Outside Linebacker

[jmt57]

Doug Farrar of Yahoo has an encouraging outlook for Jermaine Cunningham in a column that focuses on the Pats' pass rush.

Pats in a hurry to fix pass-rushing decline - NFL - Yahoo! Sports

Farrar believes Cunningham's "most impressive characteristic is his explosion off the line at the snap, which serves him equally well in space and when he’s looping inside."



He also gives Cunningham a positive comparison to Clay Matthews:

If the Patriots are patient with Cunningham, especially as he develops his ability to make moves without his hand down, they could be rewarded with a young defender like that of another college star who made a similar NFL adjustment: Green Bay’s Clay Matthews. At USC, Matthews was very strong when it came to looping inside (as we showed in the Seattle Seahawks “Under Surveillance” piece), and he turned that blast off the snap into a stellar rookie season.


Here's a youtube video that features that move: YouTube - 2010 New England Patriots 2nd round pick-Jermaine Cunningham

 

[jmt57]

On the other hand Albert Breer of the Boston Globe doesn't seem to be very optimistic that Cunningham will contribute much this year, or that the Pats' OLBs will do much in terms of generating a pass rush. Breer feels that if the Pats are to improve the pass rush it will have to come from either a push by the interior defensive line, or from better schemes, such as a safety blitz for example.

Link: Breer on the Pats' pass rush

So the Patriots’ biggest edge-rushing addition would be … Second-round pick Jermaine Cunningham? Yes, that’s right.

Tully Banta-Cain returns after registering 10 sacks last year, as does fellow veteran Derrick Burgess. Rob Ninkovich and Pierre Woods will also be part of the mix, while it’s hard to expect much from Shawn Crable at this juncture.

The problem: All of those guys are complementary rushers, and none are the kind of threats that force a team to tilt its protection or keep an extra guy in to chip or double-team. And recent history shows that most championship teams have that dominant rusher that opponents have to account for.


As it stands now, those guys will need help in harassing the passer.
http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/extra_points/2010/07/10_questions_wh_3.html

 

[italia44]

Re: Olb

Gary Guyton is not an option at 3-4 OLB. Remember, 3-4 OLBs are more like DEs than off the line LBs. At 6'1-6'2 240 lbs, Guyton is too short and light in the loafers to play 3-4 OLB (Remember when he had to play there in an emergency against Seattle in 08? He got mauled).

Guyton is however, a very good option at weakside OLB when the Pats employ 4-3, 3-3-5, and 4-2-5 sets, particularly on passing downs.

Carefull with the "light in the loafers" description it has quite a different connotation attached to it.

..........not that there's anything wrong with that!

 

[mgteich]

Re: Olb

Urban Dictionary: Light in the loafers

Carefull with the "light in the loafers" description it has quite a different connotation attached to it.

..........not that there's anything wrong with that!

 

[jmt57]

Jeff Howe of NESN takes a look at the entire linebacking position. Howe is another person that seems to think there is a possibility of Guyton moving outside; I can see that happening only if or when the team switches to a 4-3 alignment.

Jerod Mayo Leads Linebacking Corps That Must Generate Pass Rush - New England Patriots - NESN.com


Hot Topic: The Patriots' defensive success will rely strictly on an ability to get to the quarterback. They've lacked an elite pass rush since 2007, when they were second in the NFL with 47 sacks. Since, the Pats were tied for 14th in 2008 with 31 sacks, and they were tied for 23rd in 2009 with 31 sacks. New England has a talented secondary, but it was hung out to dry far, far too often last season because the front seven couldn’t disrupt the quarterback's rhythm.

Cunningham (draft) and Murrell (free agency) were the only outside linebackers added during the offseason, and Cunningham has to make the conversion from defensive end. That’s a lot to put on this unit, and the pass rush was likely a top priority when the coaching staff talked strategy heading into offseason camps.

 

[FreeTedWilliams]

I don't see any possibility of this happening for these reasons.
- Mankins is not under contract
- Steelers are not likely to be interested in spending big money on a guard, they are cheap
- the value of a pass rushing OLB is far greater than a guard, the Patriots would have to sweeten the pot


But even if there is a remote possibility, I will fly out to California and drive Mankins to Pittsburgh. I will even pay for gas.

Again, not possible but I like it.

NFL Total Access said last night that the Steelers are ready to lock up Woodley long term, and they are using the Dumervill contract as a base for it. Nothing about trading him. I too highly doubt this report. Mankins for Woodley? com'on, the Steelers are in trouble, they will not have Big Ben for the first six games, granted they still have the 2 wins that come wiht being in Cleveland's division, but they could easily go 2-4 in thier division (Bengals, Ravens). MAx Starks is out for the year, and they drafted Pouncey in the first round and a guard in the 4th round, now if Mankins played tackle, this story might have some legs (although he does have the size to play RT, not the quickness to play LT) but overall I'm still going to call it BS.

 

[jmt57]

Mike Dussault lists the Top 5 Most Intriguing Defensive Patriots at Training Camp in a column for Pats Pulpit - which unfortunately for him was published just prior to today's PUP news. Of those five players three are linebackers, and the top two are outside linebackers.

2.Jermaine Cunningham - For all the Patriots fans who were clamoring for Jerry Hughes or Sergio Kindle in round one Cunningham was the consolation prize that sent us all to the internets to find out how we overlooked the Pats second round pick. After so much buildup about the Pats needing a pass rusher Cunningham was a surprise pick, though Mel Kiper later said upon watching more film he was impressed with how "relentless" Jermaine was.

It's hard to expect much out of a rookie, especially at outside linebacker but given Cunningham's draft position, physicality, and pedigree it's hard not to think he can at least contribute as a sub-rusher in 2010. And of course there's that small part of you that wonders maybe, just maybe, he could be step right in and play all three downs.

And his top story:

1. Shawn Crable - I know I'm going to get killed for this but the fact is on paper there's not another Patriots OLB with better length or speed than Crazy Legs. There is no question that this guy was brought in for one reason: to rush the passer. He's made plays in the few preseason games he's played in, and with two years in the Patriots playbook he should be far more mentally prepared to contribute than Jermaine Cunningham is.

Sorry to say Mike, but as of today even you are probably killing yourself for listing Crable as your top story.

 

[jmt57]

A bit of duplicity from the 'Crable on PUP' thread, but as it pertains to the OLB position, the Boston Globe's Shalise Manza Young is reporting that she is "being told by a league source that Crable is hurt again...no word on how long he'll be off the field this time."

Twitter

 

[reflexblue]

A bit of duplicity from the 'Crable on PUP' thread, but as it pertains to the OLB position, the Boston Globe's Shalise Manza Young is reporting that she is "being told by a league source that Crable is hurt again...no word on how long he'll be off the field this time."

Twitter

Good chance for the rest of his life at least proffesionally.

 

[jmt57]

The Boston Herald's Karen Guregian has A Look At Seven Spots Up For Grabs At Patriots Camp, one of which is OLB. She seems to overstate the abilities of Ninkovich while downplaying what Burgess may be capable of in my opinion.



Locks to start: Tully Banta-Cain.

Prime contenders: Pierre Woods, Jermaine Cunningham, Shawn Crable, Rob Ninkovich, Derrick Burgess.

Battle lines -- Both outside spots are likely up for grabs, although last year’s sack leader Banta-Cain, who signed a lucrative free agent deal to remain with the club, is a likely starter. Belichick appears to have a soft spot for Burgess, who made little, if any, impact last season. Ninkovich got points for effort as he didn’t have much trouble upstaging Adalius Thomas when he subbed in for the former Pat. Woods has seen some time as a starter due to injury, and is a valued special teams player. Both Cunningham and Crable are unproven, untested sleepers in the mix. None of these players figure to invite double teams or provide cause for opponents to game-plan around them. Most of them could either start, or find themselves on the scrap heap by the season opener.

Subplot -- When you look at Crable, with his massive height, incredibly long arms, jack-rabbit speed and chiselled upper body, you come away thinking he could be the next Willie McGinest. Only, the guy with the perfect NFL outside linebacker’s body hasn’t played a down during the regular season since being drafted in the third round in 2008 due to a rash of injuries. Does anyone really know if Crable actually compares favorably with McGinest, beyond a body type? Will this be the year we find out?

 

[zoffle]

This is the D.Burgess positional breakdown for the last 7 games (including playoffs) especially for "eom" and "TheComeback".

Total snaps played for Burgess over the last 7 games was 207

Pos/snaps (%)

LE (3-4): 114 (55.07%)
LE (4-3): 42 (20.29%)
LDT (4-3): 4 (1.93%)
LOLB (3-4): 37 (17.87%)
LOLB (4-3): 5 (2.42%)
LILB (3-4): 5 (2.42%)

 

[RayClay]

The Patriots' defensive success will rely strictly on an ability to get to the quarterback. They've lacked an elite pass rush since 2007

Pretty damn simplistic analysis there. So they had an elite pass rush in 2007 just based on the numbers?

How about the fact every other team was behind by three touchdowns most of the game? Don't really need to respect the run there do you?

No, Vrabel didn't suddenly turn into Lawrence Taylor that year, and pass pressure is more than one guy getting a lot of sacks. At our best, we brought pressure from everywhere, though we had a dominant rusher in McGinest. As all our young linebackers gel, our overall performance, of which sacks are only a part, should improve.

 

[zoffle]

Pretty damn simplistic analysis there. So they had an elite pass rush in 2007 just based on the numbers?

How about the fact every other team was behind by three touchdowns most of the game? Don't really need to respect the run there do you?

No, Vrabel didn't suddenly turn into Lawrence Taylor that year, and pass pressure is more than one guy getting a lot of sacks. At our best, we brought pressure from everywhere, though we had a dominant rusher in McGinest. As all our young linebackers gel, our overall performance, of which sacks are only a part, should improve.

This is true, the defense in 2007 wasn't very good, the offense made it look better than it was. At our best we did bring rushers from different positions, angles, etc. Also our corners where quite physical with the receivers which unfortunately due to rule changes they can't do that any more, Ty Law was a beast of a corner.

 

[RayClay]

This is true, the defense in 2007 wasn't very good, the offense made it look better than it was. At our best we did bring rushers from different positions, angles, etc. Also our corners where quite physical with the receivers which unfortunately due to rule changes they can't do that any more, Ty Law was a beast of a corner.

Add to that the loss of Seymour last year and his injuries in previous years. Although we won't have his caliber of player, I think G Warren and Lewis should hold the line better than Wright and Green.

Simply put, if the players work out, our defense should be better because we will have more talent and athleticism at linebacker and defensive back.

 

[ropese]

Alex Hall was just released by the Eagles. He came over from the Browns. He has the height and weight of a Belichick OLB and is considered to be very athletic with decent pass rush skills.

 

[Sicilian]

This is the D.Burgess positional breakdown for the last 7 games (including playoffs) especially for "eom" and "TheComeback".

Total snaps played for Burgess over the last 7 games was 207

Pos/snaps (%)

LE (3-4): 114 (55.07%)
LE (4-3): 42 (20.29%)
LDT (4-3): 4 (1.93%)
LOLB (3-4): 37 (17.87%)
LOLB (4-3): 5 (2.42%)
LILB (3-4): 5 (2.42%)

I have a really hard time believing that Burgess played that many snaps as a 3-4 LE. Maybe he had his hand down with the 3-4 personnel on the field, but that makes him a 4-3 DE. Those stats are saying that more than half the time, Burgess was on the field instead of Warren at LE in the 3-4, and that just seems unlikely in the base.

 

[jmt57]

Alex Hall was just released by the Eagles. He came over from the Browns. He has the height and weight of a Belichick OLB and is considered to be very athletic with decent pass rush skills.

From an Eagles' beat reporter:

Morning Update: Reid Wants Graham in Camp

"In case you missed it, the Eagles released Alex Hall early this morning to make room for Allen. Hall, who was acquired in the Sheldon Brown deal along with two draft picks, is more of a 3-4 linebacker, according to Reid. Andy does believe Hall "can definitely play the league," but is probably better suited for a different system. The Eagles tried him at linebacker but that didn't seem to work. They are overcrowded at defensive end."

 

[ropese]

I think Hall is definitely worth bringing in for a look.

 

[jmt57]

Some fans - and media members - have thought there is a possibility of Gary Guyton moving to Outside Linebacker, where he could use his speed in coverage or to race past a tackle to rush the quarterback. Mike Reiss responds:

NFL context: Pats & inside linebackers - New England Patriots Blog - ESPN Boston

Q.Mike, could you see Gary Guyton moving to OLB at some point, or is that out of the question? I know he's lighter than what you would prefer at that position, but we're only talking about adding about another ten pounds of bulk to his frame. As I recall he had the fastest 40 time of any linebacker at the combine prior to his rookie season; perhaps the Pats could find a way to use that to their advantage in either rushing the passer or in coverage. Considering the question marks the Pats have at OLB, is that a possibility - or does he, like McKenzie and Spikes, not have the skill set needed to be successful there?

And Reiss' answer:
Guyton is not a fit to play OLB in the standard 3-4 alignment, but if they go to more 4-3 schemes, then I see him moving outside. The difference between playing on the line at as OLB (in the 3-4) versus off the line as an OLB (in the 4-3) is significant.

 

[AzPatsFan]

This is true, the defense in 2007 wasn't very good, the offense made it look better than it was. At our best we did bring rushers from different positions, angles, etc. Also our corners where quite physical with the receivers which unfortunately due to rule changes they can't do that any more, Ty Law was a beast of a corner.

Ty Law was long gone. It was Asante partially, and Randall Gay and Hobbs. Not exactly the world's best CB trio.