Updated Patriots 3-4 OLB Types

[Ochmed Jones]

Players left on my draft board:

Quinn 6'5" 270 (1st round grade) Perfect fit for our defense, probably won't make it past Houston.

Kerrigan Purdeue 6'4" 267 (1st round grade) But looks more like a 4-3 DE than a 3-4 OLB. I think Jacksonville is locked and loaded on him at #16, if they pass on a QB.

Sheard Pittsburgh 6'3" 264 (2nd round grade) Could sneek into the first round given his explosive first step. Currently our pick at #33 on my latest mock.

Reed Arizona 6'3" 263 (2nd round grade) If only he was a better run defender.

Acho Texas 6'2" 262 (3rd round grade) Strictly a sub package pass rusher.

Keiser Stanford 6'5" 244 (4th round grade) My Sleeper candidate especially if he can get his weight and strength up. I really miss Woicik already.

Romeus Putsburgh 6'5" 264 (5th round grade) Will need an injury red shirt year.

Elmore Arizona 6'5" 255 (5th round grade) If only the production matched his measurables.

 

[MaineMan]

Players left on my draft board:

Quinn 6'5" 270 (1st round grade) Perfect fit for our defense, probably won't make it past Houston.

Kerrigan Purdeue 6'4" 267 (1st round grade) But looks more like a 4-3 DE than a 3-4 OLB. I think Jacksonville is locked and loaded on him at #16, if they pass on a QB.

Sheard Pittsburgh 6'3" 264 (2nd round grade) Could sneek into the first round given his explosive first step. Currently our pick at #33 on my latest mock.

Reed Arizona 6'3" 263 (2nd round grade) If only he was a better run defender.

Acho Texas 6'2" 262 (3rd round grade) Strictly a sub package pass rusher.

Keiser Stanford 6'5" 244 (4th round grade) My Sleeper candidate especially if he can get his weight and strength up. I really miss Woicik already.

Romeus Putsburgh 6'5" 264 (5th round grade) Will need an injury red shirt year.

Elmore Arizona 6'5" 255 (5th round grade) If only the production matched his measurables.

Why would Quinn "not make it past Houston?"

 

[Brady2Welker]

I really don't like Quinn in the 3-4. He has the size to play it, but I think of him more of a 4-3 end. I just think hes more natural there.

No Aldon Smith?

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

I really don't like Quinn in the 3-4. He has the size to play it, but I think of him more of a 4-3 end. I just think hes more natural there.

No Aldon Smith?

No Aldon Smith.

Von Miller -- unlikely to be available.
Ryan Kerrigan -- unlikely NE will draft a conversion project before he's scooped up by someone needing an edge rush.
J.J. Watt -- He appears to be athletic enough, perhaps whatever BB had planned for Julius Peppers could be used with someone else? Low probability for BB to draft him.
Jabaal Sheard -- I have concerns about his athleticism for OLB which preclude me from looking at him in the early second, but I might take a flyer later in the second.
Brooks Reed -- second round.
Brandon Bair -- power forward type of OLB in the Willie Mac tradition, fifth round.
Karl Klug -- sixth/seventh round.
Ryan Winterswyk -- seventh round.
D'Aundre Reed -- seventh round.
Bruce Miller -- seventh round.
Josh McNary -- UDFA.

 

[Brady2Welker]

No Aldon Smith.

Von Miller -- unlikely to be available.
Ryan Kerrigan -- unlikely NE will draft a conversion project before he's scooped up by someone needing an edge rush.
J.J. Watt -- He appears to be athletic enough, perhaps whatever BB had planned for Julius Peppers could be used with someone else? Low probability for BB to draft him.
Jabaal Sheard -- I have concerns about his athleticism for OLB which preclude me from looking at him in the early second, but I might take a flyer later in the second.
Brooks Reed -- second round.
Brandon Bair -- power forward type of OLB in the Willie Mac tradition, fifth round.
Karl Klug -- sixth/seventh round.
Ryan Winterswyk -- seventh round.
D'Aundre Reed -- seventh round.
Bruce Miller -- seventh round.
Josh McNary -- UDFA.

So we can draft Brooks "Just learning WTF a scheme is" Reed but Aldon Smith is a no-go? Honestly, that's pretty damn stupid.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

So we can draft Brooks "Just learning WTF a scheme is" Reed but Aldon Smith is a no-go? Honestly, that's pretty damn stupid.

You hurted my feelings.

Having watched both players in games last season, I have a second round grade on both. If Smith is still there in the mid-second (which most of his fan club seem convinced will not happen), talk to me then. Until that time, I go with the kid I didn't see replaced in the red zone in crunch time. It's my lying eyes you know. :snob:

 

[Brady2Welker]

You hurted my feelings.

Having watched both players in games last season, I have a second round grade on both. If Smith is still there in the mid-second (which most of his fan club seem convinced will not happen), talk to me then. Until that time, I go with the kid I didn't see replaced in the red zone in crunch time. It's my lying eyes you know. :snob:

If he has a second round grade shouldn't he at least be somewhere on the list? I don't get the Quinn love. Someone explain it to me. He's got good size and that's about it. His explosion numbers aren't great at all.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

If he has a second round grade shouldn't he at least be somewhere on the list? I don't get the Quinn love. Someone explain it to me. He's got good size and that's about it. His explosion numbers aren't great at all.

He may have a second round grade, but there's also the question of "fit." I'd reconsider him if he fell to the second, but I'd probably answer myself the same way - I don't like the "fit."

Since you're probably going to ask; my impression was a young man who had not yet grown into his body and was a risk to grow out of his drafted position. I also saw a very raw player, one who was coming out 'at least' a year too early. I know he was playing hurt coming off a broken fibula, I tried to credit him there. In the end, I saw a player who needed more TLC, and carried more risk, than I believe NE is willing to consider in round one (where most have him projected), or round two where the draft advisory committee projected him.

As for Quinn, I never saw him rush off the edge, apparently those who have are having a hard time looking past that at his other skill set for OLB. All I can add is his Combine performance strongly suggested a kid who spent his down time focusing on what he does well, and not so much what he needed to improve. No Quinn on my board.

 

[MaineMan]

No Aldon Smith.

Von Miller -- unlikely to be available.
Ryan Kerrigan -- unlikely NE will draft a conversion project before he's scooped up by someone needing an edge rush.
J.J. Watt -- He appears to be athletic enough, perhaps whatever BB had planned for Julius Peppers could be used with someone else? Low probability for BB to draft him.
Jabaal Sheard -- I have concerns about his athleticism for OLB which preclude me from looking at him in the early second, but I might take a flyer later in the second.
Brooks Reed -- second round.
Brandon Bair -- power forward type of OLB in the Willie Mac tradition, fifth round.
Karl Klug -- sixth/seventh round.
Ryan Winterswyk -- seventh round.
D'Aundre Reed -- seventh round.
Bruce Miller -- seventh round.
Josh McNary -- UDFA.

Acho?

(.... leaving the door wide open for you....)

 

[mgteich]

I don't like Quinn for us, but no matter, we won't be trading up to get him

I agree with Aldon Smith being a second rounder, but I might take him there. But again, it doesn't matter since he won't be available for my second round board (really 28-64).

 

[Ochmed Jones]

So we can draft Brooks "Just learning WTF a scheme is" Reed but Aldon Smith is a no-go? Honestly, that's pretty damn stupid.

Smith does not make my board because

1.) he is a one year wonder.
2.) Not enough tape for me to gert a comfort level with him.

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

Today in his workout Cameron Heyward ran a 40 in 4.95 and had a 35 verticle leap.

Lots to like about him,even with the Tommy John medical situation

Not sure if he is going to be an OLB or a DE wherever he goes

 

[Ochmed Jones]

Today in his workout Cameron Heyward ran a 40 in 4.95 and had a 35 verticle leap.

Lots to like about him,even with the Tommy John medical situation

Not sure if he is going to be an OLB or a DE wherever he goes

I think Heyward is a pure 3-4 DE. He is excellent against the run. Really able to lock the arms and control the tackles. Has good lateral agility and we know BB loves that.

 

[Metaphors]

No Aldon Smith.
J.J. Watt -- He appears to be athletic enough
Jabaal Sheard -- I have concerns about his athleticism for OLB
Brandon Bair -- power forward type of OLB in the Willie Mac tradition, fifth round.
Karl Klug -- sixth/seventh round.

I'm not sure how you reconcile these perspectives. You don't like A.Smith as a fit, but see Bair (a linear, plodding DT) as a Willie Mac (elite, athletic DE) type. You don't like conversion types early but will take guys that can't spell OLB later. You don't like Sheard's athleticism early but will take Klug (high effort guy with a skill set that may not translate to NFL) later. I understand the opportunity costs of drafting early, but the guys you are actually drafting early better be amazing for your overall plan to make sense.

I guess I can understand this if you consider the current OLB candidates to be sufficient or if you think FA will eventually bring some upgrades. But if you think Bair or Klug or any of the other day 3 guys you mentioned are a good bet to raise the bar on defense, you are either mad or a mad genius.

 

[VJCPatriot]

I guess I can understand this if you consider the current OLB candidates to be sufficient or if you think FA will eventually bring some upgrades. But if you think Bair or Klug or any of the other day 3 guys you mentioned are a good bet to raise the bar on defense, you are either mad or a mad genius.

Isn't that the entire reason to rate them as later round values? He's not rating Klug a 1st or even a second. I don't get what the problem is.

 

[Metaphors]

Isn't that the entire reason to rate them as later round values? He's not rating Klug a 1st or even a second. I don't get what the problem is.

No problem at all. Just that the earlier round candidates were either not on the board, dismissed or rated at a level where they will likely already be gone...end result being that OLB will be addressed with later picks. I don't even have a problem with that but his binkies (Klug and Bair) seem unlikely to make much of a difference besides being back of the roster developmental types. Essentially high effort, high character, coachable guys. Think Dan Klecko. With 5 picks in the top 75 of a top-heavy draft, I do question a strategy where you address your (arguably) top need area with Dan Klecko.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

Acho?

(.... leaving the door wide open for you....)

Drafts from an open door may explain that cold you've got.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

I'm not sure how you reconcile these perspectives. You don't like A.Smith as a fit, but see Bair (a linear, plodding DT) as a Willie Mac (elite, athletic DE) type. You don't like conversion types early but will take guys that can't spell OLB later. You don't like Sheard's athleticism early but will take Klug (high effort guy with a skill set that may not translate to NFL) later. I understand the opportunity costs of drafting early, but the guys you are actually drafting early better be amazing for your overall plan to make sense.

I guess I can understand this if you consider the current OLB candidates to be sufficient or if you think FA will eventually bring some upgrades. But if you think Bair or Klug or any of the other day 3 guys you mentioned are a good bet to raise the bar on defense, you are either mad or a mad genius.

Aldon Smith: 4.50 short shuttle, 7.19 3-cone

Brandon Bair: 4.37 short shuttle, 7.07 3-cone

"Linear," good word that. This self same "linear" quality was there on my TV screen too, which is why I like Bair in the fifth, he changes direction a little better, and he recognizes plays a great deal better. Smith has the quickness out of the blocks to maybe be a decent pass rusher, but he's not much against the run, and his coverage skills are still a fantasy for his proponents.

Your spelling fetish for football players is a new quirk isn't it?

At 275, Karl Klug did crank out a poor short shuttle of 4.60, yet he had a 3-cone of 7.01 and his ten split was a shade faster than Smith's. Now you drop Klug down to 255-260 where Mike Vrabel played and you've got a physical Vrabel clone used to wrestling double-teams with the likes of John Moffit, Justin Boren, Stephen Schilling, and Stefan Wisneiwski (to the tune of 1st Team All-Big Ten - coaches - you figure they thought well of his wrestling?). I'm fairly confident he could handle a TE/FB double-team on the edge, or a pulling Guard.

As I recall, Dan Klecko was a 4th round pick, at the Combine he stood just under 6' and weighed 283. Risking a 6th rounder on the taller, lighter Klug doesn't quite seem the same to me.

 

[reflexblue]

Wendell: "That's very Linear Sheriff."
Ed Tom Bell: "Well, age will flatten a man".....NCFOM

 

[West Philly Patriot]

I think Heyward is a pure 3-4 DE. He is excellent against the run. Really able to lock the arms and control the tackles. Has good lateral agility and we know BB loves that.

PatsfaninPA & O.J are also on the petition I'll be sending to the BB war room. Run Stopper, Loving his ability to get off blocks in a timely fashion to close/open up lanes. I also think as he gets coached up, he can eventually be a pass rushing threat as well. By all accounts an Intelligent, Hard worker in practice and Senior Team Captain. Trade down from 17 and grab him. Nice....