The Pats version of Ricky Williams

[pats1]

Before Brady wound up in NE what had he won of any significance???? Give me a break with the Brady love Mr. 6TH round draft pick almost went undrafted, he's a good QB in a great system....period!!!!!!!! I love how because your Pat fans you think it gives you the right to crap on every QB in the league because Brady was the QB of a team that won three SB's by a combined 9 pts. Those numbers don't suggest dominace by a QB to me. Infact if it weren't for a clutch kicker the Pats would have 0 SB victories in those three SB's! But I never hear a word about Vinitari.

Look, it's the TEAM that won the Super Bowls. It would be naive and foolish to suggest it was one player (Vinatieri OR Brady) that specifically "won the Super Bowl" for the Pats.

 

[fgssand]

Before Brady wound up in NE what had he won of any significance???? Give me a break with the Brady love Mr. 6TH round draft pick almost went undrafted, he's a good QB in a great system....period!!!!!!!! I love how because your Pat fans you think it gives you the right to crap on every QB in the league because Brady was the QB of a team that won three SB's by a combined 9 pts. Those numbers don't suggest dominace by a QB to me. Infact if it weren't for a clutch kicker the Pats would have 0 SB victories in those three SB's! But I never hear a word about Vinitari.

I really do not care to debate what the reasons for our many successes may be. I was just reminding you of the facts - the Patriots have dominated this decade and set new records in just about every team category that exists. I am confident there is a lot more to follow.

I offer you the same bet - My Pats will win more games then your Dolphins this year.

Please put up or shut up.....

Thanks for your reply, but I have a hunch you will now be as silent as Aqua man.

 

[mavfan2390]

Infact if it weren't for a clutch kicker the Pats would have 0 SB victories in those three SB's! But I never hear a word about Vinitari.

Please, Vinateri was

a. put in a position to be successful by Brady, something Manning never did for Vanderjerk

and

b. put himself in the position to make a game winner because of miss field goals earlier

 

[PatsFanInEaglesLand]

Before Brady wound up in NE what had he won of any significance????

2000 Orange Bowl

I love how because your Pat fans you think it gives you the right to crap on every QB in the league because Brady was the QB of a team that won three SB's by a combined 9 pts.

A win is a win is a win, that comment is pure jealousy. The fact is he is better than any QB your franchise has ever had.

 

[feelthepain]

Please, Vinateri was

a. put in a position to be successful by Brady, something Manning never did for Vanderjerk

and

b. put himself in the position to make a game winner because of miss field goals earlier

Really?? I think Manning put Vanderjack in position to win the AFC title game, but Vanderjack missed the field goal by 50 feet right, something you've never seen Vinitari do!! C) when did Adam miss a field goal that didn't win the Pats a SB?? Never!!! How many SB's did the Pats need a field goal to win?? 3!! How many times did Brady win the SB for the Pats without needing Adam to kick the winning score??? Never!!! If Brady is so great why didn't the Pats win a SB by 10 or more points??? Why did it always take a field goal to win the game?? I mean Brady is all mighty Mr. Everything, he doesn't need others around him to win the SB, so why didn't the Pats blow everyone out of the water?? Yeah it's not the system, it's all Brady!

 

[PatsFanInEaglesLand]

Really?? I think Manning put Vanderjack in position to win the AFC title game, but Vanderjack missed the field goal by 50 feet right, something you've never seen Vinitari do!! C) when did Adam miss a field goal that didn't win the Pats a SB?? Never!!! How many SB's did the Pats need a field goal to win?? 3!! How many times did Brady win the SB for the Pats without needing Adam to kick the winning score??? Never!!! If Brady is so great why didn't the Pats win a SB by 10 or more points??? Why did it always take a field goal to win the game?? I mean Brady is all mighty Mr. Everything, he doesn't need others around him to win the SB, so why didn't the Pats blow everyone out of the water?? Yeah it's not the system, it's all Brady!

And why haven't the dolphins been in the Super Bowl in the last 20 years?

Your posts just reek of jealousy.

 

[mgcolby]

Really?? I think Manning put Vanderjack in position to win the AFC title game, but Vanderjack missed the field goal by 50 feet right, something you've never seen Vinitari do!! C) when did Adam miss a field goal that didn't win the Pats a SB?? Never!!! How many SB's did the Pats need a field goal to win?? 3!! How many times did Brady win the SB for the Pats without needing Adam to kick the winning score??? Never!!! If Brady is so great why didn't the Pats win a SB by 10 or more points??? Why did it always take a field goal to win the game?? I mean Brady is all mighty Mr. Everything, he doesn't need others around him to win the SB, so why didn't the Pats blow everyone out of the water?? Yeah it's not the system, it's all Brady!

What title game? If you are referring to the AFC Divisional game against the Steelers Peyton did nothing to get Vandershank in position to make the easiest field goal possible. If he dumped the ball off on any of the first three plays to either James or Clarke it would have been a 30-35 yard field goal instead of a 40+, but Peyton only gives a **** about hitting the deep ball.

We only needed a game winning field goal in 2 and in the carolina game if Adam had hit either of the first two he missed we would have only needed the dramatic 2001 kick.

In 2001 we were playing a more talented football team. In 2003 the Panthers were very good and played an outstanding football game. In 04 the Eagles were also a very good experienced football team and the Pats played like dog **** in the 1st half. And lets forget the fact the Patriots won the 03 and 04 Super Bowls after breaking the record for the games started by different players because we lost so many day 1 starters to injury, so maybe the fact that our team was playing with second stringers and street FA's may have had something to do with the difference on the scoreboard. But hey what do I know, I thought you folks had Mark Clayton!

Noone on this board has ever said Brady didn't need anyone else around him. But if last year didn't prove that he is without a doubt the best QB in the league then you don't know **** about football. Other than the Rookie guard his entire line missed multiple games to injuries and yet still didn't get sacked that often, he took hits but not sacks, we had your teams castoff start a few games because our running backs were lost to injuries, and our TE's couldn't get on the field together because of injury and through all of that he led the league in Passing. He also guided the Pats to 10 wins with just as many injuries to the Defense and oh did I mention he lost his coordinator?

Don't make such a jackass of yourself.

 

[mgteich]

We lost a player who was competing for a backup role on a defensive line that needed no additions. We gave up a player who wasn't making our team. We gave up no money.

The fins lost two first round draft choices and a ton of bonus money. In addition, the fins were counting on Williams to be a major contributer.

Gloat if you will. Losing a player is indeed a loss. However, it is not even close to what the loss of Williams meant to Miami. With those two first rounders instead of Williams, Miami might even be a condender.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2504616

Looks like you guys have your own Ricky Williams! HAHA!

 

[zippo59]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2504616

Looks like you guys have your own Ricky Williams! HAHA!

When I found out it was Sullivan who was arrested I was really relieved. When I first heard a Pats players had been arrested for drugs I feared it was actually someone important to to the team, like how Williams was important to the Dolphnis. But no, it was just some underachieving loser who was probably going to be cut anyway.

Despite your wishes, the two situations are no where close to the same thing.

 

[feelthepain]

Look, it's the TEAM that won the Super Bowls. It would be naive and foolish to suggest it was one player (Vinatieri OR Brady) that specifically "won the Super Bowl" for the Pats.

Careful...thats blasphemy to most Pat fans here, and it would also mean that it was a system that won those SB's!!! How can that be????

 

[feelthepain]

Noone on this board has ever said Brady didn't need anyone else around him

No one is two words, and you seriously need to go through some of the threads here and look at how many Pat fans think Brady is the only reason the Pats won three SB's. Your own fans give credit to no one but Brady. Us fin fans and most logical fans know Brady was just part of the success the Pats have had since BB joined the Pats, but to listen to most Pat fans, BB, the D, the Oline, the Kicker, a lot of luck. Had nothing to do with the wins, it was all Brady!! I say it was the system....BTW, how else could you explain the Pats success through so many key injuries?? Brady would have won nothing if the system wasn't a good solid system. Pat fans can lie to themselves all they want, but everyone outside of the Pat fans know it's the system that won 3 SB in 4 years, not Brady.

 

[Keegs]

Aqua, i like debating the records with you but when that baby in the other thread was trying to bash me about is this......

This thread seems like it was made just to get a rise out of people, because there is no way you can say Sullivan can be compared to Ricky Williams (besides the whole presence of marijuana thing)

You really don't believe both players are equally valuable to their teams do u ?

 

[spacecrime]

No one is two words, and you seriously need to go through some of the threads here and look at how many Pat fans think Brady is the only reason the Pats won three SB's.

You seriously need to show me this threads or shut up.

What you are confusing is our saying Brady is the Best QB in the NFL. He is.

Seymour is the Best defensive player in the NFL.

BB is the best coach and Kraft is the best owner.

BB coaches up players and puts them in a psoition to win. Brady is one who gets the job done.

I have yet to see a single thread aobut Brady being the ONLY reason we won three SBs. He is an important piece, but there are a lot of reason the Pats are superior and won three SBs in the last five years.

Just as there are a lot of reason the Dolphins can't get out of their own way. It isn't just inept managemetn that trades away draft picks for crap, for the Phins lousy oline, or their Dbs which are either ancient or rookies, or ... I could go on, but you get the picture.

It is a combination of things.

THe fins should do better with Saban. After all he is BB trained. The more like the Pats the fins get, the more games they will win.

 

[feelthepain]

You seriously need to show me this threads or shut up.

What you are confusing is our saying Brady is the Best QB in the NFL. He is.

Seymour is the Best defensive player in the NFL.

BB is the best coach and Kraft is the best owner.

BB coaches up players and puts them in a psoition to win. Brady is one who gets the job done.

I have yet to see a single thread aobut Brady being the ONLY reason we won three SBs. He is an important piece, but there are a lot of reason the Pats are superior and won three SBs in the last five years.

Just as there are a lot of reason the Dolphins can't get out of their own way. It isn't just inept managemetn that trades away draft picks for crap, for the Phins lousy oline, or their Dbs which are either ancient or rookies, or ... I could go on, but you get the picture.

It is a combination of things.

THe fins should do better with Saban. After all he is BB trained. The more like the Pats the fins get, the more games they will win.

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/showthread.php?t=36956

That one thread should do it! Read it all and see how many Pat fans refuse to accept the system as the reason for the Pats success, yet few think Brady wasn't the major reason for the Pats success.

 

[CrazyDave]

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/showthread.php?t=36956

That one thread should do it! Read it all and see how many Pat fans refuse to accept the system as the reason for the Pats success, yet few think Brady wasn't the major reason for the Pats success.

You're an idiot. And the Dolphins suck. There, i said it.

 

[pats-blue]

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/showthread.php?t=36956

That one thread should do it! Read it all and see how many Pat fans refuse to accept the system as the reason for the Pats success, yet few think Brady wasn't the major reason for the Pats success.

The first pages of that post that actually dealt with the thread topic were all about several players that contribute to the Pats success...until...low an behold a fin fan you should be familiar with starts in on the Brady crap. You need to get an new act because your one trick pony is getting old and ruining threads, sure to get banished to the interleague forum where the trash talk (since there are no football facts in any of your arguments)

Brady is acknowledged as if not THE top QB in the league certainly one of the top three by EVERYONE. The Pats came out in the 2001 SB as a TEAM. You keep pounding on that the it is the Pats "system" and by your measuring stick EVERY QB is a system QB since they didn't ever win anything on thier own since it is a team game. Get over it and move on with your crap, add something to the thread itself or go to the interleague forum where you belong since all you do is talk trash.

Gotta love that to "prove" your point you link a thread YOU started the "point".

 

[spacecrime]

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/showthread.php?t=36956

That one thread should do it! Read it all and see how many Pat fans refuse to accept the system as the reason for the Pats success, yet few think Brady wasn't the major reason for the Pats success.

You changed your argument. I was responding to your comment that Pats fans think that Brady was the ONLY reason they won. Here is one of the times you said it in this thread:

Your own fans give credit to no one but Brady.

I agree with you that Brady is a major reason we won. Do you think he isn't? Haven't you ever seen a Pats game? Of course he is a major reason. So was Seymour, and our OLine, and WRs, and DLine and LB, and especially our coaching.

What you have been saying is that Pats fans consider him the ONLY reason, and that is pure horse poop. We love our team. We love the fact that in 2001 they got introduced as a team. You don't know this, but that wasn't a superbowl trick. They did it week by week. You can have your team dominated by superstars. We'll take aour team. And that includes Brady, who is a terrific team player.

I see that your new arguement is that the pats only win because they have a "system."

Sorry, there is no system. The pats are known for totally different game plans week to week. They have the opposite of a system. Don't try to gameplan the Pats by what they have been doing last week or the week before, or you will end up like Phila in the SB, practcing for two weeks agaisnt a 3-4 defense only to have the pats run 4-3 for almost hte whole game.

"The system" is something fans of loser teams say to explain why other teams beat them. It wasn't the other team, it was the Pats' "system."

Yeah, system. Try good coaching, work ethic, team mentality, quality backups and role players.

When you get those, you can win superbowls, too.

 

[Terry Glenn is a cowgirl]

The Fins will win about 11 and the Pats will win about 10. That was the weakest argument I've ever seen!

You need to go back to your summer school son. Your grades are very sad. And frankly, your eyesight is very poor as well.

The Pats are going to win the division again... and the superbowl again.

Harrington is a joke of a qb. He's going to be your qb. Culpepper will be lucky to get on the field after what happened to him. Also, even if Culpepper does play...all he will do is either fumble it... or throw interceptions ala Brett Farve. Saban still hasn't found his qb.

 

[zippo59]

Also Fins fans might want to keep in mind is that when Culpepper put up those big numbers in 2004 there was not a single good defense in the division. The Lions and Bears were terrible, and the Packers, despite posting a good record, were 0-3 against quality opponents. For those of you who don't know, a quality opponent is one with a winning record. I watched several Packers games that year, and saw first hand how terrible that defense was.

One can't deny that Culpepper put up crazy good numbers in 2004, but a lot of things can happen to create temporary situations. What I mean is that Culpepper has put up decent but not spectacular numbers every other year of his career, so until we see his success repeated the for all we know it could have been a fluke or a one hit wonder or whatever you want to call it.

As for the Fins fan who said that many Pats fans think Brady is the only person who deserves credit for the twams success, that is just crazy. I have not heard a single fan who knows anything about this team who thinks that. Most fans I know think BB is perhaps the greatest coach since Lombardi himself. Maybe you haven't been paying attention to these boards enough but there are constant accolades to guys like Tedy Bruschi, Rodney Harrison, Deion Branch, Troy Brown, Willie McGuinest, Mike Vrabel, Adam Vinatieri, Corey Dillon, and Richard Seymour, and that's just naming a few. You can't have a successful team without a good system, organization, and coaching staff, but you also can't have one without good players. How many SB's did BB win before Brady as head coach? On the flip side, when Tom Brady was asked where he thought he would be today if he was drafted by a team like the Cardinals his answer was that he would probably be out of football. Brady gets lots of praise because he deserves it, having performed so well in the post season, but you are completely misunderstanding if you think a large amount of fans think he is the only reason. He does not have the weapons of Troy Aikmen, who had a future HOF RB and WR, and what is generally thought of as the greatest offensive line of all time, but by no means at all does that mean the Pats don't have a bunch of great players and coaches. If you need more proof, go to a Pats game at Gillette Stadium and see how many jerseys of each player are worn. You will see there is a great variety.

 

[feelthepain]

Also Fins fans might want to keep in mind is that when Culpepper put up those big numbers in 2004 there was not a single good defense in the division. The Lions and Bears were terrible, and the Packers, despite posting a good record, were 0-3 against quality opponents. For those of you who don't know, a quality opponent is one with a winning record. I watched several Packers games that year, and saw first hand how terrible that defense was.

One can't deny that Culpepper put up crazy good numbers in 2004, but a lot of things can happen to create temporary situations. What I mean is that Culpepper has put up decent but not spectacular numbers every other year of his career, so until we see his success repeated the for all we know it could have been a fluke or a one hit wonder or whatever you want to call it.

As for the Fins fan who said that many Pats fans think Brady is the only person who deserves credit for the twams success, that is just crazy. I have not heard a single fan who knows anything about this team who thinks that. Most fans I know think BB is perhaps the greatest coach since Lombardi himself. Maybe you haven't been paying attention to these boards enough but there are constant accolades to guys like Tedy Bruschi, Rodney Harrison, Deion Branch, Troy Brown, Willie McGuinest, Mike Vrabel, Adam Vinatieri, Corey Dillon, and Richard Seymour, and that's just naming a few. You can't have a successful team without a good system, organization, and coaching staff, but you also can't have one without good players. How many SB's did BB win before Brady as head coach? On the flip side, when Tom Brady was asked where he thought he would be today if he was drafted by a team like the Cardinals his answer was that he would probably be out of football. Brady gets lots of praise because he deserves it, having performed so well in the post season, but you are completely misunderstanding if you think a large amount of fans think he is the only reason. He does not have the weapons of Troy Aikmen, who had a future HOF RB and WR, and what is generally thought of as the greatest offensive line of all time, but by no means at all does that mean the Pats don't have a bunch of great players and coaches. If you need more proof, go to a Pats game at Gillette Stadium and see how many jerseys of each player are worn. You will see there is a great variety.

In 2004 the fins were 4-12 but one of our four wins was against the Pats, who BTW went on to win the SB that year. Division rival games are a wash. Stop looking for excuses to trash Culpepper. Brady has never put up the kind of numbers Culpepper has. But since the Pats as a TEAM won three SB in 4 years Brady is given all the credit even though he didn' do all the work. It's amazing that Brady gets are the credit for winning and Culpepper gets all the blame for losing, even though Brady didn't win the SB alone and Culpepper didn't lose all his games alone.

Pat fans want to say the Fin fans are jealous over the Pats success, but you don't see fin fans disrepecting or trashing the Pats most fin fans here believe the Pats will still be a tough team in the division, but you see one hell of a lot of Pat fans trashing and disrespecting the Dolphins. Seems like every day I read on here a Pats fan trashing Culpepper or the Fins D or the coaching., but none of the fin fans here are trashing the Pats. We simply believe we have improved enough to take the division or at least compete for it and you arrogant Pat fans think god himself has declared the Pats the only keeper to the division title. Seems to me the spoiled brat Pat fans don't want to share....ahhh too bad.