Upgrading the LT position....

[Ring 6]

Totally agree there

But different criteria were used to evaluate the LT/RT positions...

I guess if the data is bogus, then there's a case....

Are there any other sites that rate the OL...shoot me a link....

BTW..I checked out Footballoutsiders and they have run blocking but not pass blocking criteria for OL

There is no reliability in analysis done by people who do not know what they are looking at.

 

[Ring 6]

This was happening a lot with Connolly, especially at the start of the year. Light and Koppen looked far worse than they were actually playing, because they were forced to cover for Connolly a lot. Connolly's play was more solid on the right side, whether do to that being his preference, or due to having gotten more game experience prior to the switch.



You're overrating the "all 22" requirement for line play, IMO.

Yeah right, the LT will ignore his man to help the LG
We get that you have something against Connolly, if you think you are right why do you need to make things up?

 

[supafly]

Matt Light may not be the best LT in the NFL but he is still the best tackle that the Pats have right now. Vollmer at LT would have struggled mightily.

I agree that there would certainly be a decent learning curve involved with Vollmer at LT, but if that's what it comes down to then I think we will fine. I don't know what everyone thinks, but there's always the possibility that Solder could be thrown into the fire immediately, while keeping Vollmer at RT, as to not upset 2 positions. I'm sure Belichick will adjust accordingly with quicker passes, more runs, keeping a TE or 2 on that side, etc. This isn't his first time dealing with an issue like this, far from it...

Regardless, I do hope that Light stays, just b/c he is the most efficient right now, and has the experience etc. But we all said we'd rather have Mankins sign if it was one or the other, so I'd much rather see that IF indeed it ends up being one or the other (which we have nothing to base that on).

 

[RayClay]

Matt Light may not be the best LT in the NFL but he is still the best tackle that the Pats have right now. Vollmer at LT would have struggled mightily.

Except Vollmer has played left tackle and did not struggle mightily.

You're saying with additional experience he will?

 

[spacecrime]

Except Vollmer has played left tackle and did not struggle mightily.

You're saying with additional experience he will?

I think he means that without someone like Ben Watson being used as a sixth Olinesman to Vollmer's left every play, Vollmer might not be so effective.

Nothing wrong with Matt Light. I don't think he'll be back, but there is no reason why a rookie can't start at LT. Light did.

 

[RayClay]

I think he means that without someone like Ben Watson being used as a sixth Olinesman to Vollmer's left every play, Vollmer might not be so effective.

Nothing wrong with Matt Light. I don't think he'll be back, but there is no reason why a rookie can't start at LT. Light did.

Of course Vollmer was a raw rookie, not having played much football, but i thought he was very surprising.

Hope you're not implying Light didn't have lots of tight end help during his career.

Not saying raw rookie beats seasoned veteran, but to say he would struggle mightily with two years under his belt does a real disservice to the level he played and plays at for someone still learning.

 

[ay-yo]

Regardless of your thoughts on PFF I'd like to hear how some poster think Matt Light ranks among other LT in the League. This isn't meant to be my list I just took the names from the PFF link for discussions sake.

Jake Long MIA
Andrew Whitworth CIN
D'Brickashaw Ferguson NYJ
Joe Thomas CLE
Doug Free DAL
Jordan Gross CAR
Jason Peters PHI
Ryan Clady DEN
Russell Okung SEA
Bryant McKinnie MIN
Chad Clifton GB
Duane Brown HST
Rodger Saffold SL
Jeff Backus DET
Barry Sims SF
Branden Albert KC
Michael Oher BAL
Joe Staley SF
Matt Light NE
Jermon Bushrod NO
Michael Roos TEN

Just looking at the list of names I wouldn't say Light is a top 10 LT any more.

 

[supafly]

Regardless of your thoughts on PFF I'd like to hear how some poster think Matt Light ranks among other LT in the League. This isn't meant to be my list I just took the names from the PFF link for discussions sake.

Jake Long MIA
Andrew Whitworth CIN
D'Brickashaw Ferguson NYJ
Joe Thomas CLE
Doug Free DAL
Jordan Gross CAR
Jason Peters PHI
Ryan Clady DEN
Russell Okung SEA
Bryant McKinnie MIN
Chad Clifton GB
Duane Brown HST
Rodger Saffold SL
Jeff Backus DET
Barry Sims SF
Branden Albert KC
Michael Oher BAL
Joe Staley SF
Matt Light NE
Jermon Bushrod NO
Michael Roos TEN

Just looking at the list of names I wouldn't say Light is a top 10 LT any more.

I agree for sure, but he is still our best present option due to his experience, and knowledge of the system. I think the team is fine either way.

 

[DarrylS]

I agree for sure, but he is still our best present option due to his experience, and knowledge of the system. I think the team is fine either way.

The Soler pick is a replacement for Light, but with this labor situation it is a huge jump for a college LT to jump to a starting LT in the NFL. Soler has not had the opportunity for OTA's, hanging with the other Pat Players to understand the NFL and Patriot Culture and will be a work in progress..

IMO the Soler pick was a pick made with the labor situation in mind, he does not have to step in on day 1... we can make sure he is ready.

If and when this labor situation is over, need to sign Light for a couple of more years.. and he can "bridge" Soler.

 

[Don Kipines]

Matt Light may not be the best LT in the NFL but he is still the best tackle that the Pats have right now. Vollmer at LT would have struggled mightily.

Wow, Sebastian Vollmer looked pretty damn good handling Dwight Freeney a few years ago. I wouldn't have lost sleep with Vollmer at LT at all. If Solder's that kind of player, I think we're in good shape.

 

[Shelterdog]

I think he means that without someone like Ben Watson being used as a sixth Olinesman to Vollmer's left every play, Vollmer might not be so effective.

Nothing wrong with Matt Light. I don't think he'll be back, but there is no reason why a rookie can't start at LT. Light did.

There's no question that every year a few rookies start at LT and do ok. Will Solder be one of those guys? I have no idea. He is a 6'8" athletic first team all american, the Pats have done pretty well drafting OL high, there are rumors that the Giants and Colts were looking at Solder and they're solid organizations as well, the draftniks gave Solder pretty good ratings, but he's not a perfect LT prospect (he would have gone top five if he were) and until we see him on the field there's really no way to tell.

 

[Rob0729]

I think he means that without someone like Ben Watson being used as a sixth Olinesman to Vollmer's left every play, Vollmer might not be so effective.

Nothing wrong with Matt Light. I don't think he'll be back, but there is no reason why a rookie can't start at LT. Light did.

Personally, I think this is going to be a lost season for most rookies in the NFL. Every rookie is already way behind where they should be because many don't even have their playbooks yet, nevermind the fact that they have missed rookie camps, minicamps, and OTAs.

Because of this, I expect Light to be back for at least one more year. Solder could replace him at some point in the season, but he (and every other rookie) have a lot of catching up to do when the lockout finally ends. To think the Pats will go into the season with him as the annoited starter with no viable plan B is a little premature. Light will be back if for nothing more than insurance if Solder isn't ready day one.

BTW, if I remember correctly, Light didn't start the first game of his rookie season and only got the role because the people in front of him sucked so bad. But then again, it is one thing for a team coming off a 5-11 season to start the season with a rookie LT and a team coming off a 14-2 season with the best QB in the NFL going into the season with a rookie LT who has had no offseason contact with the team due to the lockout.

 

[Oswlek]

Of course Vollmer was a raw rookie, not having played much football, but i thought he was very surprising.

Hope you're not implying Light didn't have lots of tight end help during his career.

Not saying raw rookie beats seasoned veteran, but to say he would struggle mightily with two years under his belt does a real disservice to the level he played and plays at for someone still learning.

Especially when Vollmer didn't have TE help as often as people seem to recall. Even against Freeney, he was 1:1 probably about 40% of the time. Even as late as 2003, Light still needed constant help against Dwight it it was on a carpet.

 

[AzPatsFan]

Personally, I think this is going to be a lost season for most rookies in the NFL. Every rookie is already way behind where they should be because many don't even have their playbooks yet, nevermind the fact that they have missed rookie camps, minicamps, and OTAs.

Because of this, I expect Light to be back for at least one more year. Solder could replace him at some point in the season, but he (and every other rookie) have a lot of catching up to do when the lockout finally ends. To think the Pats will go into the season with him as the annoited starter with no viable plan B is a little premature. Light will be back if for nothing more than insurance if Solder isn't ready day one.

BTW, if I remember correctly, Light didn't start the first game of his rookie season and only got the role because the people in front of him sucked so bad. But then again, it is one thing for a team coming off a 5-11 season to start the season with a rookie LT and a team coming off a 14-2 season with the best QB in the NFL going into the season with a rookie LT who has had no offseason contact with the team due to the lockout.

I don't think Light started until mid season of his rookie season. But the Pat's would not be wholly dependent on Solder right from the the start. Levoir has started a few games and Kaczur still under contract, played LT for a year while Light was injured. Either or both could fill in until Solder is ready, if he is not ready Game 1.

Ideally re-signing Light would make sense. That would free Kaczur as a general swingman, or to take Neal's RG spot relegating Connolly to swing Guard. That makes sense for a Team that is Superbowl bound.

 

[Frick]

I'm in favor of it.

 

[bucky]

Matt Light > PFF

 

[BlueThunder]

I believe some people have mentioned the responsibilities of the players along the OL and, not knowing the design of each play, how PFF can evaluate the OT performance. While I can agree that some of the evals PFF performs are pretty subjective...( I don't see Brady being rated as low as he is in their analysis)...I don't see how the OT position can be that far out of whack....

Light had Mankins as his OG helping out on at least half of his plays.....and didn't Connolly fill in fairly nicely when Mankins was not with the team? After all...they did go 14-2 and had a low sack number and high scoring offense.

I've seen Light get beaten like a drum on alot of plays...he's lucky Brady is as good as he is in the pocket...Light, on any other team, would probably be very very mediocre...and we might get to see that if there is a season this coming year...

JMHO

 

[cstjohn17]

Matt Light was an all time Patriot, maybe he will never make the Patriot HOF but he will get considered. Played LT on 3 championship teams and the greatest offense in NFL history but...

The Patriots would rather get rid of a player a year too soon than two years too late. Mike Vrabel, Willie McGinest say Hi.

 

[patfanken]

This is a ridiculous thread. ANYTHING done by a pure amateur who CLEARLY doesn't understand the game (given his other absurd pronouncements) should be routinely ignored, NOT given a 4 (currently) page thread.

Finally the absurdity is compounded by people commenting on the validity of judging success or failure of a player based on a TV feed. To even THINK you can do this is the height of hubris. Here are a few thing you are missing EVEN if you are lucky enough to see the LT (in this case) for the entire play, vs a position coach grading off a coach's tape.

You DON'T KNOW the play or the individual assignments
You DON'T KNOW how what the Defense does affects or changes those original assignments
You CAN'T see how another person's play my affect the person you are grading.

(for example if the OG misses his assignment it could result in the OT being left with 2 guys to block and the failure of the play being laid at his feet. Meanwhile the OG having successfully blocked a man (albeit the wrong one) would be given a good grade by the observer who didn't know the play/assignments/adjustments

To think that the Broadcast feed could give ANYONE more than a cursory, superficial view of an individual's play is ludicrous. AT BEST all it gives us is a fan's "impression" of events. Yet sites like PFF report that "impression" as fact, which is almost as ridiculous as this thread.

 

[BlueThunder]

Glad I could help you vent Patsfranken