Expectations For Sterling Moore Next Year??

[PatsFan2]

McCourty probably wouldn't have even seen the ball. Got to give props to Moore for locating it and then swatting.

I know the McCourty last year was giving possession receivers 10 yards cushions.

 

[patsinthesnow]

One of my binkys on the team, there have been numerous arguments about him already, but I'll rehash why I like him.

1. You can't teach playmaking. His coverage skills are lacking on corner and fly routes, but he sure can cover curl and hitch routes. You can improve someone's coverage skills slightly, but not their playmaking.

2. In the four games he's had decent playing time, he's made plays in all of them. (Buffalo-2 INTs, huge hit, Broncos-pair of pass defended, Ravens-two pass defended at end of game, stopped a bomb, Giants-ended 3 drives, had a fumble negated) Meanwhile, what has the #1 CB on this team done in these games, nothing.

3. The Superbowl performance noone talks about. Moore gave up 4 catches for about 60-70 yards. He ended three drives on 3rd and 10, 3rd and 10, and 3rd and 5, on physical plays that were borderline PI. The one main catch he gave up was a perfect throw that should've been intercepted if we had a safety with any type of ball skills. Instead Chung was late, and game over.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCcJmpNQMUk
0:18,3:25, 6:12
---------------------------------------------------------

Now, who knows what he'll become or if he'll even make the team with how loaded we are at CB. But put him at dimeback, he'll make plays.

 

[Marqui]

Define breakout? He's got a lot of competition and probably won't see many significant reps unless there are injuries.

Breakout: I think there will be tons of injuries to the defensive backfield, like there are every year, giving Moore and chance to show his improvement from last year and play at a relatively high level.

 

[patsinthesnow]

Wow, you knocked both McCourty and Chung in one post. Even though you're right the board is still going to flip its **** with you even remotely suggesting that McCourty and Chung have flaws.

I know. I like both players, but Mccourty was frustrating as hell last year, and Chung is an average safety that's good in the box but poor in coverage.

Super Bowl XLVI (46): Manningham Amazing Catch (HD) - YouTube

You be the judge who's fault that was, look at Chung.

 

[patfanken]

Not to be argumentative, but I don't really think playing 3 years of HS instead of 1 would make him a more consistent player.

Well you ARE being argumentative. Not only that, you are wrong as well. Having played 3+ years less football than 95% of the players in the league could very well indicate that Moore has more room to grow before he reaches his potential. Maybe not, but you certainly can't definitively claim that he hasn't.

I'm not sure why being a player who is beat often but is not totally incompetant gets called 'flashing skills'.

Andy, Andy, Andy. I would have thought that it would have become clear to a football expert like yourself that DBs are beaten on average of over 60% of the time in today's NFL. So singling out Moore is hardly fair, especially when you consider he was an UDFA, came to the team late, had no off season or TC to learn the system. Like the majority of DBs in the league he did some good things and looked bad as well.

Anyone on a 90 man roster can make a play here or there but most lack the ABILITY to do it consistently.

You are correct here. I'd say fully 75 of the current 90 man roster have similar athletic skills relative to their positions. They are all good enough to make the team athletically. What will determine who actually makes it. will be a matter of metal toughness, dependability, and the ability to improve their game over time. And frankly, Andy, you have NO idea, whether Moore will be among those who rise to the occasion or be gone in September....and neither do I. You are just making an assumption.that I'm not willing to make at this time.

A good example with this player is that he can make a play by overcompensating in one area, leading to being horrendous on the double move. That's not really inconsistency, its just not being good enough to handle the job wthout overplaying one way or the other. I may be wrong, but that's what I saw.

You aren't wrong in what you saw....just in the conclusion you made. The fact Moore was beaten on a double move is disappointing, but certainly not unexpected for a rookie CB with Moore's resume'. It wouldn't be surprising for it to happen to a rookie CB with a pedigree resume'. Double moves often beat the best DBs. Why when it happens to Moore, does it disqualify him for future consideration. HOWEVER what was encouraging was that he had to mental toughness to recover from being beaten and applied what he had been coached to do, and stripped the ball

I also should point out that my perspective is influenced by the fact that I make no adjustment for "unexpected", "surprise" or "exceeding expectations". How they play is how they play.

So are you attempting to elevate yourself above the rest of us, by designating yourself as a "hard grader"? Because based on this statement you are allowing no room for a player's improvement. Or have you already concluded that Moore simply can't improve his game.

So I guess our disagreement is focused not so much on what Moore did last season, though you focus on the bad, and I the good, but rather a different view of what his POTENTIAL can be for THIS season. You don't see much chance for enough improvement for him to earn a roster spot, and I see it as a distinct possibility.

BTW- after all is said and done, lets remember that we ARE just debating about a guy who is likely gong to be one of the last 2 DB's on the roster, even if he makes the team.

 

[pork3]

Super Bowl XLVI (46): Manningham Amazing Catch (HD) - YouTube

You be the judge who's fault that was, look at Chung.

Ugh, I had to force back down some wretched vomit after watching that video. Fwcking Giants...

-Jamman

 

[Ring 6]

Well you ARE being argumentative. Not only that, you are wrong as well. Having played 3+ years less football than 95% of the players in the league could very well indicate that Moore has more room to grow before he reaches his potential. Maybe not, but you certainly can't definitively claim that he hasn't.

I wasn't being argumentative, hence me saying so, which means I accept your point, but do not agree. That is the epitome of not making a definitive claim, which you accuse me of here.

Andy, Andy, Andy. I would have thought that it would have become clear to a football expert like yourself that DBs are beaten on average of over 60% of the time in today's NFL. So singling out Moore is hardly fair,

By your argument since 60% of passes are completed 100% of getting beaten becomes acceptable. I am not singling him out, I am discussing his coverage since he is the subject of the discussion, and his coverage is poor. Sorry if you feel that is mean or unfair to him to state.

especially when you consider he was an UDFA, came to the team late, had no off season or TC to learn the system. Like the majority of DBs in the league he did some good things and looked bad as well.

I am very clear in stating my standpoint that I do not care if a player is the first pick in the draft or an UDFA, once the ball is snapped they must play, and be judge equally.
You are saying you shouldn't hold bad plays against him because he didn't make the Raiders, got cut off their practice squad and therefore got here late? OK I guess.
And yes he did some things well, and some not so well. Can you truly say the amount of good vs bad was better than many corners? You can't evaluate by saying everyone makes bad plays so everyone who makes any bad plays are all the same.

You are correct here. I'd say fully 75 of the current 90 man roster have similar athletic skills relative to their positions. They are all good enough to make the team athletically. What will determine who actually makes it. will be a matter of metal toughness, dependability, and the ability to improve their game over time. And frankly, Andy, you have NO idea, whether Moore will be among those who rise to the occasion or be gone in September....and neither do I. You are just making an assumption.that I'm not willing to make at this time.

Then why are you posted in a thread about the expectations for the player if your answer is you have no idea what to expect and are unwilling to make the assumptins that are necessary in having expectations?
It seems like you are talking in circles now.

You aren't wrong in what you saw....just in the conclusion you made

.

The fact Moore was beaten on a double move is disappointing, but certainly not unexpected for a rookie CB with Moore's resume'.

So how many points do we get back because our defense had a guy that was expected to get beaten?
Once the ball is snapped, you have to make plays not say its acceptable because of your resume.

It wouldn't be surprising for it to happen to a rookie CB with a pedigree resume'. Double moves often beat the best DBs. Why when it happens to Moore, does it disqualify him for future consideration.

Frequency

HOWEVER what was encouraging was that he had to mental toughness to recover from being beaten and applied what he had been coached to do, and stripped the ball

We have very different ideas of mental toughness

So are you attempting to elevate yourself above the rest of us, by designating yourself as a "hard grader"?

Ken, do you post in order to try to influence people's opinion about you? That is awfully phony. 100% of the time I say what I mean and could not care less about 'elevating' myself.
I said this because many people use that as a reasoning, especially with this player, and I am being clear that I put no value on that.

Because based on this statement you are allowing no room for a player's improvement. Or have you already concluded that Moore simply can't improve his game.

Thats not what I am saying at all. I am saying I do not sugar coat how he play by excusing poor play because he was an UDFA.

So I guess our disagreement is focused not so much on what Moore did last season, though you focus on the bad, and I the good, but rather a different view of what his POTENTIAL can be for THIS season. You don't see much chance for enough improvement for him to earn a roster spot, and I see it as a distinct possibility.

A minute ago you said you have absolutely no idea, and won't make any assumptions about he will play this year. It seems you change to suit the arguemnt.

BTW- after all is said and done, lets remember that we ARE just debating about a guy who is likely gong to be one of the last 2 DB's on the roster, even if he makes the team.

I'm not really debating. I have my opinion, which I am stating. I can accept people seeing it differently. I just think seeing a good player in Moore is blindly optimistic and using the play he was burned and got a lucky slap out on is a prime example.

 

[Brady_to_Moss]

Expectations aren't high..just get in there when called upon and to have him do what he did last year..which was a pretty good job

 

[BlueThunder]

Moore was a pleasant surprise last year. Not spectacular, but has a nose for the ball. A full set of OTA's and mini camp along with TC will either prove he belongs as a DB or not on this roster.

Sounds like some people here want to be the Alpha male

 

[Ive_Killed_People]

I predict he has a sterling year and no matter what happens I will be right.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

I happened to listen to this clip yesterday because Bedard was on with Gresh and Zo. Thought about posting it then didn't get around to it. But it kind of fits here since he spent a lot of time on the defense and the secondary in particular. Agreed with Zo that it's 4-3 base plus from here on out based on personnel (and pending injuries).

He likes Moore to make the roster as at least a nickle corner in sub packages.

He thinks Dowling is key to what they do this season. If he's healthy and as good as he thinks they believe he can be, he sees him starting at RCB and possibly switching to LCB depending on who else emerges (maybe Arrington retains his RCB slot although he thinks he's a better slot corner - which is where Moore and Dowling were featured last week) because they want to play press outside and that isn't McCourty's strength. Sees him ultimately as an upgrade at FS and feels that was the position that killed them and the secondary last year. As did injuries in the front 7. Thinks they have a lot of plans relative to sub packages - which he sees them in 60-70% of the time that they would prefer to feature Gregory in as opposed to FS which he can play. Said he thinks Wilson will fill more of a game plan role as well and he sees him as a better Ihedibo and utimately a TE killer. He's on the fence about Dennard. Says he has some real ball skills but the body type (undersized safety) makes him a tough read. He thinks Trevor Scott can be a better Anderson and fill the elephant role (rotating with Cunningham).

Also said that Boyer cautioned him that what the media saw as far as roles in OTA's is just a fraction of the usage they have employed for each guy this off season.

Also had some observations on the offense at the end and said Lloyd could play in this offense tomorrow. Raved about his hands and about his savvy. He also likes Ebert to make the roster. Says after watching much NW film he sees him as a polished WR with better position skills than Edleman, although he doesn't know if he can replace his value in the return game. And he likes Davis size in a crowded field. Overall a good listen.

CBS Audio Player

 

[PatsBoy12]

I happened to listen to this clip yesterday because Bedard was on with Gresh and Zo. Thought about posting it then didn't get around to it. But it kind of fits here since he spent a lot of time on the defense and the secondary in particular. Agreed with Zo that it's 4-3 base plus from here on out based on personnel (and pending injuries).

He likes Moore to make the roster as at least a nickle corner in sub packages.

He thinks Dowling is key to what they do this season. If he's healthy and as good as he thinks they believe he can be, he sees him starting at RCB and possibly switching to LCB depending on who else emerges (maybe Arrington retains his RCB slot although he thinks he's a better slot corner - which is where Moore and Dowling were featured last week) because they want to play press outside and that isn't McCourty's strength. Sees him ultimately as an upgrade at FS and feels that was the position that killed them and the secondary last year. As did injuries in the front 7. Thinks they have a lot of plans relative to sub packages - which he sees them in 60-70% of the time that they would prefer to feature Gregory in as opposed to FS which he can play. Said he thinks Wilson will fill more of a game plan role as well and he sees him as a better Ihedibo and utimately a TE killer. He's on the fence about Dennard. Says he has some real ball skills but the body type (undersized safety) makes him a tough read. He thinks Trevor Scott can be a better Anderson and fill the elephant role (rotating with Cunningham).

Also said that Boyer cautioned him that what the media saw as far as roles in OTA's is just a fraction of the usage they have employed for each guy this off season.

Also had some observations on the offense at the end and said Lloyd could play in this offense tomorrow. Raved about his hands and about his savvy. He also likes Ebert to make the roster. Says after watching much NW film he sees him as a polished WR with better position skills than Edleman, although he doesn't know if he can replace his value in the return game. And he likes Davis size in a crowded field. Overall a good listen.

CBS Audio Player

This was a good read. Thanks for posting it an the link.