T.J. Moe thread

[Kontradiction]

Really, I don't think we need a 3rd-string slot receiver. We're fine at that position, we need outside threats. Wouldn't mind him on practice squad since one of our other slot guys is sure to hurt himself, but not on the 53-man roster.

There's not much behind Amendola if he gets injured. Edelman is capable, but they typically line him up outside. IMO, the team could use another slot receiver. If Moe makes the team, he's earned it.

 

[mgteich]

The team typically lines up Edelman outside when Welker was healthy. IMHO, Edelman is Amendola's backup.

There's not much behind Amendola if he gets injured. Edelman is capable, but they typically line him up outside. IMO, the team could use another slot receiver. If Moe makes the team, he's earned it.

 

[TruthSeeker]

Neither Gronk nor Hernandez are likely to miss the start of the season. At this point, neither are likely to miss the start of training camp.

I disagree, I think Gronk and Hernandez both wind up on the unable to perform list (the one where you can come off of it during the preseason ).Would not be shocked if they don't play a minute of football until possibly the 3rd preseason game and then don't play game 4.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

The Blitz with Jeff Howe & Karen Guregian | Boston Herald

Moe got the largest bonus of any Pats UDFA this year; he got $8K in signing bonus (remember teams are limited to $75K total on UDFAs, and $25K per player), and $22,500 guaranteed salary.

This is not, of course, proof that he will make the roster, but it is proof that the Patriots had significant interest.

 

[mgteich]

It is proof that other teams had significant interest.

Moe and Fisher are set up as our top UDFA's (along with the punter). Perhaps they will be the Practice Squad players who will get more than minimum Practice Squad pay.

The Blitz with Jeff Howe & Karen Guregian | Boston Herald

Moe got the largest bonus of any Pats UDFA this year; he got $8K in signing bonus (remember teams are limited to $75K total on UDFAs, and $25K per player), and $22,500 guaranteed salary.

This is not, of course, proof that he will make the roster, but it is proof that the Patriots had significant interest.

 

[Rob0729]

I disagree, I think Gronk and Hernandez both wind up on the unable to perform list (the one where you can come off of it during the preseason ).Would not be shocked if they don't play a minute of football until possibly the 3rd preseason game and then don't play game 4.

There is a chance neither start training camp on the active roster, but it isn't likely at this point. It depends on where they are in their recovery and what Belichick decides is best for the team in terms of giving others a shot while they rest.

For all we know, Gronk's infection could have cleared the doctors decided against another surgery and the recovery time for Hernandez's recovery was the unlikely worst case scenario.

 

[mgteich]

Why does it matter if Gronk and Hernandez get lots of camp reps? I certainly don't want them on the field until after the 2 a days. They need recovery time more than extra reps.

 

[Rob0729]

Why does it matter if Gronk and Hernandez get lots of camp reps? I certainly don't want them on the field until after the 2 a days. They need recovery time more than extra reps.

I agree that if there is a lingering affect from their injuries rest them. But I wouldn't if they are 100%, especially Gronk. Gronk hasn't played meaningful football since mid-November of last year. He needs time to get back into football shape.

If I remember correctly Welker only spent 3 days on the PUP returning from his ACL (camp started July 29th and he was activated August 1st) and Brady never went on PUP from his injury. If they both can come back that quickly, no reason to believe either Gronk or Hernandez can't.

And two a days in the NFL are a joke now. The new CBA states that two a days can't be two padded practices and one of the practices has to be a walk through. I don't think missing two a days is anything like it used to be.

 

[mgteich]

I generally agree.

However, Welker's recovery was exceptional and he was a much different player. Gronkowski is much, much more prone to injury than Welker was.

I agree that if there is a lingering affect from their injuries rest them. But I wouldn't if they are 100%, especially Gronk. Gronk hasn't played meaningful football since mid-November of last year. He needs time to get back into football shape.

If I remember correctly Welker only spent 3 days on the PUP returning from his ACL (camp started July 29th and he was activated August 1st) and Brady never went on PUP from his injury. If they both can come back that quickly, no reason to believe either Gronk or Hernandez can't.

And two a days in the NFL are a joke now. The new CBA states that two a days can't be two padded practices and one of the practices has to be a walk through. I don't think missing two a days is anything like it used to be.

 

[Jimke]

The Blitz with Jeff Howe & Karen Guregian | Boston Herald

Moe got the largest bonus of any Pats UDFA this year; he got $8K in signing bonus (remember teams are limited to $75K total on UDFAs, and $25K per player), and $22,500 guaranteed salary.

This is not, of course, proof that he will make the roster, but it is proof that the Patriots had significant interest.

If you combine your remark on Moe with the fact that Edelman was signed
for cheap and it might mean something.

 

[lurker1965]

So, who is the Larry that Gronk says, "Moe, Larry, Cheese!" to?

 

[lurker1965]

I'd hate to see him make the roster over guys that we drafted and signed to bigger contracts. That would just show, once again, that we don't know how to evaluate the WR position. Why have scouts then. Just sign as many undrafted receivers as we can and hope one of them sticks.

I would rather have a team where the coaches only looked at what happened on the field than one where they considered draft position and/or contracts.

 

[Rob0729]

I generally agree.

However, Welker's recovery was exceptional and he was a much different player. Gronkowski is much, much more prone to injury than Welker was.

I wouldn't say Gronk is much, much more prone to injury than Welker. Gronk played 2 2/3 seasons straight in a three year NFL career without missing a game. People are turning Gronk into an injury prone player where there is little evidence of it.

 

[Pats0204]

And I will say it. There is exactly ZERO chance that the patriots have 3 rookie WR's on the roster.

OK, well, I guess we can revisit this thread in a little less than 4 mos. and see who was right.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

How would it?

It would show good scouting to find an undrafted WR who came in and was a system fit.

Not to mention it was quite a surprise that he didn't get drafted anyway.

what it would show is a recognition that talent evaluation has an element of the unexpected. Quite a big element actually. And the Pats' model seems to be having more dice to roll, rather than claiming to have secret perfect knowledge of sure things.

If you draft a guy and you assign him a ridiculously high probability of success -- let us say 90% -- and you assign your UDFA a 10% probability of success, it is therefore a good move to go after the UDFA you have your eye on, and if he out-competes the draft pick, put him on the roster.

A good idea, not a bad one. Because you did not assign anybody a 100% chance of success.

That's reserved for the prospect who succeeds.

 

[FredFromDartmouth]

Really, I don't think we need a 3rd-string slot receiver. We're fine at that position, we need outside threats. Wouldn't mind him on practice squad since one of our other slot guys is sure to hurt himself, but not on the 53-man roster.

Ah...yes we do. Remember the slots get hammered. Welker was amazingly durable in the face of such hits but we cannot expect everyone else to be. We need depth in the slot. I am rooting for Moe and I think he has a good chance of making the roster.

 

[patriot lifer]

OK, well, I guess we can revisit this thread in a little less than 4 mos. and see who was right.

I wouldn't be surprised if they kept only 4 true WR's (excludes Slater). They don't have a ton of talent at the WR position, and they have more depth at other positions. They don't seem to emphasize WR as an offense, but rather TE, the running game, and slot guys. There is less of a need to have wide receivers. That being said, could still be 5 come the final cuts.

This leads to less of a chance of keeping more than 2 rookie WR's. Amendola and Edelman are likely on the team. Then add 2 more.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

IF I'm BB, I don't cut Moe -- if I can possibly trade him. Or maybe 1 WR will go on NON-season ending IR and Moe sticks. Will be fascinating to watch.

If I'm Moe, I work my tail off from now through August in an effort to make one of the other WRs expendable.

 

[supafly]

If I'm Moe, I work my tail off from now through August in an effort to make one of the other WRs expendable.

Absolutely. There are many aspects to whether or not these WRs stick from now until the end of August, so this is a battle that will be decided by the ability to learn the playbook and nuances of the offense, along with talent and production on the practice/preseason field.

Of course the common sense approach would be to try and stash him on the PS, but apparently there is interest by other clubs that may only increase as camp begins and wears on. On top of that he may outright prove himself to be worthy of a spot on the 53 man roster (I tend to believe that Jenkins is nothing more than camp fodder as it is, and that there are 4/6 WR spots taken up if you include Slater).

 

[strngplyr]

I generally agree.

However, Welker's recovery was exceptional and he was a much different player. Gronkowski is much, much more prone to injury than Welker was.

And had Welker's injury happened in week 1 or week 4 instead of week 17 we'd be saying he had a bum knee and missed 15 games because of it.

Gronk is now injury prone because his injury occured in week 10 or whenever instead of week 17.

Welker also missed 2 games in 2009 and another game in 2010, all 3 of which we knee injuries I believe, none of them related to the ACL injury he suffered in week 17 of 2009.

Why isn't Welker injury prone? He seems to have a history of knee problems, or at least that is how this board would normally categorize things like this.