Explosive New Hernandez Details

[zoostation]

I can't believe he is so stupid to have the victim killed in a car he rented and left within walking distance of his house.

If he's dumb enough to allegedly shoot someone in the face while riding together in a car anything is possible.

 

[PatsFanSince74]

I'll bet BB is seriously regretting that Welker release now.

No Gronk, Hernandez or Welker.

With a guy murdered and an ongoing police investigation into one of the three persons named above, that's not the most important concern right now.........but it sure seems like the Patriots Offense will have, to put it kindly, a "different look" next season.

 

[BadMoFo]

Guess you never want to drive home with Aaron Hernandez.

 

[mgcolby]

festy, are you a homicide cop?

I don't think, from what we do know, that it looks anything but bad right now. I'm waiting and seeing too, just because we're talking about not just a Pats player, but someone who's a free man right now and, so far, isn't being threatened with loss of that freedom.

We don't know that he did a dang thing... "yet."

But that said, what's your source for "how the first 48 go"? Isn't it also the case that if you don't have enough on someone, you can sometimes let him go and keep your eye on him before formal questioning, hoping for slip-ups or just more evidence before you bring him in?

Hypothetical: What if he's not the trigger-man, but they don't yet have enough to really prove he conspired? Then what's there to threaten him (his lawyer) with, to turn him, and nail down their case against the shooter?

I don't know "how the first 48 goes," but I'm not sure it's a cookie cutter, and I'm not sure you know either. Again, are you a homicide cop? Do you actually have the "first 48" playbook in your head from long experience? If so, ever dealt with a celebrity in such a case (therefore, with lots of lawyerly access?)

I'm not mocking and not trying to pick a fight, I'm just trying to get at whether you're throwing an opinion out there randomly, or whether you have some kind of expertise to match your tone of authority on the subject.

I've seen that show....

 

[BadMoFo]

I heard last night that they were looking for Odin's girlfriend and were concerned for her safety, but haven't seen more details about that.

I'm wondering if that has anything to do with the story Hernandez and his friends gave them. Maybe Odin got out of his car and went with her and that's when he ended up dead.

 

[FCB02062]

Guess this is what happens when the Patriots are constantly looking for these VALUE guys in the draft - Hernandez was a early-mid second round talent who fell because he has questionable character/decision making. So Belichick decides to draft him because he's great "value". Yeah, great value, as it looks like Hernandez is going to be spending more time at MCI-Norfolk or Cedar Junction than in a Pats uniform any time soon.

Funny how this dovetails with the travails of their other great "value" pick, Gronkowski - you know, high first round talent, but history of injuries causes him to fall to mid second round. Now he's starting season on PUP after 4 or 5 surgeries in the span of 10 months or so. Who knows if he'll ever be effective again.

Looks like these "value" picks weren't such great value, eh????

 

[Triumph]

Damn! Hernandez is in serious hot water. How could he get himself involved in something like this.

He never was the brightest bulb on the xmas tree.

 

[PATSNUTme]

I'm going to take a different approach to all of this. I'm going to wait until I learn more FACTS before offering an opinion or speculate.

Just having his named linked to all of this is not good. Now that is a fact.

And for those of you offering opinions and then telling others that their opinion is stupid, you might want to re-think how that sounds.

 

[Gumby]

there have been plenty of suppositions and guesses and guys speaking authoritatively (who dont really know anything for sure about either of these 2 situations)......

So, let me throw one more supposition out there:

I dont like that 100% of the suppositions tend to run toward this Loyd Olin dude being the 'bad' or the 'involved' guy... so here is one the other way.

Just suppose that AH wanted to score some more weed and he and his 2 buds are all hot to smoke. Olin gets told after getting in the car what they are doing and either objects, gets cold feet, or tells them or the dealer he has had enough and is calling the cops. The unknown dealer or AH's 2 'friends' off the guy because he goign to get them in trouble.

Best case in this scenario is that Olin got out when they said they were going to score and started walking away, deal went down, AH left the scene, and then the drug dealer just offed the pedestrian for jollies or to get rid of any potential witnesses.

I am not closing my mind to believing anything as to guilt / innoncence at this point; but NO WAY IN HELL I watch the Pats if he is still playing for them as a "RAY LEWIS JR." (that is, if guilty [whether court-convicted or not] or complicit in murder of an innocent man). I'll take a sabbatical til he is gone.

 

[RayClay]

there have been plenty of suppositions and guesses and guys speaking authoritatively (who dont really know anything for sure about either of these 2 situations)......

So, let me throw one more supposition out there:

I dont like that 100% of the suppositions tend to run toward this Loyd Olin dude being the 'bad' or the 'involved' guy... so here is one the other way.

Just suppose that AH wanted to score some more weed and he and his 2 buds are all hot to smoke. Olin gets told after getting in the car what they are doing and either objects, gets cold feet, or tells them or the dealer he has had enough and is calling the cops. The unknown dealer or AH's 2 'friends' off the guy because he goign to get them in trouble.

Best case in this scenario is that Olin got out when they said they were going to score and started walking away, deal went down, AH left the scene, and then the drug dealer just offed the pedestrian for jollies or to get rid of any potential witnesses.

I am not closing my mind to believing anything as to guilt / innoncence at this point; but NO WAY IN HELL I watch the Pats if he is still playing for them as a "RAY LEWIS JR." (that is, if guilty [whether court-convicted or not] or complicit in murder of an innocent man). I'll take a sabbatical til he is gone.

Are you writing a novel or something?

 

[MassPats38]

The dumbest word in any case is speculation. I don't bother forming an opinion until I've allowed everything to unfold. It's really the only way to gather an informed opinion.

Well stated, ausbacker.

It is amusing reading all these posts on (1) the fact Hernandez should simply talk to the police and (2) how he is guilty of a murder (directly or as an accomplice) based on a few facts.

The willingness of people to tag him with a crime, on limited facts, is why people lawyer up. I believe law enforcement officers are, in general, honorable, reasonable people, but have run into my share of garden variety, judgmental morons who do not believe in the need to ask questions when forming an opinion on what 'happened' in a case. That scene from "My Cousin Vinny" with the interrogation is a metaphor for how many investigations proceed (the surprised response "I killed the clerk?" becomes the confession "I killed the clerk" at trial). Police do not have a legal duty to conduct an objective and complete investigation. They need to establish probable cause to arrest and charge. And PC is not much, so do not expect much of an investigation. Police do not and will not run down all possible scenarios when they believe they have their man, and that is how actually innocent people get convicted (by that I mean factual innocence, not people simply professing their innocence).

As for this case, we know nothing of timelines, forensics, or really anything else. Right now, you have a car in his name (good point - if you are going to kill somebody, why would you do that logically? Inform a rental company of a specific fact that ties you to a crime if you are trying to hide your involvement? Why not rent it in the names of the other guys?), a body, and two other suspects. It potentially is no more than guilt by association (which is not a crime), or it could be guilt if the facts are there. I would think if the police had a smoking gun on Hernandez, he would not just be wanted for questioning. He would be arrested and squeezed to implicate whomever the killer was believed to be. That likely means the police do not have PC on any offense on Hernandez at this point, and they are the ones conducting the investigation. The armchair police officers here who have charged and convicted him already based on media reports may want to take note of that.

 

[Triumph]

I'm going to take a different approach to all of this. I'm going to wait until I learn more FACTS before offering an opinion or speculate.

Just having his named linked to all of this is not good. Now that is a fact.

Hernandez was one of three people to see Odin alive hours before he turned up dead. Hernandez drove the car.

If Hernandez knows who pulled the trigger, he should come clean. But I dont believe that he will because of the gangsta code of ethics.

 

[Patradomous]

Its to early in the game for the Pats to say or do anything. But for all intense purposes you have seen Aaron Hernandez for the last time wearing a New England Patriots jersey.
Quite frankly that the only thing I give a shiit about. My main concern is how they replace him.

As far as the world of thug-a-rama they can keep on killing each other.

The sooner the Pats can make a clean, painless, face saving break from this guy the better. And hopefully the Patriots will go back to select more character guys. It does make a difference they haven't won since they taken on more of the very questionable characters.

I'm glad this has come out now and not at the end of August or mid season,and ruin what is right now still a salvageable season.

Really thats all I care about.

 

[condon84]

I hope none of this is true, but putting himself in this position (current investigation and Florida case) just shows that this guy's judgement is extremely poor. I can't understand how someone like him, with so much going for himself, would willingly put himself in this position.

Gronk broken, Wes gone, and AHern possibly going to jail, this season just got a whole lot tougher.

 

[patsfanincleveland]

Well stated, ausbacker.

It is amusing reading all these posts on (1) the fact Hernandez should simply talk to the police and (2) how he is guilty of a murder (directly or as an accomplice) based on a few facts.

The willingness of people to tag him with a crime, on limited facts, is why people lawyer up. I believe law enforcement officers are, in general, honorable, reasonable people, but have run into my share of garden variety, judgmental morons who do not believe in the need to ask questions when forming an opinion on what 'happened' in a case. That scene from "My Cousin Vinny" with the interrogation is a metaphor for how many investigations proceed (the surprised response "I killed the clerk?" becomes the confession "I killed the clerk" at trial). Police do not have a legal duty to conduct an objective and complete investigation. They need to establish probable cause to arrest and charge. And PC is not much, so do not expect much of an investigation. Police do not and will not run down all possible scenarios when they believe they have their man, and that is how actually innocent people get convicted (by that I mean factual innocence, not people simply professing their innocence).

As for this case, we know nothing of timelines, forensics, or really anything else. Right now, you have a car in his name (good point - if you are going to kill somebody, why would you do that logically? Inform a rental company of a specific fact that ties you to a crime if you are trying to hide your involvement? Why not rent it in the names of the other guys?), a body, and two other suspects. It potentially is no more than guilt by association (which is not a crime), or it could be guilt if the facts are there. I would think if the police had a smoking gun on Hernandez, he would not just be wanted for questioning. He would be arrested and squeezed to implicate whomever the killer was believed to be. That likely means the police do not have PC on any offense on Hernandez at this point, and they are the ones conducting the investigation. The armchair police officers here who have charged and convicted him already based on media reports may want to take note of that.

This about sums it up.

Besides, it's really hard to imagine that if he did cap the poor guy.........AHern would leave the car and victim less than one mile from his house.

or........he was placed being around a guy he knows.................

One would think a typical gangbanger would be much more proficient in these matters.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

What am I missing here? If the evidence for some involvement at least is so compelling, why hasn't Hernandez been arrested or even interviewed formally? Based upon what we know, there sure seems to be enough evidence to at least question Hernandez. The fact that he hasn't yet suggests to me that his involvement is pretty minor at worst. If it was anymore serious, I can't believe he'd still be enjoying the freedom he currently is.

I'm in the UK and As an ex Police Officer, I know that, at the very least, Hernandez would have been to a Police Station if the facts are as being reported. Maybe things work differently in the US. Please enlighten me.

IF as we believe, H consulted his lawyers and invoked his 5th amendment right to remain silent there would be no point taking him to a police station unless he was being arrested. When wealthy high public profile people are involved who are not a danger to the public the DA, a political creature, usually waits until the investigation is complete and he has lots of evidence before arresting otherwise he's susceptible to wails of false arrest.

So not being arrested as of now means nothing.

We also do not do that Tower of London thing here in MA.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

Well just about anyway you slice this one. Greedell will see this as a black eye for the NFL. The team will suffer in some kind of punishment. Be it AHern getting fined/games missed or calls made that are ticky tack.

Protect the SHIELD.

You're projecting your hopes and dreams.

Totally baseless.

 

[BrickPat]

You say that, but doesn't the article say that the car returned without the suspect? Hardly his 'getaway'.

All speculation right now. There's nothing concrete or he'd be in a jail cell by now.

Nice to see the hundreds of police officers and law experts we have on this board flocking out.....

I am a police sergeant but am not a MSP Homicide Detective or assigned to a Homicide Unit (only the MSP and BPD have primary jursidiction on homicide cases).

You can't read anything into AH not being in custody but from my experience its only a matter of time. It's doubtful he would be less than cooperative if he had nothing to do with the incident. His attorney would be trying to create as much distance as possible between AH and the victim. While I do not know what is going on behind the scenes the publicly reported facts are pretty damning (texts, in vehicle with victim shortly before body discovered, etc).

There are likely other similarly troubling facts that the MSP is not dislosing for obvious reasons. Best case scenario from this point is that AH is a witness seeking immunity from any unintended involvement. At worse he was the triggerman or was on scene wherever this guy was killed. Finding the actual murder scene is crucial- from what I've read the location where the body was recovered is not where the shooting took place(?)

 

[Sivy]

I hope none of this is true, but putting himself in this position (current investigation and Florida case) just shows that this guy's judgement is extremely poor. I can't understand how someone like him, with so much going for himself, would willingly put himself in this position.

Gronk broken, Wes gone, and AHern possibly going to jail, this season just got a whole lot tougher.

Which probably means they will go 16-0

 

[vyrago]

Sad but if you hang with thugs you go down with thugs.

Its hard to believe anyone can be this stupid.

Ray Lewis says 'hello'.