Breaking News Per Schefter: Long-term contract for Hernandez!

[MoLewisrocks]

Maybe I missed it, but I haven't seen the terms yet in this thread:

Still have to see the structure. And the deal has a total value of $40M but $2.5M of that is incentives ergo the $7.5M new money average but a $5.5M average over the 7 year term of the entire deal. Gronk's deal sounded better than it was before the details on the structure were released. Then it became an exceptionally team friendly deal.

I think it's interesting that Dunn wasn't the lead negotiator...

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

Still have to see the structure. And the deal has a total value of $40M but $2.5M of that is incentives ergo the $7.5M new money average but a $5.5M average over the 7 year term of the entire deal. Gronk's deal sounded better than it was before the details on the structure were released. Then it became an exceptionally team friendly deal.

I think it's interesting that Dunn wasn't the lead negotiator...

Perhaps if this happened earlier, Gronk, AHern, and Wes could have all been done.

 

[shmessy]

Perhaps if this happened earlier, Gronk, AHern, and Wes could have all been done.

The TE's have only played the first 2 of 4 years on their initial contracts.

How "early" did you want Gronk and Ahern to be renegotiated? In the womb?

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Right there, you are confusing your current tenses and future tenses.

THAT is the problem.

The problem is Welker just turned 31 and at 30 he produced a record setting season and it was his 5th straight consistently productive one, including the one where he came back from an ACL. Brady is 35. Welker won't be 33 for 2 more seasons...

 

[MoLewisrocks]

The TE's have only played the first 2 of 4 years on their initial contracts.

How "early" did you want Gronk and Ahern to be renegotiated? In the womb?

He was talking about Dunn's partner doing this negotiation.

 

[shmessy]

The problem is Welker just turned 31 and at 30 he produced a record setting season and it was his 5th straight consistently productive one, including the one where he came back from an ACL. Brady is 35. Welker won't be 33 for 2 more seasons...

Precisely.

This one and the next when (if he makes it through this one healthy and similarly productive) he'll get tagged again.

Either way it's $21 million. He wanted it up front in spring 2012. The Pats will probably give it to him over 2 years with the second year contingent on their best judgement at that time. He'll probably get his $21 million - the Pats are just making sure they aren't wasting the money in the second year of it.

The true subject is what he is worth at age 33?

 

[Fencer]

I just hope both the TEs keep their health (reasonably well)!!

Congrats to Hernandez.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

The number I had seen was that he was looking for was $21 million guaranteed. If that wasn't it, then I stand corrected.

$9.4 million now at 31, then IF he is healthy and still performing, $11.4 million tag when he is 32 is prudent from the Pats FO IMHO. Better than guaranteeing the full $21 million in advance on a 10 year vet WR with prior ACL/MCL repair.

Except for cap purposes it isn't. And he was not reported to be looking for $21M guaranteed, that was speculated by some here an in the media because it is the total of two tags. There would be a discount for getting that level of guarantee earlier. He was believed by the more rational media to be looking for something in the $18-20M range and a 3-4 year deal, which for cap purposes would have been a lot more team friendly than the two tag approach because the dead cap would be manageable and the back end salaries - when he's 33 - could always be renegotiated due to that leverage.

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

The TE's have only played the first 2 of 4 years on their initial contracts.

How "early" did you want Gronk and Ahern to be renegotiated? In the womb?

A review of the Welker threads would show that Nostradamus...... ehh....patsfaninpittsburgh openly questioned why there wasn't a concurrent nature to negotiations..... since AHern and Wes share a common agent.

A primary reason for agent removal is displeasure with contract talk progress.

 

[PatsBoy12]

This was awesome news to wake up to this morning. I LOVE IT!!!:rocker::rocker::rocker:

 

[neuronet]

While I hope he stops dropping passes, one thing I will say: another example of classy negotiation. None of us heard about it, he never said anything, no public threats to skip training camp: he came in for practices, he played in the preseason, etc..

Very impressive from both he and Gronk.

 

[Danger Zone]

Quarterback and slot receiver are very different positions. There's a fair amount of precedent for QBs playing well into their mid-30s and beyond, and even more reason to believe that Brady would age well (his primary skills aren't particularly subject to wear-and-tear/aging). The same can't be said for Welker. Not a knock on him, and I still hope that the Pats can find a way to re-up Welker, but in that context it's pretty easy to understand why Hernandez is a higher priority.

What is it about this point that you just can't seem to get your head around, Ivan?

Quick, agile, cut-on-a-dime slot receivers are up against the age-bubble much, much earlier than pocket quarterbacks.

Brady could be playing with a walker and still only lose 25% of his usual mobility (I kid).


Good news for the team and for Hernandez. He deserves it.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

While I hope he stops dropping passes, one thing I will say: another example of classy negotiation. None of us heard about it, he never said anything, no public threats to skip training camp: he came in for practices, he played in the preseason, etc..

Very impressive from both he and Gronk.

You're getting a little carried away. Neither was in position to threaten or skip, they were entering their 3rd year of 4 year deals and could have been fined for more than they were scheduled to earn. I'm impressed each was willing to take the bird in hand deal. The next or true test will come if once the guaranteed money is gone they are fine with playing out 5 years on salary only or are willing to do an even friendlier third deal that will also have a backend....

 

[West Philly Patriot]

What is it about this point that you just can't seem to get your head around, Ivan?

Quick, agile, cut-on-a-dime slot receivers are up against the age-bubble much, much earlier than pocket quarterbacks.

Brady could be playing with a walker and still only lose 25% of his usual mobility (I kid).


Good news for the team and for Hernandez. He deserves it.

Because its overblown, only 3 or 4 QB's in the modern era have had meaningful success and only one has actually won anything. That one probably being the worst statistically of them all.

 

[neuronet]

You're getting a little carried away. Neither was in position to threaten or skip, they were entering their 3rd year of 4 year deals and could have been fined for more than they were scheduled to earn. .

Hmm...so Revis is the anomaly, they are the norm? :bricks:

 

[Danger Zone]

Hmm...so Revis is the anomaly, they are the norm? :bricks:

Normal for the Jests. Anomaly for the Patriots.

 

[Huckleberry1]

What is it about this point that you just can't seem to get your head around, Ivan?

Quick, agile, cut-on-a-dime slot receivers are up against the age-bubble much, much earlier than pocket quarterbacks.

Brady could be playing with a walker and still only lose 25% of his usual mobility (I kid).


Good news for the team and for Hernandez. He deserves it.

What is it that you don't understand? When a player is continually getting better, which Welker has been, they aren't getting worse, despite the claims of those who want to make that argument. They made it before last season for the exact same reasons and he had one of the best seasons any receiver has ever had. When you claim a player is going to get worse for a set of reasons, and they get better, then coming back with the exact same argument a year later is complete bullsh.t, and those making it should be embarrased by it.

the Welker bashers should be admitting they were 100% wrong, and then shutting their pieholes, instead they are even more adamant they are right despite being proven completely wrong, it doesn't get more screwed up than that. It's no different than all the clowns who bashed Brady for years as a system QB, who could never match the numbers they have been proven wrong 100% of the time, and although they can continue to make those claims it will never make them right.

 

[ATippett56]

He may be speculating as I do that Chung will go away on FA leaving it a position of need.

Right now it looks as if OT, safety, maybe OC and certainly a fast large WR are positions of need for 2013.

Kyle Arrington will probably cost alot more in unrestricted free agency than Patrick Chung due to the nature of the defensive position.

Positions of need for the 2013 NFL Draft include the following:

OG - if Brian Waters retires
OT - if Sebastian Vollmer's back is not miraculously cured
DT - if Ron Brace and Myron Pryor depart via unrestricted free agency
CB - if Kyle Arrington departs via unrestricted free agency

With regards to the wide receiver position for the New England Patriots during the 2013-14 NFL Season:

Welker
Lloyd
Gaffney
Ebert/Edelman
??????
Slater

 

[ivanvamp]

Other than wide receiver, the offense is flush with young players. I grant you that the guard position would drop off from All Pro to "meh" status if the youth played, but the youth is there. When you look by position

RB - Vereen, Ridley, Woodhead, Demps
TE - Gronk, Hernandez, Fells
OT - Vollmer, Solder, Cannon
OG - TBD (Thomas, McDonald, Wendell)
QB - Mallett (backup behind the GOAT)

it's actually a very young offense.

Dues, the entire team is flush with young talent. They have done an amazing job at restocking/rebuilding/reloading without a significant dropoff in performance.

 

[shmessy]

What is it that you don't understand? When a player is continually getting better, which Welker has been, they aren't getting worse, despite the claims of those who want to make that argument. They made it before last season for the exact same reasons and he had one of the best seasons any receiver has ever had. When you claim a player is going to get worse for a set of reasons, and they get better, then coming back with the exact same argument a year later is complete bullsh.t, and those making it should be embarrased by it.

For some reason, you cannot get beyond whatever is keeping you from understanding what people are writing here..

No one is denying his abilities in 2012 and (if healthy 2013). Do I think he is worth somewhere north of $7 million in 2012 and (if healthy) 2013? You betcha.

The question is what is his worth in 2014 and beyond. The vast majority here, evidently, feel it is an arguable point.

You, evidently, feel the Patriots should pay top dollar for his potential 2014 and beyond.