How much does the offense change?

[mgcolby]

Could one of the reasons he desided to leave be ....no one yell, just asking , that he knows Brady will not be back and didnt want to chance Cassel going backwards, now that the league will have a whole season of tape on Cassel.

In the legendary word of Nancy Kerrigan "WHYYYYYYY"????

123...enter richpats....

 

[maverick4]

e predictability of the offense but its still an effective offense. So when the colts choke in the playoffs is becaue manning sucked but we lose once in the SB then we are colts and mcdaniels not brady choked ??

Yes, it's a great Pats offense and McDaniels is generally a good OC, just like Peyton is a great QB who runs a predictable offense that nobody can stop in the regular season. Both get stuffed come playoff time though, because game planning and everything else intensifies for playoff games, running the same plays and daring other teams to stop it doesn't work as well.

If not for an amazing Troy Brown forced fumble in 06, McDaniels may have been out of a job before 07.

 

[SVN]

Could one of the reasons he desided to leave be ....no one yell, just asking , that he knows Brady will not be back and didnt want to chance Cassel going backwards, now that the league will have a whole season of tape on Cassel.

Thats Espnesque theory right there IMO

 

[swheeler23]

In the legendary word of Nancy Kerrigan "WHYYYYYYY"????

123...enter richpats....

I knew that would be the response.LOL!

 

[mgcolby]

I knew that would be the response.LOL!

Glad I could oblige.

 

[SVN]

Yes, it's a great Pats offense and McDaniels is generally a good OC, just like Peyton is a great QB who runs a predictable offense that nobody can stop in the regular season. Both get stuffed come playoff time though, because game planning and everything else intensifies for playoff games, running the same plays and daring other teams to stop it doesn't work as well.

If not for an amazing Troy Brown forced fumble in 06, McDaniels may have been out of a job before 07.

sure..its not like brady threw those picks against a good charger D without any receivers to throw since BB and co TRADED branch 1 week before the season. Mcdaniels calls all the INT plays in the playoffs and brady calls all the good plays.
Also from that game, what predictable 4 WR 10 plays did we run since we have this spread offense only since 2007 ?
since Mcd we have lost 3 playoff games. One in Denver, one in Indy and one the SB . Maybe the SB , there were lack of adjustments i dont deny that. Please explain how he cost the indy and denver losses due to his predictable 10 plays especially since the spread offense hasbeen incorporated only since 2007 .?

 

[maverick4]

sure..its not like brady threw those picks against a good charger D without any receivers to throw
since Mcd we have lost 3 playoff games. One in Denver, one in Indy and one the SB

I have no problem with the spread offense, I have a problem with an OC who is inexperienced. McDaniels gets eaten up against more experienced DC's come playoff time, he's like the young kid in poker who is horrible at bluffing or slow playing his cards, he has been blessed with amazing hands and plays them without any deception. The Pats have zero rings with McDaniels in 4 years. The Brady picks against the Chargers and Broncos are a good example of how come playoff time calling predictable plays bites you in the arse. Yes they are Brady's fault for not executing, but you seem to give zero blame to play calling in creating a bad situation.

Not that Weiss was a better overall OC, but in big moments he always came through because he called the offense using deception and keeping opponent's off balance, so when he needed a great final drive he still had some aces in the hole. Also, his offense won each of our 3 Superbowls with late drives, and he had a bunch of SCRUBS on offense the first few years, including JR Redmond and Jermaine Wiggins, castoffs on the o-line, and smurf receivers that were also retreads except for Troy Brown. Blame the 06 receivers all you want, the talent on that 06 offense was way better than anything Weiss had his first few years as OC, and McDaniels also had a great D behind him every year.

 

[SteveBsFan]

Could one of the reasons he desided to leave be ....no one yell, just asking , that he knows Brady will not be back and didnt want to chance Cassel going backwards, now that the league will have a whole season of tape on Cassel.

He left because another owner was beaten by Belichick, again. BB and Pioli put together an amazing offensive unit, Josh is a smart guy and knows how to be a good OC. Because of that, he's suddenly HC material? lol

 

[mgcolby]

He left because another owner was beaten by Belichick, again. BB and Pioli put together an amazing offensive unit, Josh is a smart guy and knows how to be a good OC. Because of that, he's suddenly HC material? lol

Please explain this further, given the fact that we have only defeated Denver twice in the BB era.

 

[SVN]

I have no problem with the spread offense, I have a problem with an OC who is inexperienced. McDaniels gets eaten up against more experienced DC's come playoff time, he's like the young kid in poker who is horrible at bluffing or slow playing his cards, he has been blessed with amazing hands and plays them without any deception. The Pats have zero rings with McDaniels in 4 years. The Brady picks against the Chargers and Broncos are a good example of how come playoff time calling predictable plays bites you in the arse. Yes they are Brady's fault for not executing, but you seem to give zero blame to play calling in creating a bad situation.

Not that Weiss was a better overall OC, but in big moments he always came through because he called the offense using deception and keeping opponent's off balance, so when he needed a great final drive he still had some aces in the hole. Also, his offense won each of our 3 Superbowls with late drives, and he had a bunch of SCRUBS on offense the first few years, including JR Redmond and Jermaine Wiggins, castoffs on the o-line, and smurf receivers that were also retreads except for Troy Brown. Blame the 06 receivers all you want, the talent on that 06 offense was way better than anything Weiss had his first few years as OC, and McDaniels also had a great D behind him every year.

And you seem to blame all the playoff losses on mcdaniels. 2006 AFFCG also he cost us the game ? After our D couldnt hold on after scored 30+ pts ?
the offense weiss ran vs what mcdaniels ran are totallly different .and regarding when needing a key final drive, well brady after struggling all game in the SB did put together a final drive to give the pats the lead. But iam sure he just ignored mcdaniels and called his own play.
We won 18 games in a row and 2 playoff games -yes playoff games-and mcdaniels had a hand in it. You seem to think it was insignificant but i think it was significant enough. Of course BB is an idiot for keeping an inexperienced playcaller for the past 3 yrs. He shouldve gotten some experienced older guy like he got Dean Pees on defense to run the offense.

 

[maverick4]

And you seem to blame all the playoff losses on mcdaniels. 2006 AFFCG also he cost us the game ? After our D couldnt hold on after scored 30+ pts ?
the offense weiss ran vs what mcdaniels ran are totallly different .and regarding when needing a key final drive, well brady after struggling all game in the SB did put together a final drive to give the pats the lead.

In 01 in the Raiders, Steelers, and Rams games, our 2-minute offense included Jermaine Wiggins, JR Redmond, a 6th rd rookie QB, a no-name O-line, and 2 tiny receivers including Patten who nobody else wanted. We made great 4th quarter and OT drives in the Raider and Rams games to take those games despite being completely overmatched. Compare that with McDaniels constantly getting stopped, like Manning, when the going gets tough despite having arguably the most talent ever on an offensive unit.

Our D was completely gassed in that Colts game and it's a great example of how clueless McDaniels was, he kept going for risky plays and getting three and outs in key spots, forcing our exhausted D back onto the field in the second half. This is where experience comes in, knowing your job isn't just to score points but also work in conjunction with other units to win a game.

 

[T-ShirtDynasty]

McDaniels did not invent the offense; if anything it's the same thing that was here when Weis was the OC.

Except maybe less end-arounds and reverses.

 

[Mack Herron]

In 01 in the Raiders, Steelers, and Rams games, our 2-minute offense included Jermaine Wiggins, JR Redmond, a 6th rd rookie QB, a no-name O-line, and 2 tiny receivers including Patten who nobody else wanted. We made great 4th quarter and OT drives in the Raider and Rams games to take those games despite being completely overmatched. Compare that with McDaniels constantly getting stopped, like Manning, when the going gets tough despite having arguably the most talent ever on an offensive unit.

Our D was completely gassed in that Colts game and it's a great example of how clueless McDaniels was, he kept going for risky plays and getting three and outs in key spots, forcing our exhausted D back onto the field in the second half. This is where experience comes in, knowing your job isn't just to score points but also work in conjunction with other units to win a game.

I guess this insight somehow escaped BB

 

[SteveBsFan]

Please explain this further, given the fact that we have only defeated Denver twice in the BB era.

I said owners. He was able to trick another owner in this league that someone below him was ready, just because they fed off what BB brings to teams.

Owners keep trying to pick from the branches of this tree because they think they'll get the roots.

 

[rsd]

In 01 in the Raiders, Steelers, and Rams games, our 2-minute offense included Jermaine Wiggins, JR Redmond, a 6th rd rookie QB, a no-name O-line, and 2 tiny receivers including Patten who nobody else wanted. We made great 4th quarter and OT drives in the Raider and Rams games to take those games despite being completely overmatched. Compare that with McDaniels constantly getting stopped, like Manning, when the going gets tough despite having arguably the most talent ever on an offensive unit.

Our D was completely gassed in that Colts game and it's a great example of how clueless McDaniels was, he kept going for risky plays and getting three and outs in key spots, forcing our exhausted D back onto the field in the second half. This is where experience comes in, knowing your job isn't just to score points but also work in conjunction with other units to win a game.

Hahahahahahaha.

"Risky" plays? You're right, Gaffney dropping a ball in the numbers or Troy going the wrong direction are risky as hell...

 

[Rob0729]

We've seen the defense look very different under Crennel, Mangini, and Pees. Same with the offense, and it's not just due to all the loaded offensive talent. The play calling philosophies are totally different. McDaniels is very blatant in using the same 10 plays and daring other team's to stop it, which they usually don't, unless it's a meaningful playoff game in which case we choke (a lot like Mike Martz)

Again, the Patriots offense scored 27 points vs. the Colts in the AFC Championships two years ago (which is more than the Colts previous two playoff opponents combined). The choking in that game was the 35 points given up in the second half by the defense. I'll say it again because that is a staggering number, the Pats' defense gave up 35 points in the second half. Weis would have lost that game with defensive production like that and Reche Caldwell as his primary receiver.

 

[Rob0729]

In 01 in the Raiders, Steelers, and Rams games, our 2-minute offense included Jermaine Wiggins, JR Redmond, a 6th rd rookie QB, a no-name O-line, and 2 tiny receivers including Patten who nobody else wanted. We made great 4th quarter and OT drives in the Raider and Rams games to take those games despite being completely overmatched. Compare that with McDaniels constantly getting stopped, like Manning, when the going gets tough despite having arguably the most talent ever on an offensive unit.

Our D was completely gassed in that Colts game and it's a great example of how clueless McDaniels was, he kept going for risky plays and getting three and outs in key spots, forcing our exhausted D back onto the field in the second half. This is where experience comes in, knowing your job isn't just to score points but also work in conjunction with other units to win a game.

You do realize the Pats had six three and outs under Weis in the Super Bowl vs. the Eagles? That is three more three and out than the Pats had vs. the Colts in the AFC Championship game. Also three of the seven drives for the Pats in the second half against the Colts resulted in scoring (a TD and two field goals).

Besides when I pointed out all the 3 and outs Weis had in 2003 and his third down conversion percentage, you mocked me for calling it a useless stat. Now it is important to argue why McDaniels was responsible for the defense giving up 35 points in a half?

 

[Rob0729]

As for the offense, I think many of the things McDaniels implemented will stay. If you watched the BCS Championships, you would have seen that Belichick and McDaniels have co-opted a lot of Urban Meyer's offense. That is where the shotgun formations even on running plays has come from. The offense has been successful, there is really no debating that fact rationally. I'm sure the next OC will get to put his imprint on it.

 

[Rob0729]

Hahahahahahaha.

"Risky" plays? You're right, Gaffney dropping a ball in the numbers or Troy going the wrong direction are risky as hell...

It was Reche Caldwell, but I agree with your point. I didn't see any risky plays in the AFC Championship game.

 

[Palm Beach Pats Fan]

McDaniels gets eaten up against more experienced DC's come playoff time.

I thought the overall game plan and in-game adjustments in the playoffs last year against Jacksonville was one of the best I have ever seen. The Jags based everything on stopping the deep pass, so it was a day-long near-perfect execution of a short passing ball control strategy that Jaxsonville was never able to counter.

The game plan in the Super Bowl fell apart when even in "max protect" there was no protection. That wasn't a matter of X's and O's it was a matter of players who were properly deployed being overwhelmed by the opponent repeatedly on that day, and yet the opportunity to win was there.