 First downs
Edelman has 88 first downs

Amendola averages 9.4 ypc, but it's gone up every year to 11.7 this year
Edelman averages 10,2 ypc, and it's been steady (10.1 this year)

You really see eating 4.8 million over the next two years as worth it, given their history? The guys are mirror images of each other, but ONLY because the stars aligned for JE this year. Other than this year, their numbers aren't close, and favor DA.

I'm no cap expert, are the hits the same if we trade Amendola as if we cut him? Could a trade have a restructure that allows us to circumvent the hit?

That said, the difference between them is in what they're likely to produce soon as opposed to what they have done. Edelman broke and arm and got concussed, Amendola tore his groin. At this point Amendola needs to make a recovery but Edelman is just fine.

Also, Eds returns kicks and will also play DB if you ask him, he'll even function as an emergency QB, I see way more value with Edelman.

 

[Brady6]

Re: Edelman may be worth $6-$8 million, but is he worth that to a team that has Amend

Well, you can't "give" Amendola's salary to Eds, sorry - doesn't work that way. You'll LOSE 4.8 million in that trade over the next two years.

And your premise is really flawed.

Both have been in the league for 5 years.

Edelman has played 64 games.
Amendola has played 54 games - the difference is 2011, when Edelman played in 13, Amendola in 1 (mostly because he came back too soon from an injury).

In those 5 years...

Amendola has 250 receptions for 2359 yards
Edelman has 174 for 1770

Amendola has 9 TDs
Edelman has 10TDs

Amendola averages 43.7 ypg
Edelman averages 27.7 ypg

Amendola has 16 20+yd receptions and 3 40+yd
Edelman has 15 20+yd receptions and 4 40+yd

Amendola has 133 First downs
Edelman has 88 first downs

Amendola averages 9.4 ypc, but it's gone up every year to 11.7 this year
Edelman averages 10,2 ypc, and it's been steady (10.1 this year)

You really see eating 4.8 million over the next two years as worth it, given their history? The guys are mirror images of each other, but ONLY because the stars aligned for JE this year. Other than this year, their numbers aren't close, and favor DA.

Their career, stats are as follows (including the postseason).

• Edelman – 5 seasons, 71 games, 199 receptions, 297 targets, 67.08% ratio, 2018 yards, 10.14 average, 13 receiving touchdowns, 17 total touchdowns
• Amendola – 6 seasons, 56 games, 253 receptions, 383 targets 66.05% ratio, 2436 yards, 9.62 average, and 9 receiving/total touchdowns

One key one that you left out is targets. I am not sure if you know this or not but it is hard to catch a football when it is not thrown to you. Amendola had more targets in the first four games of 2012 than Edelman targets in 2011 and 2012 combined. Opportunity is the only thing Amendola was better at prior to this season.

Edelman is a better player and the stars did not align for him at all this season. You have a biased for Amendola, you joined this forum the same month he signed, so I get it but do not manipulate numbers and act like Amendola has been a productive player throughout his career and this season was the only time Edelman has ever been successful. Edelman was productive as a rookie, and his defensive back play helped this team get to the 2011 Super Bowl, while Amendola was on the IR of a 2-14 Rams team. Edelman is the better player, point, blank, period; we are handcuffed by the decision to sign Amendola and it does not make sense to keep them both so we have to let Edelman walk most likely, but that does not mean and will never mean Amendola is a better player because he is NOT. Prior to this season Amendola had the lowest average per catch of any wide receiver in the 25 years that they have tracked that stat, he is not a great player he is UDFA who went to the same school as Welker and played the same position so people thought lightening in a bottle would be found twice.

 

[Brady6]

Re: Edelman may be worth $6-$8 million, but is he worth that to a team that has Amend

I'm no cap expert, are the hits the same if we trade Amendola as if we cut him? Could a trade have a restructure that allows us to circumvent the hit?

That said, the difference between them is in what they're likely to produce soon as opposed to what they have done. Edelman broke and arm and got concussed, Amendola tore his groin. At this point Amendola needs to make a recovery but Edelman is just fine.

Also, Eds returns kicks and will also play DB if you ask him, he'll even function as an emergency QB, I see way more value with Edelman.

The hit is the same if we trade him, and we could not designate him for July 1 so we would not even be able to split it over 2 seasons if we traded him.

 

[Brady6]

Re: Edelman may be worth $6-$8 million, but is he worth that to a team that has Amend

Tough crowd...guy tears his groin apart in week 1.

Still, in half the snaps, has almost exactly half the targets/production as JE...and he's got no usefulness to you.

But JE, who never did anything previous to this year...

He originally suffered the injury in week 2 of the preseason; he worsened it in week 1 but returned to play well against the Bills that week. He played well in week 9 against the Steelers and had his best game in week 15 against the Dolphins. He was able to play so well in those 3 games with the groin injury but was so mediocre or bad in the other 11 games he played this season? Seems more likely that he is the same player that had 26 catches last season in 2 games against the Redskins and 49ers and 37 catches in his other 9 games last season. He is inconsistent; you would have to be blind not see that.

 

[Observer]

Re: Edelman may be worth $6-$8 million, but is he worth that to a team that has Amend

I don't know how many times this has to be pointed out.


Julian Edelman did not replace Wes Welker. Edelman took more than half his snaps as an outside receiver, even with all of Amendola's issues.

Danny Amendola is the Wes Welker replacement.

My point is that Amendola is nobody's replacement. I don't care where he lines up, as long as he replaces the production. Amendola was supposed to replace Welker but he was not even close to Welker's output while Edelman, on the other hand, was. Therefore JE sort of replaced Welker and Amendola replaced nobody. I don't think we need both of them on the team and I would rather have the proven commodity Edelman than the question-marked Amendola. Lose Amendola and use the money on a TE.