What is Slater doing on this team??

[Kontradiction]

the FO isn't smarter than me


my Madden team won the super bowl last year, but the real patriots didn't

LMAO!!! You have ZERO credibility now. Thank you for the new sig quote though!

 

[Urgent]

If we are going to compare Matthew Slater to Troy Brown, which was common during the post-draft period, or Tom Brady or other unheralded rookies whose jocks Matthew Slater has not yet earned the rights to sniff, one important note is that those esteemed control cases had college stats.

Troy Brown caught passes in college.
Other unproductive rookies had started in college and amassed a record of performance we could look to as an indicator of how they might perform in the pro's in the future.

Slater was a return specialist, with no capabilities on offense or defense.
As such, he was pretty focused on kick returns.
That's, like, his totally best thing.

I see fumbling a kick-off as less of a rookie mistake, then, say, dropping into the wrong zone or biting on play action. Does anyone mistake a kick-off as something they should fumble?

Many kick returners are receivers or corners or running backs awaiting their chance on offense or defense, but Slater is not one of these. As a kick returner, he has not been very good.

It's perfectly valid to accept this and believe that it's just too early to judge him.
There were plenty of folks who were ready to judge him immediately after he was selected. Whether we now agree with them or not, that's sort of hasty, I agree.
Having seen a dozen games, observed on-field performance, and reviewed stats, I don't think he's very good. At least with guys like Bethel, there was good and bad.

I hope he suddenly improves, but I'm not real optimistic.
I don't think this is because he fumbled - when Brown fumbled a punt in his last game, I didn't think differently of Troy Brown, and still wore my Troy Brown jersey to the next game.

 

[Kontradiction]

He will be soon enough, that's more than I can say for the guys that BB kept over him (Sam Aiken and CJ Jones)

He's eclipsing his third season. What is he waiting for? The perfect time to "spring his trap" on the rest of the league? BTM, I'm a Gator fan. I loved Chad Jackson when he was with us. But I knew then and I knew when we drafted him that that was a mistake. I was much rather hoping for Holmes. I held out hope in him but as the seasons passed with him not doing anything, I knew he would just be another Florida wide receiver who was some team's draft bust. Just too bad he was our's.

 

[DaBruinz]

If we are going to compare Matthew Slater to Troy Brown, which was common during the post-draft period, or Tom Brady or other unheralded rookies whose jocks Matthew Slater has not yet earned the rights to sniff, one important note is that those esteemed control cases had college stats.

Troy Brown caught passes in college.
Other unproductive rookies had started in college and amassed a record of performance we could look to as an indicator of how they might perform in the pro's in the future.

Slater was a return specialist, with no capabilities on offense or defense.
As such, he was pretty focused on kick returns.
That's, like, his totally best thing.

This is false Slater was NOT just a kick returner in college. What don't you understand about that. He also played on other special teams units. Which he also EXCELLED at. Its why he was considered the BEST pure special teams player in the draft.

To say he has no capabilities on offense or defense because there are other players ahead of him would be like saying that Troy Brown could never be a nickle corner because he never played there.

I see fumbling a kick-off as less of a rookie mistake, then, say, dropping into the wrong zone or biting on play action. Does anyone mistake a kick-off as something they should fumble?

Many kick returners are receivers or corners or running backs awaiting their chance on offense or defense, but Slater is not one of these. As a kick returner, he has not been very good.

Troy Brown, as a kick returner was not very good either. And Troy took very few snaps on offense his rookie year. As proven by his whopping 2 receptions.

It's perfectly valid to accept this and believe that it's just too early to judge him.
There were plenty of folks who were ready to judge him immediately after he was selected. Whether we now agree with them or not, that's sort of hasty, I agree.
Having seen a dozen games, observed on-field performance, and reviewed stats, I don't think he's very good. At least with guys like Bethel, there was good and bad.

So, because you don't see his down punts in the stat sheet, it means nothing. Because the tackles he made limited the returns by the opposing team to under 25 yards, it means nothing.

I hope he suddenly improves, but I'm not real optimistic.
I don't think this is because he fumbled - when Brown fumbled a punt in his last game, I didn't think differently of Troy Brown, and still wore my Troy Brown jersey to the next game.

When did you get your Troy Brown jersey? 1993 when he was drafted? Or 2001, after he recorded 101 receptions? What did you think of Troy Brown in 1993 after his fumbles? Did you want him cut? By your own definitions, he wasn't brining anything to the offense. He hadn't played on defense yet.

So, lets get real here. Troy Brown was the 5th receiver on the Pats in 1993 and he was cut in TC prior to the 1994 season.

BTW, I need to make a correction. I said earlier that it was BB who lobbied for Brown's return. I was wrong. It was Dante Scarnecchia.

 

[Gicksauce]

LMAO!!! You have ZERO credibility now. Thank you for the new sig quote though!

Glad to be there man

 

[captain stone]

I posted during draft time, not understanding this pick...a guy who basically had NO position in college besides a KR. Guys that are drafted as KRs usually have to do something special in camp to make the team. He didnt. I was comparing him to Quentin Demps, rookie with the Eagles who returned a kick for a TD in preseason and MADE the team. I was more than a little shocked that Slater made the team because he cant back up a position and his kick returns simply arent "special". With the rash of injuries at DB we certainly could have used depth there....
So today he boots the kickoff and basically gives Pitt a TD and the momentum that they used to win the game. If we are down by 3 their LBs dont have their ears pinned back and dont strip sack MC twice costing the game. Everyone that has defended him in the past please chime in to defend him, he has been active for every game but hasnt made a single big play(that was til tonite)~~~I would rather have another CB that cant tackle than a STer that blows games.

I'm not going to read 83 other posts to come to the same conclusion anyway: Matt Slater is (another) waste of a 5th-round pick by this overrated FO. How dare they arroganly think that they are always smarter than every other organization and scouting service in pro football. They're not, and haven't been for the past 5 seasons. The proof is in the pudding, and it tastes rancid.

BTW, what has happened to the "No doubt any more, poor drafting has killed our depth" thread? The truth hurts, it appears. Well then, let me say the same thing I said in that censored thread: Wake up and smell the effin coffee, homers. Instead of making excuses, you should be demanding accountability.

 

[primetime]

Kelly Washington?? Is he still on the team?? He didnt dress for several of the games last year but made 1 nice play downing a punt and a punt block...and is back to his typical inactive status.

Steve Tasker?? The best ST player ever....tell me you arent comparing Slater to HIM!!

Then in the same breath throw Randy Moss under the bus, like he hasnt ever done anything to WIN a game.....unbelievably moronic.

Kelley Washington was the best STer in the league last year. He made several tackles inside the 20, and downed several punts deep as well as blocked a punt. The special teams unit has suffered without his presence this year. And he's been inactive because he's been injured. Yet he hasn't been IRed. Why not? Because he's such a stud that the team prefers to keep his roster spot rather than open it.

You said Slater was only on the team to return kicks. Steve Tasker never returned kicks. Would you have cut Steve Tasker because all he did was play special teams?

As for Moss, the point wasn't that he's never done anything. It's that he's given the benefit of the doubt because he's a veteran, and his name is Randy Moss. Yet he's dropped more balls in big situations than Slater has, and if he hadn't dropped the balls yesterday its possible that Slater's fumble wouldn't have mattered.

If teams cut every guy that made a mistake, they'd have to sign new players every game. Who were in turn cut because they made mistakes.

 

[Pats726]

How dare they arroganly think that they are always smarter than every other organization and scouting service in pro football. They're not, and haven't been for the past 5 seasons. The proof is in the pudding, and it tastes rancid.

Well..have some puddin from Oakland or Detroit...or maybe Cinci?? How's that?? Tastes good doesn't it?? Maybe more posinous than rancid....I think perspective is needed there...maybe you need to taste some of that before talking about rancid...ARE any not???

 

[ScottieC]

Glad to be there man

That makes one.

 

[mgteich]

At first, I didn't like the pick. I didn't like paying a 5th and a 7th for a STer. Then some reality set in. The 5th through the 7th a total shots in the dark, player who we hope might someday conttribute to the team. If Belichick could get a ST starter in the fifth, then fine.

Then Slater beat out a few of our binkies in camp. And we still wondered whether he should be on the team.

With 100% hindsight, Slater was a fine pick. He was thought to be THE BEST SPECIAL TEAMER IN THE COUNTRY. And, sure enough, he is a gunner and plays on five special teams units. He is always active, unless injured. He is a key member of the active roster, a special teams starter and solid ST performer.

SPECIAL TEAMERS ON THE ROSTER WHO ARE ON THE SQUAD TO PLAY SPECIAL TEAMS
We have several of these guys on the team: Slater, Washington, Ventrone, Aiken, Izzo, Alexander (now on IR), Spann, Redd. That's seven, not counting Alexander (who Redd replaced on the 53). While these players might be backups at other positions, or even developmental players at other positions, they are on the 53 to play special teams.

Belichick has made a tremendous commitment to Special Teams. Seven roster spots is a lot, especially since we also have to carry punters and kick returners. These players are NOT bottom of the barrel 3rd string scrubs They are starters on the various Special Teams units.

For me, I'd rather see Faulk returning kicks when Hobbs is hurt, or as a second returner with Hobbs. But I am wrong in that preference. Faulk already has enough roles.

========================
COUNTING THE ROSTER
CORE OFFENSE 19 (2 QB, 4 WR, 2 TE, 4 RB/FB, 7 OL)
CORE DEFENSE 19 (5 DE, 7 LB, 7 DB)
SPECIAL TEAMS 7 (they play on 6 ST units; many core players also play ST's)
SPECIALISTS 3 (K, P, DS)
BACKUPS 5 (usually inactive)
=========================

 

[JMarr]

Troy Brown was just SO AWESOME. I mean, that 16.2 YPR on kick offs was AMAZING. Really lit it up. And with a long of 26 YARDS. WOW. I mean, that just blows the socks off of Slater. And I mean, the 2 fumbles are REALLY IMPRESSIVE.

Now you're contradicting yourself in typical foaming-at-the-mouth fashion. Chill out. If Slater was brought in merely to return kicks, then it might be useful to compare Brown's kick return numbers to his at this point--and then, end of discussion. But as you said, Slater's not just a kick returner, nor was he thought of as such when he was drafted.

The point of my post (which you completely misread) was that Slater WAS NOT brought in merely to be a KR or play special teams. He was talked about as a potential Troy Brown-type in that he might be able to provide depth at WR and DB as well.

If you're saying it's unfair to compare him to Troy or too early to call him a bust, then I'm with ya.

 

[Urgent]

I understand that the Troy Brown comparisons are probably for hyperbole, and no one really believes it. But they really are not valid.

Troy Brown was the primary receiver on offense coming out of Marshall. Randy Moss famously says he is the second-best receiver Marshall has produced. Brown was an exciting player - receiving a 99-yard pass, intercepting a hail mary in the 1-AA national championship game to lock down the win, setting NCAA kick-return records in average and scoring, etc. In 1992, he had 101 receptions for 1654 yards and 16 TD's.

If we are projecting potential for first-year players, you need to look at college stats. People use Troy Brown as an example because he didn't do much his rookie year and because he later went on to become one of the leading performers on the team. However, those baseline college stats for Brown are completely different from the stas for Slater, who had no receptions and no tackles in college.

Maybe Slater will break out. But the comparison with Brown is not valid.
You could make the same comparison with Brady. He had one more completion than Slater his rookie season. Then he became the NFL MVP at QB. Slater could do the same.
But the background you would use to project that doesn't support it.

Potentially a better comparison would be Steve Neal. Again, broke all odds to become a solid starter in the NFL. However, Neal was also a real longshot to become a starter when he broke in, just as Slater is now.

 

[DaBruinz]

I'm not going to read 83 other posts to come to the same conclusion anyway: Matt Slater is (another) waste of a 5th-round pick by this overrated FO. How dare they arroganly think that they are always smarter than every other organization and scouting service in pro football. They're not, and haven't been for the past 5 seasons. The proof is in the pudding, and it tastes rancid.

BTW, what has happened to the "No doubt any more, poor drafting has killed our depth" thread? The truth hurts, it appears. Well then, let me say the same thing I said in that censored thread: Wake up and smell the effin coffee, homers. Instead of making excuses, you should be demanding accountability.

Too bad you wouldn't know the truth if it came up and hit you with a Peterbilt truck.

The fact is that numbskulls like yourself and the OP expect every player to perform like Dan Koppen after half a season. Its YOUR expectations that are the issue, not the Patriots drafting. And your claim of 5 season is so bogus its pathetic.

 

[Ian]

Enough. Time to close this thread as it's going nowhere. - Ian