More Rumours of Moss to Pats

[italia44]

This isn't Fantasy Football,Folks.

Why would Oakland make this deal?

IMO ,they would want our 2 #1's plus someone like Asante Samuel or a #1 plus Chad Jackson as a future receiver.

Also,the cap acceleration for Moss,this year would be HUGE.

Why would the Pats mortgage their future for this guy,that 17 teams passed on in the draft.

It makes no sense........only Mike Ditka and the Vikings have ever made,mortgage your future deals like this.We all know how THOSE,worked out.

We're 4 and 1 and on the rise....no time to be stupid!

Why do you think Pittsburgh isn't involed in this charade?
They're desperate for a game-changing receiver,yet,they'd NEVER trade their future for this undisciplined BOZO.

That's why New England and Pittsburgh are CHAMPIONS and the rest are just PRETENDERS.

 

[mosi]

I doubt we will use our 1st for moss. Next years draft has some great receivers - can you say Rhema McKnight or Jeff Samardzija?

 

[mgcolby]

I doubt we will use our 1st for moss. Next years draft has some great receivers - can you say Rhema McKnight or Jeff Samardzija?

My pipe dream is that they trade up and snag Charles Johnson. That guy is amazing and he has a great attitude.

 

[maverick4]

I doubt we will use our 1st for moss. Next years draft has some great receivers - can you say Rhema McKnight or Jeff Samardzija?

We don't need another receiver. Next year, the trio of Chad Jackson, Doug Gabriel, and Reche Caldwell will be a very strong group.

If we can get Moss for a 3rd, then I may be willing to take on his salary for two years. If not, then no big deal.

As for the draft, we don't need a WR, as previously mentioned. We need to go defense - LB, CB, S.

.

 

[TomBrady'sGoat]

I like the belief that Moss would redo his contract for the Pats. He is owed $10M each of the next two years. He either collects it (losing isn't so rough when you're making $10M) or gets released, at which time he could get more money that the Pats would offer from another good team.

Besides that Moss has never once done anything to lead us to believe that he'd take less money to win.

 

[tombonneau]

I guess I'm not too shocked by the overhwhelming # of people who are anti-Moss on this board. Most folks seem to have some naive illusion that the Pats are a veritable Mormon Tabernacle Choir when it comes to the clubhouse.

Moss-haters, pls do me a favor and produce one quote attributable to the Raiders organization--player, coach, member of staff--that talks about Randy's poor attitude and how is a lockeroom cancer.

You won't find any. He was vote--by his teammates--as a team captain.

His ex-coach Mike Tice now with Jax has been lobbying heavily for the team to trade for Moss--and this is a team that is doesn't really need WR help.

Ty Law said far far more detrimental thing re: the Pats organization and could have been perceived as a far worse influence/cancer during his holdout, yet BB accepted him with open arms back into the fold.

That's because he wants to win. And he knows what it takes to win. If BB thinks it takes a player like Moss to win, and the price is right, he will pull the trigger.

Most of Moss' most egregious transgressions occured much earlier in his career. The past 2-3 yrs he has been a more than acceptable team member. Even his "complaining" in the media re: Raiders is hardly that bad when taken in its full context. Considering he is playing for by far the worst organization in the NFL, I'm sure he could be saying things far far worse.

If the Pats trade a 1st for Moss, the entire league would groan. Because we would not only be a favorite to win the SB, but this year and the year after.

 

[Keegs]

Are they interested in Asante?

 

[rookBoston]

Yup, count me into the camp that thinks this isn't as ridiculous as it sounds.

Honestly, I dont think Moss is a clubhouse cancer. I've been impressed by what Gabriel has to say about him, and what Moss had to say about Gabriel, too. Shows a lot of professionalism.

As for his work ethic, no one is that good, that consistently on sheer talent alone. He's kept himself clean, he's professional, he obviously cares about winning and leading, or he wouldn't have said a word about the Raiders, about Gabriel's trade to the Pats... he'd have just cashed his paycheck and kept his head down.

I think BB would give up the Pats 1st rounder for Moss. The question is whether that would be enough. Doubt it. I wouldn't do it if I had Moss under contract.

Then, the other question is about cap space. Actually, I find that for the right player BB is more than willing to commit the money. Rosey got a nice deal. Brady did well. But those are players that BB feels are unique at their positions.

Comparing Moss and Branch is not an unreasonable thing. Personally, I think it would be reasonable to offer Moss more than Branch, in terms of what they can do for a team. Both are great, but only one of the two have the makings of a HOF talent.

The question is how deep does BB respect Moss's play and professionalism. Ty Law is no angel, and publicly skewered BB to the media-- that type of stuff doesn't come into BB's consideration.

It's all about productivity and chemistry. For the former, Moss is among the 5 best in the NFL. For the latter, some would question Moss, but I think he may truly be misunderstood, based on his history with the Vikes. But we've seen that the issues with that franchise run way deeper than Randy Moss.

So, I think the limiting constraints are:
(1) Would Oakland settle for a single 1st rounder?
(2) Does BB see Moss as being worth $11M in 2009, or would he need a renegotiated contract? And if BB wants to renegotiate, is Moss willing to do it?

Honestly, I could see it happening. Maybe not likely, but possible.

And if it did happen, barring a catastrophe in our secondary, I think we'd be favored to win the SB... and that's all that counts.

 

[amazinPats]

I would prefer that the Pats look to get Porter as he has enough ability to push us into championship caliber; and he wouldn't break the bank in terms of salary or trade compensation. We could likely get him for a third or fourth rounder.

On the other hand, I would be happy to get Moss as long as we don't give up much beyond one first rounder. I would assume that his contract could be reworked into something manageable.

As for those who believe that just because the media has got hold of this story then it's an indication that it won't happen, I remind you that the media was full of Ty Law-to-the-Patriots stories. In the end, he didn't go to the Pats, but BB and company certainly pursued him and made him a serious offer. I believe the team is looking at both Porter and Moss and are likely working out the ramifications of obtaining either of them. It may or may not work out.

I'd be happy with either of them. It would make the team a serious Super Bowl threat.

 

[amazinPats]

So, I think the limiting constraints are:
(1) Would Oakland settle for a single 1st rounder?
(2) Does BB see Moss as being worth $11M in 2009, or would he need a renegotiated contract? And if BB wants to renegotiate, is Moss willing to do it?

I think Oakland is realizing that they have to clean up shop. They've already let go Gabriel for a cheap price, and he wasn't a cancer in the locker room. I believe the Raiders would accept a first rounder plus maybe a second day pick.

I also think that the Pats could renegotiate the contract. If Moss wants out badly enough, he'd go along with it.

We've got a huge edge over the Steelers on acquiring Moss, as they don't have as much cap room. Miami would love to have him, but they're strapped badly with their cap space.

I do believe there are likely some serious discussions going on between the Pats and Oakland right now. I also believe the Pats are likely exploring other options with other teams. We've got a bye week and the trade deadline is Tuesday. There is actually a lot of time to be exploring deals. We've also got an open slot on the roster. I think it's there because the team is seriously exploring some options. Maybe they're also looking at picking up Troy Vincent. Either way, there might be some juicy news ahead for us over the next few days...

 

[broadwayjoe]

One thing I'm not worried about is the Pats front office giving up to much for a Randy Moss he will either come to the Pats on their terms or not at all but it makes you wonder what Piolo said in that meeting he had with Tom Brady.
I do know one thing we have a pretty good young Quarterback that is a team player and its time to get him some weapons and can you just imagine a so called shut down corner having to face Randy Moss on the Pats our other receivers would be so wide open we would rival the Colts on offense.

 

[fgssand]

Yup, count me into the camp that thinks this isn't as ridiculous as it sounds.

Honestly, I dont think Moss is a clubhouse cancer. I've been impressed by what Gabriel has to say about him, and what Moss had to say about Gabriel, too. Shows a lot of professionalism.

As for his work ethic, no one is that good, that consistently on sheer talent alone. He's kept himself clean, he's professional, he obviously cares about winning and leading, or he wouldn't have said a word about the Raiders, about Gabriel's trade to the Pats... he'd have just cashed his paycheck and kept his head down.

I think BB would give up the Pats 1st rounder for Moss. The question is whether that would be enough. Doubt it. I wouldn't do it if I had Moss under contract.

Then, the other question is about cap space. Actually, I find that for the right player BB is more than willing to commit the money. Rosey got a nice deal. Brady did well. But those are players that BB feels are unique at their positions.

Comparing Moss and Branch is not an unreasonable thing. Personally, I think it would be reasonable to offer Moss more than Branch, in terms of what they can do for a team. Both are great, but only one of the two have the makings of a HOF talent.

The question is how deep does BB respect Moss's play and professionalism. Ty Law is no angel, and publicly skewered BB to the media-- that type of stuff doesn't come into BB's consideration.

It's all about productivity and chemistry. For the former, Moss is among the 5 best in the NFL. For the latter, some would question Moss, but I think he may truly be misunderstood, based on his history with the Vikes. But we've seen that the issues with that franchise run way deeper than Randy Moss.

So, I think the limiting constraints are:
(1) Would Oakland settle for a single 1st rounder?
(2) Does BB see Moss as being worth $11M in 2009, or would he need a renegotiated contract? And if BB wants to renegotiate, is Moss willing to do it?

Honestly, I could see it happening. Maybe not likely, but possible.

And if it did happen, barring a catastrophe in our secondary, I think we'd be favored to win the SB... and that's all that counts.

Rook - great analysis as usual, I find very little to challenge except for maybe your saying Deion Branch & Randy Moss are both great - Deion Branch is good, very good, but NOT great. Randy Moss is great and with some crowning achievements to round out his career, he could be Hall of Fame material.

Your two main points are dead nuts on.....

Will we be able to make offers to Oakland that they find acceptable and most important, can we afford Randy Moss? Maybe it is better stated in asking if he will accept offers which would simply be the value that the Patriots determine he is worth for our club?

I am afraid it is the latter that would not happen - while we would offer him very decent money, I don't think he will "settle". Were he to do so it would eliminate any question in my mind as to his motivation to win championships.

 

[HEY BRO! WHAT UP?]

Seattle gave NE a first round pick because they thought Deion was the difference in getting them to the Super Bowl. In my opinion, Moss would offer NE the same thing. I dont think anyone can argue that Moss makes this offense a much more explosive unit. In the end, I'd take a Branch for Moss trade any day of the week.

I'm with you brother! I say we make the trade and I bet Tom Brady would wet his pants with the prospect of Moss being his #1 target. I'm sure Brady has even lobbied the Pats organization to at least look into Moss. I doubt the Pats do it, but if they did, everyone would jump on the Pats to win the Superbowl bandwagon.

 

[HEY BRO! WHAT UP?]

Some of you guys got to cut the crap, If you woke up monday morning and saw Reiss reporting that the Patriots aquired Randy Moss, you would all be crapping your pants in excitement, and the rest of the league would be crapping their pants.

Damn straight! You hit it on the head. As much as we may say "I wouldn't put him on my team" if Reiss reported Pats acquire Moss, Owens or Chad Johnson, we would praise the organization. I hope Moss gets traded to the Pats. It would really put this offense over the hump. Not only would it open up the ground game even more, it would free up weapons such as Watson, Graham and Chad Jackson. Would you care about football when you play for the Oakland Raiders? It's a ****hole down there and Moss has nothing to play for. Look at his stats when he was winning in Minnesota, you never heard anything bad about him. When the Vikings started to struggle, that's when you heard about him running over the police officer, mooning the crowd, and leaving the field early.

 

[LasVegasPatsFan]

If we pick up Moss, our passing game will be unstopable. Moss's presence generates double coverages and will free up other receivers. I believe if he is signed, we have a far better chance at the big dance in Miami. Like it or not. As I said earlier and it was mentioned in the SI article...maybe he just wants to be on a winning team and willing to take a pay cut. He has been paid very well in the past and he is getting older so a SB ring is what may light a fire under his _$$. He is the real deal with the right QB. My only concern is Brady. He hasn't show real accuracy in his long passing game. Moss has the ability to out jump his defenders and even attack the ball whether it is off target. Hopefully we can land him for a good deal, if so, pack your bags for Miami. Lets think about this for a second.... Chad Jackson, Doug Gabriel, Randy Moss, Ben Watson, Daniel Graham, Reche Caldwell, Troy Brown, Jabar Gafferty, Deion WHO? That is some real threat!

 

[amazinPats]

Here's another sign that the Pats are looking at trade possibilities in general: they've signed Koppen to an extension, but according to the media, neither Graham nor Samuel have been approached regarding extensions.

I believe they are waiting for the trade deadline to be over before they tackle either of those issues. They might be fishing for a trade. If one doesn't go through then they can start working on Graham and Samuel extensions.

 

[Keegs]

Here's another sign that the Pats are looking at trade possibilities in general: they've signed Koppen to an extension, but according to the media, neither Graham nor Samuel have been approached regarding extensions.

I believe they are waiting for the trade deadline to be over before they tackle either of those issues. They might be fishing for a trade. If one doesn't go through then they can start working on Graham and Samuel extensions.

you are right.
and do you wanna know why?
its cuz the pats are trading Samuel for Moss.

You heard it here first.
Well actually you heard it in the other thread first but that's besides the point.
Wait and see, wait and see.
then they are gonna trade Graham for Jerry Porter and a 4th rounder.

 

[brady2brown]

WRT to Moss taking plays off, it seems to me he's doing that when the play doesn't call for him to get the ball. In the Pats passing offense, with Brady being the best quarterback in the world at checking down a progression, there is ALWAYS the chance for Moss to get the ball. Except on running plays of course.

On a play where you are not designed to get the ball, the defense doesn't know that and must cover you. Unless of course you take the play off, in which case the defense can concentrate on the other receivers.

No excuse for not running your route. Plays are designed to look a certain way to the defense, to make them react a certain way. It doesn't work if everyone doesn't do their job.

 

[mgcolby]

On a play where you are not designed to get the ball, the defense doesn't know that and must cover you. Unless of course you take the play off, in which case the defense can concentrate on the other receivers.

No excuse for not running your route. Plays are designed to look a certain way to the defense, to make them react a certain way. It doesn't work if everyone doesn't do their job.

You completely missed the point. When he played with Culpepper he knew (based on the coverage) if he was getting the ball or not, before the snap. With Brady the person who is open will get the ball. On running plays or screens he would know he needs to block and he is one of the best blocking WR's in the game, that fact is hardly ever mentioned.

 

[Seneschal2]

BB on Moss:

Bill Belichick Press Conf. Transcript - 11/20/2002

Q: Obviously Randy Moss is a big, athletic receiver. Do you need extra help with a guy like him?


BB: Yeah, I think probably everybody in the league and everybody that has played him, has doubled him. It’s just a question of how much. I don’t think you go into the game not doubling him, it’s a question of whether you double him every time or 25 percent of the time or 50 percent of the time or 100 percent of the time. It just comes into degrees. Randy is the type of guy that they give you problems with because he’s not in the same place very often. They move him around a lot. It’s easy to sit here and say, ‘Well we’ll double him,’ but sometimes he’s at ‘x’, sometimes he’s at ‘z’, sometimes he’s in the slot, sometimes he lines up in the backfield, they put him in motion and they run him from one side to another. Doubling him is a lot easier said than done. If they would just put him in one spot, you could probably double him on just about every play and then work everything else around it. They way they move him around so much, it’s hard to double him without it affecting a lot of other guys. Then you get into a lot of different combinations. So that’s kind of what we’re dealing with. I’m sure we’ll double him like everybody else in the league has doubled him. It’s just a question of how much you can do it and what opportunities you will have to do it based on some of the formation-ing.


Q: How good is he?


BB: He’s pretty good. He’s big. He’s fast. He’s got great ball skills. He makes a lot of catches that a lot of receivers wouldn’t be able to make. Not just because of his size, but because of his hand-eye coordination. He makes plays where he’ll reach up and tip the ball away from the defensive back, tip it over to maybe away from the guy to the other side of him where he can make the play and make it look like a routine catch. He’s got great skills there. I think he has got speed and quickness too, so when he gets up on the defender, he’s not only got the speed to run by him, but he’s got the quickness to laterally separate from him. There’s not a lot of things that he can’t do in terms of running routes and catching the ball and taking a short pass and turn it into a long run. They’ve used him on returns and he’s got good run skills.

---

In a heartbeat.