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2014 Draft Prospect Thread

manx and mayo what do you think about the idea of trading Mallett to the vikings for their 2nd round pick Turner likes a lot of arm strength in his Qb's and Mallett has that this would make sense especially if the texans, Jaguars and Browns take Bridgewater, Bortles and Manziel off the board their could be a chance that the Vikings don't think Carr is worth the 8th pick and pick someone like Robinson or Barr then we would have the 29/30 and 40 i think this would give us solid options and is probably a little more realistic than getting 33 from the Texans

It's fine with me.

I think next year is the year to draft a true QB heir to Brady. With Marcus Mariota and Jameis Winston likely to be at the top of the draft, there will be some very good QBs available later in the 1st round: Brett Hundley (UCLA), Kevin Hogan (Stanford), Devin Gardner (Michigan) and Bryce Petty (Baylor).

Fill in the rest of the roster in 2014 to give Brady a real chance for the next 3 years. Draft a heir at QB in 2015 and groom him for 2 years.

There is a tremendous young nucleus on this team, if the right players can be retained. There will be a lot of roster decisions to be made for this year and the long term, and making the right decisions is critical.
 
i'm a huge fan of Christian Hackenburg from Penn State I think he could be a target in a couple of years but I'm a big fan of Hundley, Mariota and Winston and I think any of them could be great for the Patriots
 
manx and mayo what do you think about the idea of trading Mallett to the vikings for their 2nd round pick Turner likes a lot of arm strength in his Qb's and Mallett has that this would make sense especially if the texans, Jaguars and Browns take Bridgewater, Bortles and Manziel off the board their could be a chance that the Vikings don't think Carr is worth the 8th pick and pick someone like Robinson or Barr then we would have the 29/30 and 40 i think this would give us solid options and is probably a little more realistic than getting 33 from the Texans

I mentioned the Vikings a few days ago and I wonder whether they are more likely, particularly if the rumours linking Bortles to the Texans are true. The Vikings are the last of the teams picking that badly need a QB which probably means reaching for Carr. Personally I'd prefer Mallett to Carr. And as you say, with the coaching moves they've made, Mallett suits their new style of offense.
 
then having that 40th pick gives us options like van noy and ASJ and then we can get Robinson, Amaro or Murphy with our first pick I think it would be a huge win win for both teams
 
then having that 40th pick gives us options like van noy and ASJ and then we can get Robinson, Amaro or Murphy with our first pick I think it would be a huge win win for both teams

Unlike Mayo and yourself I'm not that keen on Murphy and would now prefer Smith to Van Noy but yes to your point. I am starting to think about corner again though. Bradley Roby is a 1st round CB athletically and probably fits this team nicely.
 
Unlike Mayo and yourself I'm not that keen on Murphy and would now prefer Smith to Van Noy but yes to your point. I am starting to think about corner again though. Bradley Roby is a 1st round CB athletically and probably fits this team nicely.

I'm not particularly high on Robey.

I think that a rotational DE is actually a priority and I've been vocal about Murphy (who I like much better than any other DE prospect; I probably like Taylor Hart and Will Clarke best after Murphy, and they should both be day 3 prospects as things currently stand), but obviously that's just my personal assessment. I'd be thrilled to get either Marcus Smith or Kyle Van Noy, and depending on how the defense was used, they and Jamie Collins could be rotated around quite a bit.

I think Jamie Collins and Marcus Smith would be an incredible defensive combination. You could seamlessly morph between a 3-4 and 4-3 under with the following:

LDE Armstead/Murphy - NT Wilfork - RDE Jones
SAM/SOLB Collins - MLB/SILB Hightower - WLB/WILB Mayo - "Leo"/WOLB Smith
 
i'm a huge fan of Christian Hackenburg from Penn State I think he could be a target in a couple of years but I'm a big fan of Hundley, Mariota and Winston and I think any of them could be great for the Patriots

There's never been a better time to have a 36 year old aging superstar quarterback
 
I'm not particularly high on Robey.

I think that a rotational DE is actually a priority and I've been vocal about Murphy (who I like much better than any other DE prospect; I probably like Taylor Hart and Will Clarke best after Murphy, and they should both be day 3 prospects as things currently stand), but obviously that's just my personal assessment. I'd be thrilled to get either Marcus Smith or Kyle Van Noy, and depending on how the defense was used, they and Jamie Collins could be rotated around quite a bit.

I think Jamie Collins and Marcus Smith would be an incredible defensive combination. You could seamlessly morph between a 3-4 and 4-3 under with the following:

LDE Armstead/Murphy - NT Wilfork - RDE Jones
SAM/SOLB Collins - MLB/SILB Hightower - WLB/WILB Mayo - "Leo"/WOLB Smith

That makes a lot more sense but is he an upgrade on Ninkovich in that scenario? And isn't the LDE usually bigger in that alignment like 300lb plus?

Edit: Wouldn't Armstead/Kelly at LDE and Chandler Jones/Ninkovich at RDE make more sense?
 
i prefer robinson and amaro to murphy as well but i think if we go DE he should be the pick i like smith a lot as well and can see him getting to our pick at around 62 roby is an interesting option since he was a top 10 player earlier this year and could be an option if we get the 40th from the vikings could see us going purifoy in the 2nd at 62 as well though if smith is off the board
 
That makes a lot more sense but is he an upgrade on Ninkovich in that scenario? And isn't the LDE usually bigger in that alignment like 300lb plus?

Edit: Wouldn't Armstead/Kelly at LDE and Chandler Jones/Ninkovich at RDE make more sense?

That would be a scenario with Murphy bulking up to around 270. From all reports he has the frame to add a lot of weight, and there has even been talk of him eventually being a 3-4 DE. Think at least someone like Will Clarke (6'6 1/8" 271") or Taylor Hart (6'6" 282#).

And yes, Ninkovitch in a 4-3 under would fit better at RDE, along with Chandler Jones.

The Pats play a gemish right now, with some over and some under 4-3 fronts and some 3 man fronts. I think Murphy could eventually supplant Ninkovich at LDE and play in both over- and under- sets, but that's just a projection.
 
That would be a scenario with Murphy bulking up to around 270. From all reports he has the frame to add a lot of weight, and there has even been talk of him eventually being a 3-4 DE. Think at least someone like Will Clarke (6'6 1/8" 271") or Taylor Hart (6'6" 282#).

And yes, Ninkovitch in a 4-3 under would fit better at RDE, along with Chandler Jones.

The Pats play a gemish right now, with some over and some under 4-3 fronts and some 3 man fronts. I think Murphy could eventually supplant Ninkovich at LDE and play in both over- and under- sets, but that's just a projection.

I first noticed Murphy in 2012 when Stanford beat Oregon in Eugene. Repeated it this year. Seems good against the run vs the spread. Will be a good pass-rusher but not great. 3 pass rushers would be Chandler Jones, Chris Jones and him. Move Hightower up and down the line because he can get after the qb too when called upon.
 
I first noticed Murphy in 2012 when Stanford beat Oregon in Eugene. Repeated it this year. Seems good against the run vs the spread. Will be a good pass-rusher but not great. 3 pass rushers would be Chandler Jones, Chris Jones and him. Move Hightower up and down the line because he can get after the qb too when called upon.

If we got a more mobile space player like Marcus Smith or Kyle Van Noy in addition to Collins, then we could both use Hightower at MLB and move him up on the DL at times with Mayo playing MLB.

Plus Armond Armstead can hopefully play outside as well as in. That would give us Jones, Ninkovitch, Murphy, Hightower, Armstead and Buchanan all capable of playing DE, plus Collins and Smith who can be moved around. Tons of depth and versatility.
 
That makes a lot more sense but is he an upgrade on Ninkovich in that scenario? And isn't the LDE usually bigger in that alignment like 300lb plus?

Edit: Wouldn't Armstead/Kelly at LDE and Chandler Jones/Ninkovich at RDE make more sense?

Yes. Still, the problem with that thought is that your putting your faith in a guy who has never played a snap and a 33 year old. More importantly, there is no such thing a defense with 3 down linemen one of which is 270lbs that can be stout against the run. That's the reverse of the right kind of 3-4/4-3 hybrid defense. You want 4 down linemen; a traditional 3-4 nose tackle (Wilfork), a traditional 4-3 end (Jones), a traditional 4-3 tackle (need) and a versatile 3-4 end (need) who can rush the quarterback from 4-3 tackle. This defense subs out the low stamina nose tackle for a nickelback when they see 3 receivers, move a pass rushing outside linebacker to defensive end (or sub in a pass rushing defensive end if you are the 2012 Seahawks with Bruce Irvin, but they abandoned that after Alan Branch went to Buffalo). I think your biggest need in this draft class is defensive tackle. Chris Jones and Joe Vellano are just not very good, and I'm not banking on a guy who still hasn't played an NFL snap in Armstead. Frankly, you guys aren't prepared to make a transition to this kind of defense. The only way I could see a switch to that defense is in the following scenario:
You draft Rashede Hageman in the first round. He plays end in your base defense and tackle when you guys go to the nickel, assuming Wilfork is subbed out to conserve stamina.
You draft Dominique Easley in the second round. He plays 3 technique at all times.
You make Collins your pass rushing outside linebacker (people forget how many sacks he can get), moving him to defensive end in nickel situations like the Broncos with Von Miller.
Ninkovich never starts again, because, in the event you move to this defense, he's not athletic enough to play 4-3 outside linebacker in your base defense. He'll backup Chandler Jones.
This defense is incredible in theory. You've got 3 300lbs players to dominate the run when the offense is on the field with less than 3 receivers, and, unlike a 3-4 defense, you only put one of them as a 5 technique. Generally, 3-4 ends are terrible pass rushers, since any and every 3 man front makes run stopping the highest priority for the defensive line. However, in this case, you have 4 down linemen and a guy like Dominique Easley can be as aggressive as he pleases. And you still have two traditional speed rushers.
The problem with this defense though is that you need a Von Miller. A guy who is athletic and rangy enough to stop the run and cover tight ends when he plays like a 4-3 outside linebacker when you aren't in the nickel, but also possesses all of the pass rushing skills of your traditional 3-4 outside linebacker, while having the strength to hold his own as a 5 technique against the run if the opponent does run from a 3 receiver set. If you have a guy who can do all that, this defense is for you. As of now, the only player that possesses all of these qualities is Von Miller. But this is the one thing you guys definitely have going for you. If I had to bet on a young player to develop all of these qualities, it would be Jamie Collins. Collins is no Von Miller, but he possesses most of these qualities. He's extremely athletic, he can rush the quarterback, he has good size, and he can cover. The biggest question is whether or not he can develop the strength to anchor the run as a 5 technique in a nickel defense if the offense runs to his side from a 3 receiver set. He probably will need 5-10lbs to become that freaky. Frankly, the guy's feel for football is ridiculous (he has history with basically every position), and he might be able to handle that job. But you still need other spots to be filled.
 
Yes. Still, the problem with that thought is that your putting your faith in a guy who has never played a snap and a 33 year old. More importantly, there is no such thing a defense with 3 down linemen one of which is 270lbs that can be stout against the run. That's the reverse of the right kind of 3-4/4-3 hybrid defense. You want 4 down linemen; a traditional 3-4 nose tackle (Wilfork), a traditional 4-3 end (Jones), a traditional 4-3 tackle (need) and a versatile 3-4 end (need) who can rush the quarterback from 4-3 tackle. This defense subs out the low stamina nose tackle for a nickelback when they see 3 receivers, move a pass rushing outside linebacker to defensive end (or sub in a pass rushing defensive end if you are the 2012 Seahawks with Bruce Irvin, but they abandoned that after Alan Branch went to Buffalo). I think your biggest need in this draft class is defensive tackle. Chris Jones and Joe Vellano are just not very good, and I'm not banking on a guy who still hasn't played an NFL snap in Armstead. Frankly, you guys aren't prepared to make a transition to this kind of defense. The only way I could see a switch to that defense is in the following scenario:
You draft Rashede Hageman in the first round. He plays end in your base defense and tackle when you guys go to the nickel, assuming Wilfork is subbed out to conserve stamina.
You draft Dominique Easley in the second round. He plays 3 technique at all times.
You make Collins your pass rushing outside linebacker (people forget how many sacks he can get), moving him to defensive end in nickel situations like the Broncos with Von Miller.
Ninkovich never starts again, because, in the event you move to this defense, he's not athletic enough to play 4-3 outside linebacker in your base defense. He'll backup Chandler Jones.
This defense is incredible in theory. You've got 3 300lbs players to dominate the run when the offense is on the field with less than 3 receivers, and, unlike a 3-4 defense, you only put one of them as a 5 technique. Generally, 3-4 ends are terrible pass rushers, since any and every 3 man front makes run stopping the highest priority for the defensive line. However, in this case, you have 4 down linemen and a guy like Dominique Easley can be as aggressive as he pleases. And you still have two traditional speed rushers.
The problem with this defense though is that you need a Von Miller. A guy who is athletic and rangy enough to stop the run and cover tight ends when he plays like a 4-3 outside linebacker when you aren't in the nickel, but also possesses all of the pass rushing skills of your traditional 3-4 outside linebacker, while having the strength to hold his own as a 5 technique against the run if the opponent does run from a 3 receiver set. If you have a guy who can do all that, this defense is for you. As of now, the only player that possesses all of these qualities is Von Miller. But this is the one thing you guys definitely have going for you. If I had to bet on a young player to develop all of these qualities, it would be Jamie Collins. Collins is no Von Miller, but he possesses most of these qualities. He's extremely athletic, he can rush the quarterback, he has good size, and he can cover. The biggest question is whether or not he can develop the strength to anchor the run as a 5 technique in a nickel defense if the offense runs to his side from a 3 receiver set. He probably will need 5-10lbs to become that freaky. Frankly, the guy's feel for football is ridiculous (he has history with basically every position), and he might be able to handle that job. But you still need other spots to be filled.


In answer to your Von Miller question, I'd fill that with Collins and Marcus Smith. As for the DE/DT questions, then they might have to weight. Priority for me is to ensure Brady has suitable weapons, particularly at TE. I might look at some late round development options (Zach Kerr, Caraun Reid, Taylor Hart etc) but I think we're not too badly off at the big bodies this season. We can address them high next year.
 
Chris Jones and Joe Vellano are just not very good, and I'm not banking on a guy who still hasn't played an NFL snap in Armstead.

I'm not going to argue Vellano so much at this point, but I do think that Chris Jones, if not a superstar, is certainly a piece of the puzzle for next year. He didn't even have the benefit of an offseason with the Pats, and my understanding from various reports is that if the Pats had had a 5 or a 6 this year, they would have drafted him.
 
In answer to your Von Miller question, I'd fill that with Collins and Marcus Smith. As for the DE/DT questions, then they might have to weight. Priority for me is to ensure Brady has suitable weapons, particularly at TE. I might look at some late round development options (Zach Kerr, Caraun Reid, Taylor Hart etc) but I think we're not too badly off at the big bodies this season. We can address them high next year.
I just disagree. I see Wilfork and no other guy that resembles a long term solution. It's too early to count on Armstead
 
The past two years we have passed on Dez Bryant and Cordelle Patterson, and have settled with going for lesser talent. Time to close the door on this problem position and not pass on Kelvin Benjamin, although I think he is moving to high now away from out first pick.
 
The past two years we have passed on Dez Bryant and Cordelle Patterson, and have settled with going for lesser talent. Time to close the door on this problem position and not pass on Kelvin Benjamin, although I think he is moving to high now away from out first pick.

Wes Welker is more likely to play for the Pats next year than Kelvin Benjamin. He can jump up and high point a ball off of college defensive backs. He's not going to be able to get off of the LOS against the pros and won't get much better. He's already almost 24.
 
Nearly 23, but lets see his measureables come the combine. Hopefully does a 4.50 in the 40 will have me sold.
 
Nearly 23, but lets see his measureables come the combine. Hopefully does a 4.50 in the 40 will have me sold.

He might have a fine 40 time. Look closer at his 3-cone drill. BB likes wr with a little shake in their game. Not just the straight line speed guy. Not saying he's right. I just doubt that he would take a guy like Benjamin in the 1st.
 
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