Anyone else tired of the run getting abandoned?

[Brady6]

Tired of seeing the run abandoned? ive been tired of the same thing for the last six or seven years. Or ever since TB became more than a 'game manager'. IMO the the pats have become to pass happy.

I am with you pal… 2007, 2010, 2011 and 2012 I was ready to throw the TV out the freaking window I was so tired of watching that crap 50 touchdown, 5000 yards seasons and all I wanted was Brady to be a game manager again.

If we had just ran the ball with Green-Ellis and let our elite defenders (see below) control the game there is no doubt in my mind that we would have been the 2011 champions and Mark Anderson would have been the league and SB MVP.

• Josh Barrett
• Mark Anderson
• Gary Guyton
• Sergio Brown
• Sterling Moore
• Antwaun Molden
• James Ihedigbo
• Nate Jones
• Kyle Love
• Shaun Ellis



Ok joking aside I am with you the team could benefit from some balance but I don’t think we’re pass happy I just think we’re inconsistent in our approach, we run and then we go away from it. The other problem is them trying to split into a 5 wide with Develin, Mulligan and Blount on the field teams do not respect that like they did when it Hernandez, Gronkowski, etc. it is actually sort of laughable to look and see Develin with his dumb shoulder pads out at the X-WR slot.

 

[Palm Beach Pats Fan]

The football purist in me loves to see us run the ball more.

The rational. logical, number-crunching analyst in me, though, sees that we get more yards per attempt, in less time, scoring more points in fewer possessions, with no higher risk of turnover, when we pass the ball like crazy.

So I have to say that I hope we pass the ball like crazy to get way ahead, and then we run the ball like crazy when taking time off the clock is more important than scoring.

Oh, we need to make them respect the run to be able to pass better, but by no means in today's NFL do you ever need to adopt a run-first philosophy or even a balanced or a 2:1 pass:run philosophy. It just doesn't make sense with all of the rules advantages afforded the passing game today

 

[unoriginal]

Here's the book as I read it: show pressure in the red zone, and Brady will check to a pass play, preferably out of the shotgun. Without Gronk or anyone else who can catch the ball above the coverage, it's hard for the Pats to score TDs through the air.

Rinse, repeat.

Both Pats TDs came outside the 10 yard line; Edelman's was from outside the red zone. Get the Pats in a goal-to-go and they can't move.

They are going to have to come up with some new personnel packages down there I think. Problem is I can't think of a player who is a matchup advantage. If Vereen could run or Ridley or Blount could catch... but you can only have one of those guys on the field at a time anyway. Maybe DJ Williams and Uh-Oh in a 2TE set? Somebody has to be a big boy and carve out a passing window in the middle of the end zone.

 

[Kontradiction]

what im curious about is why there wasnt any play action passes. I dont think i saw a single run fake throw deep that we normally see.

The OL had Mankins starting at LT, Kline at LG, and the usual suspects along the interior. They couldn't afford any slow developing plays.

And I was baffled at why they didn't run more often. Miami's weakness is definitely against the run.

 

[SVN]

Here's the book as I read it: show pressure in the red zone, and Brady will check to a pass play, preferably out of the shotgun. Without Gronk or anyone else who can catch the ball above the coverage, it's hard for the Pats to score TDs through the air.

Rinse, repeat.

Both Pats TDs came outside the 10 yard line; Edelman's was from outside the red zone. Get the Pats in a goal-to-go and they can't move.

They are going to have to come up with some new personnel packages down there I think. Problem is I can't think of a player who is a matchup advantage. If Vereen could run or Ridley or Blount could catch... but you can only have one of those guys on the field at a time anyway. Maybe DJ Williams and Uh-Oh in a 2TE set? Somebody has to be a big boy and carve out a passing window in the middle of the end zone.

Seems like you are spot on..at least as per reiss..


Picked-up pieces from 1st-quarter review: Patriots at Dolphins Week 15 - ESPN Boston

4. It's easy to second guess the pass-pass-pass sequence in the red zone that ultimately led to the Patriots settling for a field goal on the first drive, but it didn’t seem like egregious play-calling from this perspective. One could perhaps quibble with throwing on second-and-goal from the 4, but when the Dolphins brought two safeties down in the box, creating a 6-on-8 situation, the correct pre-snap read is to throw. That meant one-on-one matchups for the outside receivers, and you’d like to think you could win those. But what happened was that the Dolphins backed both safeties out at the last moment, winning the chess match as Brady purposely sailed a pass over the head of Danny Amendola in the back right-hand corner of the end zone. In retrospect, an inside handoff to Shane Vereen might have scored a touchdown, but based on pre-snap information, there was no reason to think that would have produced such a result.

 

[tombonneau]

I think part of the problem is our RBs are not trust worthy right now so when we’re in a tight ball game or losing I think McDaniels trusts Brady with the ball more than he trusts Ridley or Blount. I get the impression they’re trying to limit the amount of handoffs Vereen takes given his wrist still has a cast on it.

It's funny because Bruschi mentioned that he felt it was safer to let Brady throw than these RBs run the ball (which I thought seemed statistically irrational) I looked at the data.

For 2013, with Brady's combined fumbles(all)/INT, he fumbles or throws a pick on 3% of dropbacks, so a higher rate than Ridely 4/151 fumbles (2.6%) and Blount's 2/113 (1.8%).

Obviously this comes with a higher reward on yardage per attempt, but the argument that in the red zone it's safer to let Brady drop back than run the ball does not hold water with me.

 

[Bhelmet]

Ridley looked good on his FEW opportunities, but I cannot blame the coaches for using him as such. How many of his fumbles cost us points, field position, momentum, or some combination thereof? I also doubt that Josh can just say, "get in there Ridley"; I think he would be overruled on that one. The running situation is ALL on Ridley, IMO. Whatever he needs to show coaches to regain confidence is not getting done. It speaks loudly when he looks good on his limited runs and he is NOWHERE in crunch time. Blount was running well in the 4th - imagine a fresh Ridley. Really sucks he cannot get out of his own way.

 

[Deus Irae]

Here's the book as I read it: show pressure in the red zone, and Brady will check to a pass play, preferably out of the shotgun. Without Gronk or anyone else who can catch the ball above the coverage, it's hard for the Pats to score TDs through the air.

Rinse, repeat.

Both Pats TDs came outside the 10 yard line; Edelman's was from outside the red zone. Get the Pats in a goal-to-go and they can't move.

They are going to have to come up with some new personnel packages down there I think. Problem is I can't think of a player who is a matchup advantage. If Vereen could run or Ridley or Blount could catch... but you can only have one of those guys on the field at a time anyway. Maybe DJ Williams and Uh-Oh in a 2TE set? Somebody has to be a big boy and carve out a passing window in the middle of the end zone.

This


Blount needs to get 3 steps in order to hit full stride
Ridley can't hold onto the ball
Vereen is not a power back
Bolden is Bolden
Gronk's on the shelf
OhOh isn't exactly a monster blocker
Wendell's not at all stout at the point of attack

When I look at that, I don't really see a whole lot of "and goal" running options if the opponent stacks the line and shuts down the sneak.

 

[Archeryaddict12]

Here's the book as I read it: show pressure in the red zone, and Brady will check to a pass play, preferably out of the shotgun. Without Gronk or anyone else who can catch the ball above the coverage, it's hard for the Pats to score TDs through the air.

Rinse, repeat.

Both Pats TDs came outside the 10 yard line; Edelman's was from outside the red zone. Get the Pats in a goal-to-go and they can't move.

They are going to have to come up with some new personnel packages down there I think. Problem is I can't think of a player who is a matchup advantage. If Vereen could run or Ridley or Blount could catch... but you can only have one of those guys on the field at a time anyway. Maybe DJ Williams and Uh-Oh in a 2TE set? Somebody has to be a big boy and carve out a passing window in the middle of the end zone.

This is what I am thinking. Maybe Hooman and DJ can offer some RZ targets, or maybe Dobson. Otherwise, trying to get in the EZ from outside the RZ. But unfortunately, this is where gronks loss hurts.

 

[SVN]

This


Blount needs to get 3 steps in order to hit full stride
Ridley can't hold onto the ball
Vereen is not a power back
Bolden is Bolden
Gronk's on the shelf
OhOh isn't exactly a monster blocker
Wendell's not at all stout at the point of attack

When I look at that, I don't really see a whole lot of "and goal" running options if the opponent stacks the line and shuts down the sneak.

I think they still need to turn to ridley. No use giving him 7 snaps a game. He has to be used in RZ

 

[Fencer]

I hope McDaniels gets an interview his act is getting old McDaniels doesn't Adjust when the other Teams Adjust and thats why our Offense struggles.

Is your view based, at least in part, on how much better the Pats offense has been in the first half than in the second half of recent games?

 

[varjao]

The lack of tricking / alternative plays is killing also.

They are playing plain and simple football. Why do not try a reverse, a play action, anything? They have Amendola and Edelman who can run really fast.

You only need 4 yards damn it. Even a hard count/sneak should do it.

We are stinking in the red zone %, I think it's better to try a TD pass from the 20 yard line with players open than inside the 10 where they can't get separation or be physical.

I think Blount is ok and reliable, his 2 fumbles were Ok fumbles, not bizarre like Ridley's.

One of our problems this season, apart from all the injuries and so on, is that believe it or not we are being outcoached.

 

[Kontradiction]

The lack of tricking / alternative plays is killing also.

They are playing plain and simple football. Why do not try a reverse, a play action, anything? They have Amendola and Edelman who can run really fast.

You only need 4 yards damn it. Even a hard count/sneak should do it.

We are stinking in the red zone %, I think it's better to try a TD pass from the 20 yard line with players open than inside the 10 where they can't get separation or be physical.

I think Blount is ok and reliable, his 2 fumbles were Ok fumbles, not bizarre like Ridley's.

One of our problems this season, apart from all the injuries and so on, is that believe it or not we are being outcoached.

Trick plays are typically slow developing plays. Again, you need to look at the Pats OL during the last game. It's almost literally being held together by a band-aid.

 

[unoriginal]

The lack of tricking / alternative plays is killing also.

They are playing plain and simple football. Why do not try a reverse, a play action, anything? They have Amendola and Edelman who can run really fast.

It's not a lack of play action that's causing this offense to sputter... Sometimes I feel like runs: play action is at a 1:1 ratio,

We are stinking in the red zone %, I think it's better to try a TD pass from the 20 yard line with players open than inside the 10 where they can't get separation or be physical

This is probably the way to approach it from now on. Of course smart teams will quickly recognize the tendency, forcing throws underneath the coverage followed by tackles at the 5 or so. Personally I'd like to see the Pats just commit to running it for four downs. Blount had a nice carry down there where he ran over like five people for an eight yard gain. Either that or try some Emory and Henry bull**** like what they used to run for Hernandez.

 

[SVN]

I said many times in last few days and will say it again. If they want to use ridley for 5-7 snaps a game to give others a breather, they might as well bench him .Or they need to turn to him to be feature back to get some more explosive plays from the running game esp in the RZ.

 

[RIpats88]

Without dobson and thompkins the dolphins were daring us to throw it to the outside...I understand dobson isnt randy moss reincarnate..BUT I would think its a higher probability throwing it to a 6 3 receiver on the sidelines for a td than a 5 10 one

Look at his back shoulder throw td against the steelers. Or thompkins against the saints. Those are athletic outside receivers we are missing

I want more ridley at the 10yard line too...look how detroit got in there on their first drive. Reggie bush 15yard run td. Ridley can do that

 

[unoriginal]

Without dobson and thompkins the dolphins were daring us to throw it to the outside...I understand dobson isnt randy moss reincarnate..BUT I would think its a higher probability throwing it to a 6 3 receiver on the sidelines for a td than a 5 10 one

Look at his back shoulder throw td against the steelers. Or thompkins against the saints. Those are athletic outside receivers we are missing

I want more ridley at the 10yard line too...look how detroit got in there on their first drive. Reggie bush 15yard run td. Ridley can do that

But do the Pats have a Calvin Johnson? Having a big EZ threat (1) pulls a safety out of the box and (2) pulls a linebacker out of a blitz in order to fill that pass zone.

Pats don't have that, so that's one more guy to block, and it seems like that one extra guy tackles the running back behind the line of scrimmage more often than not.

 

[chicowalker]

This


Blount needs to get 3 steps in order to hit full stride
Ridley can't hold onto the ball
Vereen is not a power back
Bolden is Bolden
Gronk's on the shelf
OhOh isn't exactly a monster blocker
Wendell's not at all stout at the point of attack

When I look at that, I don't really see a whole lot of "and goal" running options if the opponent stacks the line and shuts down the sneak.

If they stack the line I'd like to see them try Vereen to the outside.

I'd also be OK giving Develin a shot in that situation.

In general, Vereen is being underutilized as a runner, imo -- but that may be related to the injury, I realize.

(Bolden is also being underutilized, I think -- but again, maybe injury related.)

 

[varjao]

I think the Ridley situation is getting worse, as someone said if he's not back on the playbook it's because they don't trust him.

It's not only a technical issue but it seems to me that caught him in the mind.

If it's not to use him as the 1st RB of this team and I agree with the ongoing process here to bench him, so it's time to think in a trade, he still has value on the league.

 

[borg]

Given the current roster depletion, scoring points will likely continue to be a struggle. Isn't this team at a crisis point and therefore should abandon the Ridley exile. Fumble-itis be damned....the Pats need red zone TDs and Ridley has a proven track record in the TD dept. This defense can't hold the score down...mid 20's to low 30's is the new reality.....so this offense has to "outscore" the opponent. This offense doesn't have enough weapons to compete if Ridley continues to get the cold shoulder. Time to roll the dice and get this horse out of the stable.