Manning to the Jets?

[fair catch fryar]

Yeah...well..Crist Carter is a little ******ed so that's that.

You insult mentally-challenged people the world over with this insult........



........not exactly by using the word "******" but by implying that he is as smart as them.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Agree with all your points. Regarding his recovery, I guess that's just a chance I think the Colts might be willing to take. It's the same risk they would be taking if they get rid of Manning and take their chances on an unproven kid. Do you risk the chance of losing a healthy Manning, which will give your fanbase hope and maybe even another title run for the next 3-4 years, for a kid who is unproven and will probably set your franchise back in rebuilding mode for a couple of years?

As you said, legacy matters here and is a BIG factor. Irsay respects Manning enough to the point that it was Manning who came up with the structure of his most recent contract. To Manning's credit, he gave the Colts an "out clause" on his contract because of his nagging injury. Both sides have showed respect, and I think respect will be shown by the Colts organization in regards to what Manning's future will be.

I can't see them dumping Manning to the Jets or anywhere else.

I'd go in the opposite direction and say that the last couple of years have made it fairly obvious that the Colts just don't have much talent, and therefore they're not winning a SB anytime soon, with or without Manning. Which should make it all the easier to turn the page, turn Manning into some much-needed picks, blow the whole thing up, and move on. If you're going that route, it never hurts to have the best QB prospect since Peyton Manning as the centerpiece of your rebuilding project. The Luck hype alone should be enough to keep the fans engaged through a couple of basement-dwelling seasons, if necessary. The Colts went 3-13 in 1997 (enabling them to draft Manning) and then 3-13 again in 1998, so it's not like this is uncharted territory for them.

 

[TheTruth3402]

I'd go in the opposite direction and say that the last couple of years have made it fairly obvious that the Colts just don't have much talent, and therefore they're not winning a SB anytime soon, with or without Manning. Which should make it all the easier to turn the page, turn Manning into some much-needed picks, blow the whole thing up, and move on. If you're going that route, it never hurts to have the best QB prospect since Peyton Manning as the centerpiece of your rebuilding project. The Luck hype alone should be enough to keep the fans engaged through a couple of basement-dwelling seasons, if necessary. The Colts went 3-13 in 1997 (enabling them to draft Manning) and then 3-13 again in 1998, so it's not like this is uncharted territory for them.

I'm sorry but no team would be crazy enough to trade a bunch of picks AND take on that ludicrous contract.

The Colts will be forced to cut him.

 

[BradyFTW!]

I'm sorry but no team would be crazy enough to trade a bunch of picks AND take on that ludicrous contract.

The Colts will be forced to cut him.

This past offseason, Kevin Kolb was a valuable trade asset, and he has done exactly nothing in the NFL. Carson Palmer just netted the Bengals two first rounders. Manning's contract will diminish his worth greatly, for sure, but I wouldn't be at all surprised if someone is still willing to give up something for him.

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

This past offseason, Kevin Kolb was a valuable trade asset, and he has done exactly nothing in the NFL. Carson Palmer just netted the Bengals two first rounders. Manning's contract will diminish his worth greatly, for sure, but I wouldn't be at all surprised if someone is still willing to give up something for him.

San Fransisco- needs new stadium
Dallas- Jerry Jones
Jets- Need to pay for $1 billion+ stadium
Baltimore- Flacco? Joe Flacco?
Washington- Well....Shanahan and Snyder

Teams in win now mode need to prioritize short over long.

Just ask Jimmy Johnson or Mike Ditka about stupid trades.

 

[Brady_to_Moss]

God would i hate to see that....


Too bad i have a better chance of hitting 300 mill tonight at foxwoods however

 

[TheTruth3402]

This past offseason, Kevin Kolb was a valuable trade asset, and he has done exactly nothing in the NFL. Carson Palmer just netted the Bengals two first rounders. Manning's contract will diminish his worth greatly, for sure, but I wouldn't be at all surprised if someone is still willing to give up something for him.

Teams certainly throw logic to the wind in situations involving talented QBs, no doubt.

But you have to consider the significant probability that he never takes another snap in his career.

If I were a GM, that would make me look at him in a completely different way then a guy like Kolb or even Carson Palmer. While Palmer has had one elbow surgery Manning has been operated on many times, and he is older. His situation presents a risk too great to take that big a roll of the dice. Neither the Cardinals nor the Raiders have mortgaged their future, but to tie up so much money and so many assets in Manning would certainly do so.

Perhaps I'm a bit biased though, as I disagreed with both trades after they went down. I may overestimate the amount of thinking that precedes these moves.

 

[condon84]

I'd go in the opposite direction and say that the last couple of years have made it fairly obvious that the Colts just don't have much talent, and therefore they're not winning a SB anytime soon, with or without Manning. Which should make it all the easier to turn the page, turn Manning into some much-needed picks, blow the whole thing up, and move on. If you're going that route, it never hurts to have the best QB prospect since Peyton Manning as the centerpiece of your rebuilding project. The Luck hype alone should be enough to keep the fans engaged through a couple of basement-dwelling seasons, if necessary. The Colts went 3-13 in 1997 (enabling them to draft Manning) and then 3-13 again in 1998, so it's not like this is uncharted territory for them.

They essentially have the same components that they had when they went to the SB two years ago. It's not a question of how much talent they have, it's a question of "if Manning is healthy, can their offense win them games like they did in the past." They still have Clarke, Wayne, Garcon, Addai and Tamme. Their defense is built on the principle that other offenses will have to throw the ball to keep up with the Colts offense. Mathis and Freeney can be a bigger factor once their offense becomes elite again. And if Manning does come back healthy, there's no reason why their offense can't be elite again.

I also disagree about how easy it should be to turn the page because of the team's perceived lack of talent situation. Manning is an icon over there. Getting rid of him isn't going to be easy no matter what situation the team is in.

I can see them getting rid of their entire coaching staff before they get rid of Manning. That staff is a complete joke. How they haven't won a single game with the talent still on that team is a travesty. I imagine if Belichick and his staff were coaching that team they'd have a few wins under their belts already. Hell, any coaching staff would be an improvement over what they have over there. Harbaugh and his staff over in San Fran is a clear example of what a competent coaching staff can do to a team once they have direction.

 

[PatsFanSince74]

Another reason Peyton won't be going to the Jets is that the transaction would require Woody "Is the Ball filled with Feathers?" Johnson to admit that he and Tannenbaum had made a mistake in betting the farm on the Sanchize. If he does that, he has to fire Tannenbaum and I don't think he'd be ready to do anything like that.

Given their miserable history, Johnson will need at least two more seasons before he's ready to pull the plug on the Ryan/Sanchez era/error.

 

[Fball]

Unless something crazy happens and the Colts do NOT get the #1 pick, Manning will be playing somewhere else next year. Luck is not going to sit, and no team is going to pay both Luck & Manning w/ one sitting.

Both the Jets & Phins are possible destinations for Manning. It would be easier for the Phins. But, the Jets - if determined - could find a way to make it happen. And if so, they would be instant SB contenders (they have a good team, anyway - probably better than any team Manning has been on). Their weak link is Sanchez; an elite QB, even one who is past his peak, would be huge for them.

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

Another reason Peyton won't be going to the Jets is that the transaction would require Woody "Is the Ball filled with Feathers?" Johnson to admit that he and Tannenbaum had made a mistake in betting the farm on the Sanchize. If he does that, he has to fire Tannenbaum and I don't think he'd be ready to do anything like that.

Given their miserable history, Johnson will need at least two more seasons before he's ready to pull the plug on the Ryan/Sanchez era/error.

Ahhh, no they don't and nobody would care.

Was Manning on the market two years ago?

The reality is that if you are presented with a chance to upgrade your roster, you do it. Do you really think their fanbase would give a rat's rear about a "bust" if a healthy Manning showed up next year?

They want a Lombardi. Sanchize might net a few 8th rounds picks to backfill.

Getting Manning and dumping Sanchize in no way says you made a mistake. Not getting a healthy Manning if feasible would spark mass riots.

Kinda like the "go ugly early but don't be afraid to trade up" concept.

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

Teams certainly throw logic to the wind in situations involving talented QBs, no doubt.

But you have to consider the significant probability that he never takes another snap in his career.

If I were a GM, that would make me look at him in a completely different way then a guy like Kolb or even Carson Palmer. While Palmer has had one elbow surgery Manning has been operated on many times, and he is older. His situation presents a risk too great to take that big a roll of the dice. Neither the Cardinals nor the Raiders have mortgaged their future, but to tie up so much money and so many assets in Manning would certainly do so.

Perhaps I'm a bit biased though, as I disagreed with both trades after they went down. I may overestimate the amount of thinking that precedes these moves.

None of this is true if you are in "WIN NOW" mode.

If there is one piece separating you from a Lombardi, you go get it.

Also, what's up with the contract stuff.

If this were to happen, it would be because Manning wants another Lombardi and it ain't happin' in Indy.

A trade to a contender would include a new contract to help ensure pieces to make it happen.

 

[TheTruth3402]

None of this is true if you are in "WIN NOW" mode.

If there is one piece separating you from a Lombardi, you go get it.

Also, what's up with the contract stuff.

If this were to happen, it would be because Manning wants another Lombardi and it ain't happin' in Indy.

A trade to a contender would include a new contract to help ensure pieces to make it happen.

Maybe you didn't hear about this?

You can't just rip this up and draft a new deal, as far as I am aware. You trade for both player and contract.

Given that some of this is bonus money, I'm sure that the Colts are partly on the hook. But still, 5 years at 90 mil! This includes $53M over the next 2 years ($16M this season). Cutting him past the date allowed in his contract would result in about a $22M hit, I believe. So there are major cap ramifications.

With the risk Manning poses I don't see why any team would be willing to take this deal on. I have a hard time being sold on this win now argument you present considering failure would likely result in about 2-3 years of irrelevance while cap space and draft picks are replenished.

When I think of win now, I think of taking a gamble for one season but still being in position to move on the next year. Not sacrificing two or even three full seasons.

 

[part-timer]

Does anyone on this board seriously think that IF and I say IF Indy trades off Manning, they would do so within the AFC? What a joke. Plus if Indy got Luck, Do you think they start him imediately or possibly keep Manning till Luck was ready. All such mindless dribble.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

Rather than these X-Files MLB trade pure speculation let's see if we can get a leading indicator on some possible outcomes. If Manning is able and plays a game or 2 in Dec, Indy will have a better idea of which option they will pursue. If he's able to play at a Manning level, he looks viable for next season and they can trade the #1 for a bunch of top picks rebuilding the franchise. Maybe even draft a QB with an extra 2013 1st round pick. If he looks immobile, the Colts just might decide NOT to pick up his option $$$. It's a huge business decision and a ~ billion dollar franchise needs all the information it can get in that case.

 

[TheTruth3402]

Does anyone on this board seriously think that IF and I say IF Indy trades off Manning, they would do so within the AFC? What a joke. Plus if Indy got Luck, Do you think they start him imediately or possibly keep Manning till Luck was ready. All such mindless dribble.

Its about being able to completely rebuild that roster. Some believe that they have a lot of the necessary pieces to be relevant right now, but I don't. They need major help on their offensive line, and, outside of Freeney, Mathis, Brackett (old), Bethea and maybe a few young guys that entire defense is garbage.

This rebuilding process is extremely constrained when you have $21.5M tied into one player just for next year.

So I say trade him, cut him, do what you gotta do. Either way that roster needs some serious draft picks and/or free agent additions.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Maybe you didn't hear about this?

You can't just rip this up and draft a new deal, as far as I am aware. You trade for both player and contract.

Yes and no.

The problem is not that it CAN'T be renegotiated, merely that I don't think Manning WOULD.

 

[PatsFanSince74]

Ahhh, no they don't and nobody would care.

Was Manning on the market two years ago?

The reality is that if you are presented with a chance to upgrade your roster, you do it. Do you really think their fanbase would give a rat's rear about a "bust" if a healthy Manning showed up next year?

They want a Lombardi. Sanchize might net a few 8th rounds picks to backfill.

Getting Manning and dumping Sanchize in no way says you made a mistake. Not getting a healthy Manning if feasible would spark mass riots.

Kinda like the "go ugly early but don't be afraid to trade up" concept.

It might come from living in Manhattan for 20 years and reading the NY papers including the tabloids everyday, but I think I'll stick to my guns on this one. This would just be too much of an admission of error for Woody Johnson to make. Anyway, if I'm proven wrong, I'll be the first to take my lumps out here.

Plus, another poster has made the point that it's highly unlikely that Irsay would trade him in the conference.

 

[PatsFanSince74]

Does anyone on this board seriously think that IF and I say IF Indy trades off Manning, they would do so within the AFC? What a joke. Plus if Indy got Luck, Do you think they start him imediately or possibly keep Manning till Luck was ready. All such mindless dribble.

Yes, that's some clear thinking. If they traded him, they wouldn't put him in the Conference, where he'd stand between the Colts and an SB. They'd have to find an NFC team that was hungry enough for an SB to gamble on Manning and his contract.

Until they guaranteed Vick 40 big ones in August, I'd have put the Eagles at the top of that list. Tony Romo has cap hits of 11 and 13 mm in 2012/13, so that probably rules out the cowboys. The Redskins would probably be in a position to take him and it would certainly appeal to Dan Snyder's sense of theater and give Shanahan his shot at a third ring. I'd put my money there.

 

[part-timer]

"If we are facing in the right direction, all we have to do is keep on walking." (Buddhist Proverb)

"It is the responsibility of intellectuals to speak the truth and expose the lies"