Ras-I Dowling released

[jsull87]

https://twitter.com/MikeGiardi/status/372843527572426752

Forgive my ignorance if this is already apparent. But how would this twitter source know that BB over rules scouts?

 

[BradyFTW!]

Final note: let's understand the mindset behind the pick for a moment. Belichick clearly felt that Dowling had far more talent than his draft position indicated. Given what little we saw of him when he was actually healthy, I can see where that impression came from.

It was a gamble, absolutely. But to call it the 'worst pick of the Belichick' era because it didn't work is just a fundamentally, deeply stupid to say.

To borrow an analogy from poker, blackjack, market speculation, drafting NFL players, or anything else: the right move is the right move, even if the results don't always show it.

If you have a 13, and the dealer is showing a 10, you hit. You always hit, every time, without exception. If it just so happens that you get face card and bust, then so be it. The fact that you busted doesn't mean that you made the wrong move. It means that the right move happened to have a bad outcome this time around.

Personally, I'm inclined to feel this way about the Dowling pick. Picking players who have red flags re: health, legal status, etc. is a fantastic way to get a player who is far more talented than his draft position would indicate. Sure, we've ended up with some lemons like Tate and Dowling, but it's also how the Pats got Gronk, Chandler Jones, Dennard, Cannon, and I'm sure some other guys who I'm forgetting. Someone like Gronk is basically equivalent to hitting on 13 and getting an 8. All of the idiots around you will think you're a genius for doing it, but in reality you're no smarter than the guy who busted. You both made the right move.

If you're going to argue that Dowling was a terrible pick, then you have to argue that using information that was available at the time. Argue that his upside wasn't nearly high enough to justify the injury risk, for example. Or argue that his injury track record was too alarming for him to be worth the pick (be aware: if you're arguing this, then you're implicitly arguing that Gronk was also a bad pick, since his injury history was worse than Dowling's).

Whatever you do, don't say "it was a bad call because, in hindsight, it didn't work out". Revisionist history is for stupid people.

 

[jsull87]

We all understand that the draft is a crapshoot but if we are going to praise their unconventional picks when they hit then we should also give them **** for picks like Ras "IR" Dowling and Tavon "Who?" Wilson when they don't work. Now before someone jumps on me, yes, yes, jury is still out on Tavon.

I think this comment is fair enough. I personally chose to think the best of the draft picks until proven wrong. I can admit i was wrong about Dowling, i thought he'd make the cut.

But i don't think it's that unfair to hold the Pats accountable for drafting an injury prone CB who was injured every season of his pro career. If he was healthy and couldn't cut it that's a different story.

 

[Sciz]

I'm just curious. Are the Packers receiving this much crap for Derek Sherrod, the guy taken directly before Dowling, who has fewer career games (5), fewer career starts (0), and is already on reserve/PUP to start this season?

 

[Oswlek]

You could make a very strong case that they have been the best drafting team since 2001. I have yet to see another team rebuild on the fly in the free agency period.

A very strong case, indeed. A few years ago, someone did some leg work and found that, since 2001, NE was tops in the league in starting seasons, probowls and all pros from draftees. Ultimately, BB has an elite drafter with a bizarre slump in the middle. The reason the failures stand out so much is twofold:

1) He makes moves and selects more players, so we are bound to have more failures to point at.

2) We tend to see moves made between 3 and 6 years ago most brightly, since those are the guys who would be hitting their prime, which overlaps with some of the worst years. If NE keeps up their current track record for a few more seasons, eventually that light will shift away from the Wheatley's and Crables.

 

[BradyFTW!]

I'm just curious. Are the Packers receiving this much crap for Derek Sherrod, the guy taken directly before Dowling, who has fewer career games (5), fewer career starts (0), and is already on reserve/PUP to start this season?

Could be wrong, but I think the Packers are getting a bit more slack because Sherrod didn't have as much of an injury history prior to being drafted - he was pretty much healthy in college, then snapped his leg once he got to the pros.

I think these people also don't understand how significant Dowling's hip injury was. That's the kind of injury that will really mess you up in a big way. Since he had some recurring injuries in college, he's made of glass and that's that.

 

[hodgey]

So, "in advance, concede my argument" is your post?


Sad....


Sorry to burst your bubble, but McCourty wasn't cutting it, which is why he was moved to safety, since he played better when he could see the play in front of him.

Does'nt everybody move great corners to safety in their prime??

 

[Deus Irae]

I'm just curious. Are the Packers receiving this much crap for Derek Sherrod, the guy taken directly before Dowling, who has fewer career games (5), fewer career starts (0), and is already on reserve/PUP to start this season?

This is a Patriots board, not a Packers board, so the question really is irrelevant.

 

[Brock Samson]

I think these people also don't understand how significant Dowling's hip injury was. That's the kind of injury that will really mess you up in a big way.

I think you're right about the impact of a hip injury that requires surgery, but reports from training camp suggest that he looked great. I asked earlier but didn't see an answer - does anybody know if he re-injured the hip? I haven't heard about a possible injury settlement. Maybe the reports were wrong....

 

[hodgey]

The simple fact of the matter is that too many whiffs on high round picks has been the achilles heal of this team. Hate to think that TB wont get his 4th, but if not I put the blame squarely on poor talent evaluation. Isnt it funny how Great coaches seem to always be in the company of great players? How would Phil Jackson look without MJ, Kobe and Shaq? Montana>Walsh, Brady>BB, Elway&Davis>Shanahan. All BB has to do is provide an adequate supporting caste. Maybe this year is the year with the likes of Kenbrell & Sudfeld? Only time will tell.

 

[ausbacker]

This is a Patriots board, not a Packers board, so the question really is irrelevant.

I'm just curious. Are the Packers receiving this much crap for Derek Sherrod, the guy taken directly before Dowling, who has fewer career games (5), fewer career starts (0), and is already on reserve/PUP to start this season?

It's a relevant question with an applicable answer given similar circumstance.

The answer on my behalf is I don't know Sciz. I haven't taken that much of an interest in it other than having to realise it could have been a great number of players the Patriots could have taken instead of Dowling. It's a sad end to what could have been a promising Patriots career.

 

[Deus Irae]

It's a relevant question with an applicable answer given similar circumstance.

It's not relevant. The fan bases are different, the boards are different, histories are different, the teams are different. Coverage is different.

 

[Oswlek]

It's not relevant. The fan bases are different, the boards are different, the teams are different. Coverage is different.

It isn't relevant to this conversation, but it is something that should be noted when you consider that nary a day goes by without someone holding Ted Thompson out as an example of what Bill should strive for.

 

[stcjones]

One of biggest BUSTS in the history of the patriots is finally gone! What a tremendous waste of time, energy, and money this "weak ***ed man of GLASS" has been....oh well ...hope he saved his $....Now it's time to getrget ready for his new career...bagging groceries.....only problem is he will probably tear his rotator cuff and fracture his humerus putting a customers loaf of bread in the bag....

 

[ausbacker]

It's not relevant. The fan bases are different, the boards are different, histories are different, the teams are different. Coverage is different.

It is relevant. It's relevant for a many great reasons.

You need a good night's sleep Deus. You're batting way below your average today.

 

[Sciz]

This is a Patriots board, not a Packers board, so the question really is irrelevant.

I think taking the connection between Dowling and Belichick's drafting a step further to comparing opinions of Belichick's drafting to opinions of Thompson's drafting despite similar recent failures is completely acceptable, and I especially won't accept any criticism in this regard from the king of thread-derailing.

 

[RIpats88]

part of the reason it has taken so long for Bill to rebuild this defense is because there have been so many busts in the secondary...hopefully the new rookie CB can change that around...Dennard also seems to be a solid CB

 

[IcyPatriot]

Fans put way too much emphasis on the draft ...

more than Belichick does and he has said as much ... it's just one way to acquire players.

When he misses on a pick it energizes the Felgerites and the Mazzites.

 

[Deus Irae]

It is relevant. It's relevant for a many great reasons.

You need a good night's sleep Deus. You're batting way below your average today.

I've been fine. You, however, have been trying to pick a fight and making really lousy arguments in order to try doing so. I'm done with you for tonight.

 

[Sciz]

One of biggest BUSTS in the history of the patriots is finally gone! What a tremendous waste of time, energy, and money this "weak ***ed man of GLASS" has been....oh well ...hope he saved his $....Now it's time to getrget ready for his new career...bagging groceries.....only problem is he will probably tear his rotator cuff and fracture his humerus putting a customers loaf of bread in the bag....

I really don't understand comments like this. Yes, he failed as a Patriot due to injuries. That makes him "weak ***ed" and gives him nothing but a future in bagging groceries? Even if he never another NFL paycheck again (which would surprise me), he graduated in three and a half years with a degree in sociology, which would seem to open at least a few doors for him in future endeavors.